First Warmoth build(s), first post and a tuner hole question!

Hey PhilAngus!

Thanx. and i appreciate you being honest!

And if i am honest too: I (we) did have problems getting this green to the right nuance, and i have indeed learned a few things during the process. After the first coats it was really too much mudd/moss in the color than i wanted. The (now obvious) challenge was to turn something red/brown into green. Difficult. If i had thought about that before starting the build, i guess the easy way out (if i wanted a green guitar, and the kid did choose that color, its really nice on wudtone picture samples), had been to choose another body wood; say swamp ash or korina, which is more white-grey than brown-red by nature. Anyway, i did my google job and also had an email convo with Andy @ wudtone (nice helpful guy) who gave me some really useful hints. And finally the result came out pretty nice i think, though it still is a nuance of brown in it, and its a bit deeper/darker than expected.

...and regarding picture quality; Yea, im a bit lazy, i often just use my semi-crappy cell phone cam to snap some pics during the process, much just for private documentation. The earlier pics in the thread are such. For the last set i have used a "good quality" Sony camera, and also payed some attention to lighting, it made a difference:). I should take some daylight/outdoors pics too, but we have grey/rainy days (funny winter!) here.

***

And the telecaster neck story continues:

I did call them by phone thursday (morning time pst, two days ago). Nice chat, and they (the guy i talked to) promised to get back to me asap. He hasn't, yet. If you ask me, they are late on reply allready, but sure i can give them one more working day or so to respond.

This means, they responded (negative to my warranty claim) to my fist e-mail, they didn't respond at all to my second, and now i wait for their phone response. We'll see.

I also did the following (may seem a bit silly, but what can i do to convince ppl about the obvious?):

I bought wood piece of canary (same wood as in the cracked neck), and drilled holes in it, in a similar but "worse case" way as the holes in the neckhead. Same drill bit, same drill depth and same screws as with the tuning machines. I also did screw the screws all way in (which isnt the case when fastening the tuning machines, as the machine plate acts as a distance). Also, the stress on the wood is worse on the scrap piece of wood than the neckhead, as all screws are lined up in the same grain line.

The result: No cracks in the scrap piece. This is obvious: because the wood is healthy. Then i repeated the whole process again. It is fully repeatable. Healthy wood does not crack open.

DSC02311_f.JPG


And i agree, that this is not really anybodys fault. Wood is wood, and man cannot predict everything with a specific piece. But: This is really why there is a thing as limited warranty; if hidden defects comes in daylight when the customer receives it, the retailer shall take it back, or refund the customer. In this case i think i may accept some kind of compromise as well; i can take care of the repair, if they repay me % of the neck purchase cost. The neck isnt new anymore, and has lost its value as new.

Cheers


 
The tele neck: Still... nothing.

I received a short message monday afternoon from the sales person i've been contacting, telling me that the case is up on Warmoth management level, and they should contact me "shortly". Now lets see what they mean by "shortly". In my book it means "within one working day", but obviously I and Warmoth disagree on that.
 
It'll take a good Luther less than 1 hour  to glue the neck for you and it'll be better than new.  Sorry.
 
Thanx Rick. And yea, your right. Or it will take me the same amount of time to glue it myself, which most likely is what is goin to happen when this case reach it's end, and I have came back on inspiration track. 

Forgive me for being totally pissed (as in angry, not drunk!) today though. I finally just received a response from the Warmothers (their response time is indeed slow), and they still don't take any response for the neck crack. And I'm a bit like... if I wanted a cracked piece of wood to repair for my custom build, I shouldn't pay 265 dollars (+shipping...+tax...+customs) for it, rather a tenth of that amount.

I am not only disappointed but also surprised. I expected fast and responsible replies from them - but receive the opposite. The one good thing I can say about them, is that they are decent and polite, but that's about it. No intention at all to meet me as a customer. I am surprised because I don't see much complaints out here about them, and as Warmoth builders and players generally seems happy, I thought that their customer service should be good. Not in this case though.

**

Well well... I borrowed the kids green Diamondback^^ (all well adjusted and intonated by now) for some loud rehearsal yesterday, and to sum it up short: It's an absolutely fantastic instrument to play.

...had to say something positive too!

Cheers
 
You'll see.  It'll glue up great.  I know hipshot makes 8.5 tuners that would probably fit your neck.  It might be worth shooting them an email, though they'll take a phone call and answer your question on the spot.  They are very friendly.  The HS tuners are stable, accurate and no holes to drill with the UMP, so you avoid using the bushings and drilling screws.  The UMP will cover the holes.  You can use the current tuners on your next project.  Technology from the New York State Finger Lakes! (That's our big wine country, no disrespect to sonoma valley)

http://store.hipshotproducts.com/cart.php?m=product_detail&p=394

I'm not sure where you live, but there's a company in Philly that will send them to you and their prices are reasonable.

Good luck Bro'

 

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Rick!

Now you have mentioned those tuning machines so many times you almost convinced me :laughing7:! I actually have conciderred buying them, based on your opinion. The staggered technique is tempting.

**

I live in sweden. Shipping here for those is 84 USD, more than the set of tuners, which makes it not worth the prize... Maybe i can find another reseller.

Cheers
 
Actually it was stratman who alerted me to them.  http://www.sporthitech.com/. I got them from this outfit, they respond to emails.  There site is down for maintenance I can't believe it cost that much to ship ... I believe they ship overseas and I bet it's cheaper. I think thommann might be able to get it.  Maybe one of our european brothers can weigh in.
 
Cool. I just dropped sporthightech an email. Noticing their site is down during NAMM, but i guess they will respond fairly quick anyway.

I did email hipshot too, asking if that automatic calculated shipping cost really is correct. Free shipping in US but 84 dollars to europe sound a bit too funny to me, though i have seen similar costs sometimes when browsing around web-shops.

Seems like Thomann carries some hipshot products, but not exactly the version (vintage holes, staggered) we discuss here.
 
I've used Sporthitech to get the Hipshots I have wanted. There are some dealers stocking Hipshot in the UK and Europe but from what I have seen the stock advertised is limited and sometimes out of stock.

Sporthitech usually have stuff on E Bay if you wanted to take a look for price etc.
 
stratamania said:
Sporthitech usually have stuff on E Bay if you wanted to take a look for price etc.

Good thinking! I found their ebay store and they have the correct tuners for sale there. Reasonable shipping cost (16USD), looks like a good deal. Their ebay store is closed too during NAMM but the items for sale are viewable.
 
The hipshot people are good if there's a problem with what sporthightech sends you.  For me, one of the screws was the wrong size on replacement tuner buttons (I replaced the HS buttons with keystones, which look really sharp, though there's nothing wrong with the HS buttons.  If there's anything dealing with dimensions call hipshot, they will tell you what's up.
If you want different tuner buttons the time to ask for it would be when you order from sporthightech, that way you'd get everything in one go. 

Remember to get your dimensions right before you order, and for peace of mind verify it with a call to hipshot.  I bet they'd love to hear from someone in Sweden.  I looked up the weather in Stokhom, it's warmer than Upstate, NY, must be nice.  I think it would be darker there. For the first time in a month when I left work there was still some twilight
 
Hi Vallhagen, welcome!  It seems I'm a bit late to this thread.  :laughing7:

Let me first say that I love the way that green Diamondback turned out.  What you said seems to be true, in general.  Once assembled, the guitars usually are quite playable.  But once they get a proper setup and fret dressing, I'd put them against top offerings from most well-known guitar manufacturers.  Green Manalishi, indeed!  And I'm glad to see the Priest reference in there. 

Your Tele looks like a first-rate, vintage-style build, as well.  I'm awfully sorry to see the crack that developed.  I agree with the others that the head of the screw should have snapped off before you were able to exert enough force to crack the headstock.  Wood is wood, but some is suitable for instrument construction, and some is not.  It seems you got a piece with a weakness in the wrong area.  Sorry to hear Warmoth is not stepping up here.  It seems they do a significant volume of business worldwide.  I can't imaging eating one neck is going to hurt them.  But I got a neck one time from them with, what I thought, was a very discordant grain marking on the pegface.  I like variable wood grain, but to me, this one was a cosmetic flaw.  In no way would they take it back, as it was considered "the natural variability of the wood."  I'm pretty certain such a grain marking would not show up in a factory offering on the rack at a guitar store.  But I digress.

As others have said, if you can get glue into that crack and clamp it, it should be as strong or stronger than the rest of the wood.  One thing that saved me on a build one time was a thin piece of veneer.  I changed my mind on the tuners I wanted to use and the holes were a bit smaller than needed.  So, I tried to drill them out.  I didn't know about a reamer, so I used a regular drill.  Big mistake.  It chunked the wood.  My tech I used at the time got a thin piece of veneer and put it over the headstock.  The chunks cannot be seen.  Just a thought if you decide you can see the crack and do not like it. 

Anyway, good luck with the rest of the project!   
 
Hey DocNrock. Thanx for the welcome! Not late at all, im pretty slow myself on updating. Though, not much has happened since the last post.

DocNrock said:
  And I'm glad to see the Priest reference in there. 

Always! Nothing wrong with Peter Green, but Priest is the thing! I have to find someone to sing Before the Dawn on my funeral!

***

And i am glad you like the Diamondback. Since i did set it up, it is quite a fantastic guitar; as you say, definately comparable to "anything fancy" out there.

Maybe i shall type out here, what adjustments i did. I found zillions of videos out there on how to, and my procedure went quite simple:

* with all strings totally slacked (no string force at all on the neck, i actually lifted off the tailpiece), i adjusted the trussrod 100% straight, with the help of a straight metal edge (i used a long ruler. straight enough!).
* then put strings back and tune them up to correct tuning/correct force.
* with a capo on 1st fret, and finger on the 22nd fret - high e-string - i checked the "string lift" over the 10th fret. I learned somewhere that a piece of paper shall go free between the string and fret, but a business card shall not (I dont know if you guys use other rules of thumb for this?). There were no need to adjust truss rod further to achieve this, it just suited.
* then i adjusted string height with the two screws on the TOM bridge. I checked for no buzzing on any fret/any bend on the low E and high e-string. With that adjusted there were no buzz at the remaining middle-four strings either. I find this moment extremely straightforward on a TOM, as there only is two screws.
* Intonation
DONE! ... and to me it works - as said - fine. But again; if anyone wants to add something to this i am all ears. I have never done fret work, and i'm not sure i will go there either. But maybe it will lift the guitar up to an even higher level(?).

***

The tele neck... I gave up the conversation with warmoth last friday. It didnt go nowhere. And i beleive your sidestory about the "ugly" neck DocNrock, also indicates something. Anyway;

I glued the neck together. I didn't want to use the earlier recommended superglue (CA glue?), as it hardens in seconds. I realized that it would take me at least a minute to apply glue everywhere and tighten the head with clamps. I went with PU (polyurethane) wood glue instead, and it worked fine. I guess common "white glue" (i dont know what you call it? Just "wood glue"?) would work just fine as well, but... i went with the hardcore stuff. The procedure:

* I needed the cracks to open up a bit more to give a chance to apply glue on all areas where needed; all deep down the cracks. so i took 7 "two sizes big" screws and very gently screwed down (just a millimeter or two) the small drill holes to bend the cracks open. It worked fine.
* I masked the areas close to the glue-points. Just to make it easier to remove the residual glue after finnished work.
* with a small hair brush i placed one drop of pure water in each crack. this to help the PU glue, which like to stick to wet/damp surfaces. I let it soak for a few minutes.
* Thoroughly i applied PU glue in all cracks. I had good help with the small hair brush, and fortunately the glue "soaked in" well.
* i removed the seven screws, and filled the drill holes with glue too (as in: why not).
* two clamps applied.
* I removed the most of "spillover" glue with a piece of wet cloth. Not as easy as with "white glue", the PU stuff is way more sticky. I let the rest just be there, for mechanical removing later.
DONE

I haven't re-finnished the head yet (sanding, removing glue), but i will get there.

Thanx also for the hint about veener. It's not really applicable here though, as the crack is not visible from the front side of the head, its just between the screws on the backside.

The most boring thing is really that i lost the inspiration. This brand-new-mint-shiny-perfect-exclusive-neck-picked-by-me-among-others has lost its magic. Today i dont even like it. But i will get my inspiration back; I seriously think i shall just put this project aside for a while and pick it up when i feel like it again.

I looked up the weather in Stokhom, it's warmer than Upstate, NY, must be nice.
Hey Rick. My woman just got home from a 2day trip to Stockholm and they had snowstorm yesterday, so its up and down ... I read that NYC should have loads of snow too right now? Funny weather...

I orderred the tuners from sporthitech. they opened the store last sunday, and shipped it same day(!). Maybe those small machines can help me get my inspiration back. Sounds silly but such things happen. Out with the bad, in with the good.

**

Thank you guys for supportive words! It means something!
/Bengt
 
You'll be happy with the hipshots.  Hopefully, you'll just put on the umps (see my previous post on dealing with too long and too tight umps if there's an issue), the tuner's will just slide into the holes, the reach nuts will fit perfectly (you don't need to crank them supertight, just to the point where they hold) and the grip-lok system holds.  They really do look sharp. 

Snowmageddon was big nothing, only 5 inches of snow where I live.  It was light and fluffy.  Though it was cold this morning, -21 celsius.  Finally the sun doesn't set until after 5PM.  When I can get home and it's still daylight, and it's above freezing in the morning I'll be happy, probably around St. Pats day.  At least there's a light at the end of the tunnel.  We always have hope.
 
...im back to sanding down the glue residuals on this cracked-on-delivery-now-repaired-neck.

How fine is the Warmoth neck sanded on delivery? i e what do i need to get back to the same finnish? 400?

im asking because i need to buy some sheets of paper, noticing i dont have anything at home between 240 and 800.

Cheers
 
Warmoth sands to 220, but you might want to review this thread before you stop. Finer papers may not be available at your local home improvement center, but any paint shop, hardware or automotive supply should have them.
 
Cagey said:
Warmoth sands to 220, but you might want to review this thread before you stop. Finer papers may not be available at your local home improvement center, but any paint shop, hardware or automotive supply should have them.

Only 220? ok. Funny, i just sanded to 240, and the sanded parts (read: peghead backside) looks pretty much more "rough" than the rest of the neck right now.

I will read through that thread. Just clicked it, and the first posts pictures looks indeed shiny.

Thanx for a quick reply!
/Bengt
 
It's possible they go the next grade up to 320 on the necks, but by their own admission they only run the bodies up to 220. It may be handling abrasion that makes the necks feel finer. Doesn't take much to rub the fuzz off.
 
Awrite.

well im on the way to the paintshop. And i will get even finer sheets too, worth trying as i checked the thread.

Cheers
 
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