Anyone re-radius a fretboard?

[beltjones]

I have a modern construction 10"-16" neck that I'm thinking about re-radiusing to 7.25". Warmoth doesn't offer this radius with their modern construction necks - anyone know why?

I've radiused fretboards before, re-frets, etc, but I don't want to ruin a perfectly good neck if there's a reason not to do it that I'm missing.

 

[AirCap]

Why do you want THAT radius in particular?

 

[stratamania]

7.5" is probably not offered on the modern neck as I would suppose as it is a vintage radius any demand for it would be on the other types of necks.

 

[beltjones]

Why do you want THAT radius in particular?

That's a good question. I always believed the common myths about fretting out, but when the Silver Sky came out and PRS himself said it wasn't an issue as long as the fretwork is good, it made me reconsider. Then I thought about how all of the vintage Fenders are 7.25", and how desirable they are.

I went to GC to sample some 7.25" guitars, and got to chatting with the store manager. I asked if they had anything with a 7.25" radius, and he said he didn't think so - that only vintage and custom instruments had that (and some re-issue stuff they were out of). I asked if they had a Silver Sky, and he said, "Why?" I said because it has a 7.25" board. He said it didn't, and I politely disagreed. He said, "Listen man, I HAVE a Silver Sky. I play it all the time, and I bend the sh*t out of it. No way it has a 7.25" board." At that moment I could have won that Silver Sky off him if I had made him bet me. He looked it up on his phone, and of course I was right.

So I bought a 7.25" radius neck from Warmoth with vintage size frets, did my usual fretwork, and mounted it up. The neck is nearly dead flat, the frets are level and crowned, the action is about 1.25mm at the 12th fret, and I can bend all day without fretting out.

Since I started building guitars (not just Warmoth stuff, I mostly buy lumber and build my guitars, but quality is quality and Warmoth makes the best pre-made necks and bodies if you want to go that route) I learned a lot more about what makes a neck feel the way it does. E.g, a neck with a thin C carve will still feel big with tall frets, a flat radius, and a high action, especially if you play with your thumb over the top.

So I really like flat boards with a smaller neck profile, but in certain instances I love a thick neck with a rounder radius, and I have a Warmoth tele I built years ago that I think would be better with a 7.25" radius, given that I was going for a vintage vibe for it from the beginning. I could pay $200 for a new neck, or $15 for new frets after I re-radius the existing board.

 

[beltjones]

7.5" is probably not offered on the modern neck as I would suppose as it is a vintage radius any demand for it would be on the other types of necks.

That doesn't make sense though. Warmoth makes stuff to-order, so it's not like they have to stock a bunch of inventory that might not sell. To illustrate what I mean, they offer a purpleheart neck with a bloodwood fretboard - not a high-demand option - but if someone orders it they'll make it.

 

[stratamania]

It does make sense if you consider Warmoth makes things to order from a predefined set of options that are available.

The likelihood of someone wanting a vintage 7 1/4" radius on a non-vintage neck such as the modern construction is going to be extremely small.

To use your example:

If a customer wants a purpleheart neck with a bloodwood fretboard in modern construction with a compound 10 - 16" radius that construction is available for any available wood choice.

If a customer wants a purpleheart neck with a bloodwood fretboard with a 7 1/2" radius that construction is available for that and any available wood choice but only on vintage construction necks.

With both those example, the wood is a variable but the construction types and options for those are what is on offer and tooled up for.

At the end of the day, Warmoth has to run a profitable production facility with viable options on offer.

 

[beltjones]

Yeah, not interested in arguing about it. I'm wondering if anyone knows the actual reason why they don't offer a 7.25" board on a modern construction neck. If the reason has something to do with tooling that's fine - it probably means it's won't harm anything to re-radius the board, but I'm hoping someone knows the actual reason, not just a guess.

 

[stratamania]

I am not arguing I am giving the most probable reason.

Your question is similar to various questions that come up from time to time on the forum about similar things and production tooling is normally the reason when one is given.

 

[fdesalvo]

I think it comes back to demand. The people that want that radius will most likely want it in vintage or at least vintage/modern construction. Some of us can hear a difference lol.

The question of why they won’t do it is a mystery to me, still. I can’t imagine the production line being so linear that this option would cause a break or disruption. The fretboards are obviously radiused after the fretboard and backs have been joined.

 

[Cagey]

Just as crummy string nut production was the genesis of string trees, less-than-stellar fret resolution was the downfall of 7.25" radii. Aircap's right - if the frets are done right, a 7.25" radius is perfectly useful in modern playing styles. But, it's a fairly rare production neck that's done that well. Takes too much time/money. Plus, as you all know (or should) Warmoth's necks are made by nubile young virgin wood nymphs who live in the trees of the woods in the foothills of Mt. Ranier. Unknown to many, they are mammals of the order Rodentia, which are characterized by a single pair of continuously growing incisors in each of the upper and lower jaws. They sharpen these teeth by constant gnawing, and their jaws are simply of the wrong angle to do 7.25" radius necks.

That's my story, and I'm sticking to it.

 

[beltjones]

Well, I think the only logical thing to do is to go for it and report back with results.

I have some other guitar projects I'm working on, so it might be a few weeks. In the meantime, if anyone has a good reason not to do it post it here and I'll double check this thread before I pull frets off.

 

[fdesalvo]

I say, go for it. Will be a great experience and you’ll get what you’re after in the end. Best of luck and hoping the more experienced will post up some potential hazards. 

 

[Cagey]

I don't know why they don't offer it, but it seems like it would be worth a 90 second call to ask. Those guys aren't just salesmen, they really know what they're talking about. On top of that, they're the manufacturer and oddly enough, quite approachable. It's not like calling Microsoft or GM and going through 943 divisions/departments, etc, and explaining yourself 356 times to people who don't understand what you're talking about.

The amount of wood removed would be minimal, so I don't think there's any chance of hardware interference or wood misbehavior. No offense intended, but it's probably just not offered because... why? Who would buy it?

 

[beltjones]

Yeah, I'll probably call them before I do anything. I've used that "service" a few times in the past - their customer service really is top notch.

One thought I had is that it could have something to do with the side dots. On a "vintage" construction neck the side dots are Fenderish in that they're sort of partway in the fretboard and partway in the neck wood, whereas on my "modern" construction necks they're in the fretboard entirely. I think it's possible I'll sand off part of the side markers when I add a bunch of curve to the fretboard. I believe they do fretmarkers before radiusing, so that could explain why 7.25 is only offered on one type of construction.

 

[beltjones]

Ok, I just spoke to Warmoth (I think his name was Justin - really nice and helpful guy), and he confirmed the thing about the side dots. He said the side dots aren't just superficial - they actually extend like half an inch into the fretboard. If I radius too much the result will be little darts on the side of the fretboard where the side dot material is showing through.

 

[stratamania]

Well, there we have it a construction limitation as proposed. If it is something you really wanted to do on a Modern neck you could order one with just fret slots, no frets or side dots and customize away.

 

[spe111]

With the right fretwork 7.25" boards can play/bend/whatever pretty awesome. I do think the fretwork has to be just about perfect for them to do that.

 

[stratamania]

With the right fretwork 7.25" boards can play/bend/whatever pretty awesome. I do think the fretwork has to be just about perfect for them to do that.

Indeed. Though I would suspect a 2 1/2 step bend high up on the neck may very well choke out unless the frets themselves have been made somewhat compound themselves.

 

[beltjones]

Well, there we have it a construction limitation as proposed. If it is something you really wanted to do on a Modern neck you could order one with just fret slots, no frets or side dots and customize away.

Well, except your proposal was that it was due to lack of demand, not due to a construction limitation. You eventually backed into a point about tooling or set-up, but that wasn't exactly right either.

Also, you're forgetting a key part about doing this on a neck that I already have, which is that it negates the need to buy a new neck. If wanted to buy a new neck I could quite simply order one that is already radiused at 7.25".

Regardless, go ahead and take credit for being correct.  :doh: :doh: :doh:

 

[fdesalvo]

Did you join the forum to argue or learn?

Well, there we have it a construction limitation as proposed. If it is something you really wanted to do on a Modern neck you could order one with just fret slots, no frets or side dots and customize away.

Well, except your proposal was that it was due to lack of demand, not due to a construction limitation. You eventually backed into a point about tooling or set-up, but that wasn't exactly right either.

Also, you're forgetting a key part about doing this on a neck that I already have, which is that it negates the need to buy a new neck. If wanted to buy a new neck I could quite simply order one that is already radiused at 7.25".

Regardless, go ahead and take credit for being correct.  :doh: :doh: :doh: