First Warmoth build(s), first post and a tuner hole question!

[Cagey]

It's time-consuming, but you won't be sorry.

Be aware that the finer you go in abrasives, the longer it takes to make a difference. It takes more time than you think when you get up in the 1200+ grades, so be patient. It pays.

 

[Vallhagen]

Good to know. And time isnt an issue, i am patient by nature... i think... too old to be in a hurry. And the shop didnt have anything between 240 and 600 (read: no 400), so that jump will take its time.

Do you use a block for the rounded side of the neck? or just fingers "smearing out" the paper?

 

[Cagey]

The only place I use a block is on the headstock, breaking the edges. It's too tough to do by hand and have it come out evenly.

The sides of the neck are up for grabs. If I can feel the frets, then I'll usually take a flat diamond file to them, then sand/polish to suit. These aren't cheap, but they work well...

Go to the local home improvement joint and get a drawer pull that makes you happy, then epoxy it on the smooth side with some of that 5 minute stuff they sell at the same place. .

 

[Vallhagen]

Thanx again for the hint. I will leave any fretwork just as it is though, there is no uncomfortable parts of metal on the side of the fretboard.

I have sanded the whole neck to 1200, and I will stop there. It feels...really good. I started to question myself if a neck can be too smooth. I have always aimed for a naturally smooth or satin finnish just to get that fast feeling, but maybe man can go over the top and the thumb will slip off? I need to find that out myself with the guitar assembled. This neck is now the smoothest neck i've held.

Cheerio

 

[bagman67]

As I prepare to undertake my first from-scratch build,I've been ooh-ing and aah-ing over various hand tools with blades, and as I contemplate each thing, I say to myself, maintaining those edges will be one helluva job.  So this weekend I went down the rabbit hole chasing info about sharpening stones and so forth. Those DMT diamond blocks get high ratings from a lot of folks who it would seem know what they are talking about.

 

[Cagey]

Those Dia-Sharp blocks are pretty pricey and are more useful on used necks where the frets are all over the place. For a new neck such as you'd get from Warmoth or the like, you're likely to only find 3 to 5 frets that are sitting proud. To find those, you want a rocker tool such as this...

You use that to find the high points (see the video) and mark them, then you want a crowning tool such as this...

They're not cheap, either, but they work like a champ forever and ever, amen. I mean, they even laugh at stainless. You can get similar tools for less money, but stainless frets will tear them up.

You're also going to to want at least one of these...

They're for dressing. They don't make a diamond version of that one, but luckily they're not terribly expensive.

Once the frets are dressed, you'll need some polishing papers. I like 3M's stuff...

I cut it into about 1" strips and strop the frets. Time-consuming, but magical.

 

[Vallhagen]

Loads of investment hints there Cagey! So far i do have the polishing paper!

***

I took a few weeks off the project, needed to recover a bit. Back now though.

The Telecaster:

The neck is glued and sanded and i applied a new decal on the peghead and some topcoat over it (the first decal kinda dissapeared in the re-sanding process).

The hipshot staggered tuners arrived as planned (thanx again for the hint about those, Rick), and they seems to work perfectly fine.

All is assembled, roughly adjusted and perfectly playable. Now i will intonate him, and then take some pics. And try it out through a loud amp.

**

Question: Is there any "must do / dont do" when it comes to the Wilkinson (WVS 50 iik) tremolo? I have set it up floating - in parallell with the guitar body, and i havent touched the individual string height screws at all, only the two fulcrum screws. The neck is 10-16" compound, and the Wilkinson has some default radius which seems to match enough good(?). Any hints are appreciated.

One thing i notice when i watch "instruction clips" on similar floating tremolos is that "everyone" IS screwing the fulcrum screws with strings (and springs) attached (which means that the knife edge - fulcrum screw is under preasure). This seems highly unsuitable to me, as the risk is HIGH to damage the knife edge/screw. Am i wrong? Maybe the steel is enough hardened to stand this?

**

Well... ill be back with pictures

Cheers

 

[Cagey]

Question: Is there any "must do / dont do" when it comes to the Wilkinson (WVS 50 iik) tremolo? I have set it up floating - in parallell with the guitar body, and i havent touched the individual string height screws at all, only the two fulcrum screws. The neck is 10-16" compound, and the Wilkinson has some default radius which seems to match enough good(?). Any hints are appreciated.

One thing i notice when i watch "instruction clips" on similar floating tremolos is that "everyone" IS screwing the fulcrum screws with strings (and springs) attached (which means that the knife edge - fulcrum screw is under preasure). This seems highly unsuitable to me, as the risk is HIGH to damage the knife edge/screw. Am i wrong? Maybe the steel is enough hardened to stand this?

On some of the less expensive (usually imported) versions of that bridge you might have to worry about adjusting under pressure, but the Wilkinson uses a hardened steel base plate and pivot posts, so you won't hurt anything. It's not like you're going to be doing it every day, anyway. You do have to be careful to use the right size hex wrench, though. Use one too small by confusing metric vs. imperial sizes, and you'll wreck either the post, the wrench or both. Normally, the bridge comes with a set of proper size wrenches. They aren't the highest quality tools you can get, but at least they're the right size.

As far as saddle height goes, they're probably not set to ideal. I've never measured it, but I'd wager that if they're deliberately set to any radius, it's probably 12". On a Warmoth compound radius neck, you end up needing about an 18" radius at the bridge. That means you need to make adjustments to get the thing to optimal.

It probably goes without saying, but I will because it's easy to overlook - you need to back out the locking screws holding the saddles down. You can't set height or travel (intonation) otherwise. Everything will set up fine with those loose, so don't worry about it. You can lock it all up when you're done.

Now, you can use an understring gauge such as one of these...

...but I've found that reality/performance is a better indicator of the best saddle height. The only downside to my method is you may end up with uneven string heights if the frets aren't properly levelled.

It's an iterative process. With the saddles down, adjust the bridge pivot posts to get close to right, where there's the least amount of string buzz. Then, you adjust each saddle to get rid of dead spots or the dreaded buzz. Starting from nut, fret each note along the string listening (acoustically) for dead spots or buzzes. Adjust the saddle height to get rid of the problem. Do that for all 6 strings. After each pass, you may be able to lower the bridge plate a bit. Eventually, you'll get to a point where you can't go any further, so you call it a love story. If you're not happy with the overall string height, you may need to do some fret work, or perhaps adjust the truss rod to get a bit of relief in the neck. Both situations are common.

Once you're happy, tighten up the saddle locking screws and you're good to go.

 

[Rick]

Progress! Pics? 

 

[Vallhagen]

Progress! Pics?

Yessir! As follows a few rows below!

**

Cagey; Thanx again.

Regarding the hardened steel/bolts/knife-edges i have actually experience from it myself, but its back in early nineties. I remember i did return a Kramer guitar which after a month of playing refused to stay in tune; it turned out that the whole tremolo block were eaten up by the screw, and that was without touching it, just using the tremolo. But lets assume that was a cheap floydrosecopy. Also i have (still in use on a strat) an old Kahler fulcrum, where it sais in the instructions that turning the screws under pressure is a big nono. But thats Kahler :icon_tongue: ... Good to know that Wilkinson pass though. I had to ask

Thanx for your setup process too. Intuitive. I started with a basic setup (as mentioned above), and followed you a few steps. it sort of fell into place fairly easily, and for now i am happy with it. I will play it for a week as it is now, and then come back to the hex keys and see if i can get it even better. Or if i want even lower action. It's obviously a matter of personal taste, and as i am searching for "that feeling" (we all are, i assume) i'm not sure if its about easier hammer-ons. I could talk about this for a while... one of my guitars is an Ibanez RG505 (yes 505, not 550); lightweight, well balanced and perfectly easy to play with low action and slim wizard neck. I played it for many years, but for some reason never liked it... it just doesnt mean anything to hit a note on it. No soul. Main point: This tele feels good, really good, as it is now, let's see how it grows

**

So; it's all setup, adjusted and intonated.

I finnished soldering the electronics yesterday too. It's just straightforward; vol- and tonepot, threewayswitch. I chose Alpha 24mm pots and a Neutrik jack, which is good quality stuff. (Maybe i can again share a hint here, as electronics is my playground and i have these things in my drawers: I have seen companys billing ridiculous money for guitar electronics... 100 USD for four pots, a jack and two "vintage orange caps". THAT is insanely expensive, dont buy it ... a cap shall cost virtually nothing and a pot maybe 3-5 USD).

It has a sweet acoustic sustain, and i am happy with the overall amplified sound/tone too (though i have only played it at home, as loud as i dare with neighbours).

And i am truly extremely satisfied with the aestethics of the whole thing (indeed part of the idea in customizing your own instrument, right). Chrome-red-turtoise-ebony. Yep! And i am happy with one pickup in the pickguard, and one woodmounted with just the right cut-out lines in that same pickguard, an idea i borrowed from a Suhr guitar somewhere. Looks cool to me. Ok... that was the bragging paragraph.

***

Some pics, and a repeat of whats in there:

Neck: Warmoth showroom canary with ebony, medium fat frets, graphtech nut. Turned out to be crack-crap on delivery, but repaired now and plays nice. 10-16 compound radius and warmoth double-adjustment trussrod. Unfinnished is the s##t indeed! The decal on peghead is a waterslide laser-printed one. I couldnt manage to get it all invisible, but its the first time i put a waterslide decal on wood, so maybe it is so it turns out. Original Bullfinch artwork by the youngest family member here (he's 10 years old).

Body: One-piece solid black Limba (Korina), also from Warmoth showroom. All extra contours. For some reason (im not exactly sure why, but i guess it can be related to Gibson Explorer), i really wanted to have a Korina guitar. Now i have one!

The finnish is from Wudtone; Cherry Flamenco.

Pickups: Oil City pickups (UK), "Scrapyard Dog Plus", handwired.

Pickguard: Warmoth

Hardware: Wilkinson tremolo (i got it from guitarfetish), Hipshot locking staggered tuners.

The "only dirtcheap" part is the control plate, i got it from china/ebay and payed 3USD i think, including pots and switch. Free shipping. When i ordered parts, i wasnt fully sure that i should have such a plate at all (the body is rear routed), so i orderred it just to keep the option. And somewhere along the line i really wanted it there, so... good buy (i replaced the switch and pots though, Alpha pots, see above).

did i miss something? Here we go:

...notice the artistic brain drop at the birds forefoot^^ ... love it!

 

[Cagey]

If that thing plays/sounds anywhere near as good as it looks, then I'd say you're a lucky man. Good job!

Now. What have you done for me lately?  :laughing7:

Gotta build another one, this time with more pictures. It's the law.

 

[Vallhagen]

It's the law.

Thanx Cagey!

... and we'll find out if there's to be more projects. Maybe it will. This was fun indeed.

Cheerio

 

[stratamania]

Nice job, I like that Suhr inspired pickguard too.

 

[Rick]

Gorgeous

 

[PhilAngus]

Those Dia-Sharp blocks are pretty pricey and are more useful on used necks where the frets are all over the place. For a new neck such as you'd get from Warmoth or the like, you're likely to only find 3 to 5 frets that are sitting proud. To find those, you want a rocker tool such as this...

You use that to find the high points (see the video) and mark them, then you want a crowning tool such as this...

They're not cheap, either, but they work like a champ forever and ever, amen. I mean, they even laugh at stainless. You can get similar tools for less money, but stainless frets will tear them up.

You're also going to to want at least one of these...

They're for dressing. They don't make a diamond version of that one, but luckily they're not terribly expensive.

Once the frets are dressed, you'll need some polishing papers. I like 3M's stuff...

I cut it into about 1" strips and strop the frets. Time-consuming, but magical.

Mmmm, I'm not so sure this is that straight forward though. When you take your first three frets (or any three frets), let's say the middle one is high because it rocks. So you level it, but you can't be sure that the two outside frets are level with other frets further down. Isn't that why it is best to use a levelling beam to get an overall level as well?

 

[stratamania]

Phil, here is how I use the fret rocker

http://unofficialwarmoth.com/index.php?topic=23725.msg347692#msg347692

Basically I get the neck and top of the frets as straight as possible with the truss rod. Then I use the rocker to see where the high spots are taking readings at the middle and towards the side of the frets about a quarter of the way in from the edge. I mark where these are on the masking tape.  A levelling file or beam is then used for overall levelling but the fret rocker has helped identify where the high spots are that may need more attention.

The other method if only the odd one is high would be to spot level and then check for overall level again. 

 

[Cagey]

Mmmm, I'm not so sure this is that straight forward though. When you take your first three frets (or any three frets), let's say the middle one is high because it rocks. So you level it, but you can't be sure that the two outside frets are level with other frets further down. Isn't that why it is best to use a levelling beam to get an overall level as well?

Your concern is valid, but as I mention at the beginning of that post, that whole procedure is best suited to new necks. It's exceedingly rare to find low frets on a new part - they're almost exclusively a bit tall here and there. When I get a used neck in here, then I'm more than likely going to use a levelling beam on the thing because the frets can be all over the place and almost all of them are going to require re-crowning anyway. You don't want to take a levelling beam after a new neck if you can help it because you'd be eating fret metal for nothing, then you have to re-crown the whole set, which is a time-consuming pain in the shorts.

 

[stratamania]

To add, whatever method you use, I agree with Cagey there is no point in talking material away that doesn't need to be.

 

[Vallhagen]

Thanx Stratamania and Rick too.

This tele feels all good today too

... and please keep up this fretting discussion. I read and learn!

Cheers

 

[PhilAngus]

Mmmm, I'm not so sure this is that straight forward though. When you take your first three frets (or any three frets), let's say the middle one is high because it rocks. So you level it, but you can't be sure that the two outside frets are level with other frets further down. Isn't that why it is best to use a levelling beam to get an overall level as well?

Your concern is valid, but as I mention at the beginning of that post, that whole procedure is best suited to new necks. It's exceedingly rare to find low frets on a new part - they're almost exclusively a bit tall here and there. When I get a used neck in here, then I'm more than likely going to use a levelling beam on the thing because the frets can be all over the place and almost all of them are going to require re-crowning anyway. You don't want to take a levelling beam after a new neck if you can help it because you'd be eating fret metal for nothing, then you have to re-crown the whole set, which is a time-consuming pain in the shorts.

I understand where you are coming from. Which end of the neck would you start at? I guess if you only find one high fret then it's wherever it is, but what if there are more?