MusicMan StingRay sound alike

[notid]

Hi,

I am thinking about building a MusicMan StingRay sound alike. I've played through a modern 2-humbucker stingray, and found the coils 2&3 position (2nd position) to be very nice sounding, so I figure that building one with a single humbucker in the sweet spot will likely sound similar. I'm currently thinking about doing some sort of black korina jbass with either canary, pau ferro, or wenge neck. I'm thinking about using the Nordstrand mm 4.4 pickup and the 2 band eq preamp (2b-3a).

Nordstrand pickups:
http://www.nordstrandpickups.com/bass-pickups/modern/

Preamp:
http://www.nordstrandpickups.com/preamp/

Now for the questions:
1) Does it sound like this will be a pretty close sound to what I've already played through? Ideally it would be sonically equivalent, maybe just a bit punchier.
2) Is the preamp I selected correct? I'm not sure if I'm getting one that assumes I'm getting two pickups.
3) I'm not really sure about schematics for the preamp circuit. Is it safe to assume that I'm just going to be soldering the extra components (input jack, battery,etc.) into the circuit board that I get from nordstrand? It seems either much more complicated than a 2-pickup guitar or much more simple.
4) If I got the 2 band preamp, it would fit just fine in a jbass control plate, correct? Should I rear route?
5) I have no idea for bridge and tuners. Ideas?
6) Any other general thoughts on the build?

Thanks,
Bryce

 

[dNA]

1) If you go with a korina body and a neck that's not maple, you're already moving pretty far away from your starting point. Some people will argue that canary and pau ferro sound similar or exactly the same as maple. Some people will argue the body wood makes no difference. I would argue that if you're trying to make something sound like a Stingray, you want to construct as similarly to a stingray as possible. I believe that means an ash body and a maple neck. I don't know what your definition of "punchier" is, but i would bet that everybody's idea of what that means is different. If you can give us an idea of what that means in more scientific or objective terms, maybe we can help you move closer to that idea.
2) I don't know if there's a correct preamp to go with. I know a lot of people have said that the signature MM sound comes largely from the preamp. A Nordstrand preamp is going to be top quality, but it may not sound like a MusicMan and it's clear, natural character may be the opposite of what you're going for.
3) I haven't done this, so I can't answer
4) not sure either
5) tons of options for a bridge. I think the vast majority of people building basses on here go with Hipshot Ultralites, because Warmoth bass necks are notoriously heavy and you want to reduce weight at the top as much as possible to avoid neckdive.
6) the awesome thing about a Warmoth is that you can basically get a lot of the design characteristics of your favorite instrument in whatever shape, color, size or form that you want. Obviously the tonal properties of the wood have to hold some weight above the aesthetic value, but it depends on your priorities. If you've got a little extra money to burn, it might not be a bad idea to try something new and different. If you don't like it, resell the parts you're not happy with and try something else. If you don't have the funds for that, I would probably just stick to the tried and true equations of components and focus on making it look and feel like your custom guitar.

 

[line6man]

2) Is the preamp I selected correct? I'm not sure if I'm getting one that assumes I'm getting two pickups.

The MM tone is mainly a product of the pickup, it's placement and the preamp. AFAIK, the MM preamp is NOT transparent, and therefore, the Nordstrand preamp probably won't get you anywhere near a MM tone.
I'm curious, why not just go with a MM clone preamp?

FWIW, that's a regular single-input preamp, so it doesn't care how many pickups you wire to it's input, so long as the output impedance of the pickup(s) is not too high that it would require an input impedance above 1M Ohms. (Piezo bridges, for example.)

3) I'm not really sure about schematics for the preamp circuit. Is it safe to assume that I'm just going to be soldering the extra components (input jack, battery,etc.) into the circuit board that I get from nordstrand? It seems either much more complicated than a 2-pickup guitar or much more simple.

OUTPUT jack! The signal flows OUT of the bass.  All you will be doing is wiring one pickup to a volume pot, into the preamp, and then to the jack. If Nordstrand does not have a diagram for this, I'll draw you one.

4) If I got the 2 band preamp, it would fit just fine in a jbass control plate, correct? Should I rear route?

I'm reasonably certain that you need to rear route. The only preamps that fit in standard top-routed Jazz control cavities are the control plate-mounted Audere and J Retro preamps.

 

[Steve_Karl]

My ' 76 MM Stingray is an ash body with a maple/maple neck with very small frets.
I had problems with the original neck in the late 80s, and bought a replacement from Ernie Ball which was maple / ebony with large frets.

That newer neck never sounded the same as the old maple/maple and also didn't perform the same as it wouldn't pop 'n' slap like the maple.
It was a totally different bass with that newer neck.

Luckily I got the original neck fixed at the end of the 90s.
I replaced the preamp with one from the newer 5 string to get the mid range tone control. I kinda wish I hadn't ... it sounds ( overall ) slightly different, but nothing I can't tweak with EQ.

There are MM preamp kits available and also specs for the vintage pre amps somewhere in this area.

http://shop.ebay.com/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=m570&_nkw=DIY+Ref+Music+Man+Stingray+Bass+Guitar+Preamp+Component

Here's the tunnel down through the guys site.

http://myweb.ecomplanet.com/TOWN8019/mycustompage0019.htm

 

[line6man]

I replaced the preamp with one from the newer 5 string to get the mid range tone control. I kinda wish I hadn't ... it sounds ( overall ) slightly different, but nothing I can't tweak with EQ.

Most people agree that the original two-band preamps sounded better than the three-bands.

 

[Steve_Karl]

I agree also but it's not a real big difference. I still might try to rebuild the original from that package on ebay.

 

[line6man]

I agree also but it's not a real big difference. I still might try to rebuild the original from that package on ebay.

What package on eBay?

 

[Steve_Karl]

I agree also but it's not a real big difference. I still might try to rebuild the original from that package on ebay.

What package on eBay?

http://shop.ebay.com/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=m570&_nkw=DIY+Ref+Music+Man+Stingray+Bass+Guitar+Preamp+Component

http://myweb.ecomplanet.com/TOWN8019/mycustompage0019.htm

 

[line6man]

I agree also but it's not a real big difference. I still might try to rebuild the original from that package on ebay.

What package on eBay?

http://shop.ebay.com/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=m570&_nkw=DIY+Ref+Music+Man+Stingray+Bass+Guitar+Preamp+Component

http://myweb.ecomplanet.com/TOWN8019/mycustompage0019.htm

Btw, SGD Lutherie makes a MM clone preamp now.
http://www.sgdlutherie.com/pages/electronics.html

 

[Steve_Karl]

I agree also but it's not a real big difference. I still might try to rebuild the original from that package on ebay.

What package on eBay?

http://shop.ebay.com/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=m570&_nkw=DIY+Ref+Music+Man+Stingray+Bass+Guitar+Preamp+Component

http://myweb.ecomplanet.com/TOWN8019/mycustompage0019.htm

Btw, SGD Lutherie makes a MM clone preamp now.
http://www.sgdlutherie.com/pages/electronics.html

Good Find!
I can't read schematics so this might be my best option if I want to go back.
Now all I need to find is an original ( after market ) plate.

 

[notid]

Thanks for all the quick feedback guys!

On second thought, perhaps an ash body probably would be better. I am pretty committed to getting a raw neck, so maybe canary would be my best bet. Thanks for the recommendation on the tuners.

I realized that I misspoke and that the pickup I was thinking about was the 4.2. This one appears to be more faithful SR.

So it sounds like the biggest point of contention would be the preamp. I originally thought that the preamp I mentioned was meant to be a SR clone. I'm sort of privy to the DIY option from ebay.  Is the SGD Lutherie a legit source?

Any thoughts on pickup placement (single in sweet spot vs two pickups?)

Regards,
Bryce

 

[Steve_Karl]

I'd be careful about picking a "sweet spot"
If one pup only I'd put it where the original single was placed on the pre EB models.

 

[line6man]

Is the SGD Lutherie a legit source?

Yes. I talked to him about that preamp on FaceBook a couple of days ago. His pickups are mainly popular with TalkBass members, as that's where he advertises, but a few members here have basses with his pickups, as well.
The only thing is that sometimes he can take forever to build and ship orders. If you want to order anything from him, you'll need to be patient, because it may take a few months.

 

[Steve_Karl]

Control plates!

http://shop.ebay.com/i.html?_nkw=music+man+bass+plate&_sacat=0&_sop=15&_odkw=music+man+bass&_osacat=0&_trksid=p3286.c0.m270.l1313

 

[Steve_Karl]

 Is the SGD Lutherie a legit source?

He feels good with email.
I'll be ordering one soon.
Maybe he'll join us here and make him self known. We can never have too many good resources for parts. Especially hard to get items.

 

[line6man]

 Is the SGD Lutherie a legit source?

He feels good with email.
I'll be ordering one soon.
Maybe he'll join us here and make him self known. We can never have too many good resources for parts. Especially hard to get items.

He's pretty well known as it is, and struggling to keep up with all the orders he gets. :blob7:

 

[SGD Lutherie]

 Is the SGD Lutherie a legit source?

He feels good with email.
I'll be ordering one soon.
Maybe he'll join us here and make him self known. We can never have too many good resources for parts. Especially hard to get items.

He's pretty well known as it is, and struggling to keep up with all the orders he gets. :blob7:

Actually orders are slow at the moment! I had been running behind on orders do to a combination of a big rush for one customer for the NAMM show, and a few technical problems.

Hi everyone, Steve had pointed me to this thread, and while I have visited a few times in the past, thought I'd come and introduce myself.

My name is David, and I'm a bass player and guitarist, and as you have gathered make pickups and electronics. I'm small one man operation. I try and make things you wont  find elsewhere, instead of the usual vintage Fender copy parts.

I have recently started making a copy of a '74 Music Man preamp. It's an accurate copy, but with better parts, and the same op amp as the original. I plan on having a few more preamps in the future.

I've put together quite a few Warmoth based instruments over the years for people.  :icon_biggrin:

 

[Mor Paul]

Hey, David, and welcome to the forum. I've seen your work on Talkbass some, and I'm sure you'll like it here.

 

[SGD Lutherie]

Thanks Max!

 

[SGD Lutherie]

Oh and I forget to mention that I carry Hipshot parts and things like Bourns pots, switches and even Kent Armstrong preamps.  :icon_biggrin: