Hunting! Mr Doug can help, houpefully!

[DangerousR6]

Most of the murders involving guns have guns that were illegally obtained.  Outlaw guns, only outlaws have guns.

So out of the 50,000 or so gun related deaths each year in the U.S., which coem from the 230 million guns in the U.S. illegal guns are the problem? Perhaps just guns are the problem.

It's not the guns, it's the retards behind the guns. More people die in car wrecks every year, but do you outlaw cars? :dontknow:

 

[The Norwegian Guy]

Why don't u come to norway to hunt? We can hunt basicly anything here - and it's not hard to get permission to carry a gun. (not in the streets, but for hunting).

Me and some friends went rabbit hunting last winter.

Looks like you found the enemy snowman instead of wabbits.... :laughing7:

The enemy snowman kinda has MY weapon! Damn snowman! :tard:

 

[Cletus]

Most of the murders involving guns have guns that were illegally obtained.  Outlaw guns, only outlaws have guns.

So out of the 50,000 or so gun related deaths each year in the U.S., which coem from the 230 million guns in the U.S. illegal guns are the problem? Perhaps just guns are the problem.

It's not the guns, it's the retards behind the guns. More people die in car wrecks every year, but do you outlaw cars? :dontknow:

Cars can have a positive purpose.

 

[-CB-]

Move to Florida - you'll feel at home, since we have a high Portuguese speaking population.
Non-citizens can own guns in Florida and the USA
You only need to be 21 years old and have no criminal record
As we speak, waiting for my new fret bender to come in for Vic's refret/refin... I'm assembling three .45 cal 1911 type pistols.  Just call you're local "transfer" person and tell him to expect a shipment for you, then order the guns online.  That simple.  Show your drivers license when you pick them up from the transfer person.  Easy peasy.

 

[Cagey]

Cars can have a positive purpose.

So can heroin. Regardless, cars kill and maim many, many more people than guns. If you want to outlaw something because it can be dangerous or fatal, there's a very long list of common legal things you'd have to row through before you ever got to guns. From the other perspective, how many things provide as much security and safety as guns do? They're a positive force, pure and simple, with a great deal of utility. They'll convince mentally/emotionally defective individuals to seek out other targets for their misguided intentions or find less injurious ways to sustain themselves. Plus, you can't talk a deer or a duck into letting you eat him, but a gun will turn him into food pretty quick. That's mighty handy when you're hungry, which happens on a daily basis <grin>

 

[Cletus]

Cars can have a positive purpose.

Regardless, cars kill and maim many, many more people than guns. If you want to outlaw something because it can be dangerous or fatal, there's a very long list of common legal things you'd have to row through before you ever got to guns. From the other perspective, how many things provide as much security and safety as guns do? They're a positive force, pure and simple, with a great deal of utility. They'll convince mentally/emotionally defective individuals to seek out other targets for their misguided intentions or find less injurious ways to sustain themselves. Plus, you can't talk a deer or a duck into letting you eat him, but a gun will turn him into food pretty quick. That's mighty handy when you're hungry, which happens on a daily basis <grin>

Believe what you like, I simply invite you to look at the murder rates in similar countries to the U.S. (England and Australia), compare their levels of gun ownership, and their levels of gun related deaths. Guns are undeniably a negative in society. Sorry.

 

[Cagey]

Believe what you like, I simply invite you to look at the murder rates in similar countries to the U.S. (England and Australia), compare their levels of gun ownership, and their levels of gun related deaths. Guns are undeniably a negative in society. Sorry.

No need to apologize. Fortunately, the vast majority disagree with you, so we're safe. And by extension, you're safe, because those of us who know better won't let the iceholes harm you regardless of what you believe.

 

[Cletus]

Believe what you like, I simply invite you to look at the murder rates in similar countries to the U.S. (England and Australia), compare their levels of gun ownership, and their levels of gun related deaths. Guns are undeniably a negative in society. Sorry.

No need to apologize. Fortunately, the vast majority disagree with you, so we're safe. And by extension, you're safe, because those of us who know better won't let the iceholes harm you regardless of what you believe.

The vast majotiry of who? The English and us are safe because there's not lunatic arseholes with guns walking my streets.

 

[Super Turbo Deluxe Custom]

For us Americans, it's a freedom issue.  It's in our Constitution, however left up to interpretation by whoever's in charge.  What's also open to interpretation is why it's there in the 1st place.  Some say so the citizens can keep the government in check.  I'll guarantee those with them feel safer than if the govt. took them.  FWIW, I don't own a gun.

 

[Volitions Advocate]

In Canada, or at least alberta, you need to take a wildlife class and get your license to buy tags for hunting.  It works the same here as far as the lottery is concerned.  But this is all separate from owning a firearm.  My Wildlife Identification Card allows me to buy hunting licenses, but my FAC allows me to purchase and use a gun without supervision.  And that is another class you have to take.  I'm fortunate this year in that I was finally drawn for my Moose tag, so was my Grandpa, and my dad got a cow elk tag, so we have a lot of meat to go hunting for this year.  I hunt exclusively for food, I find it a necessity as you can get a great deal of it for much less money than at the store, I can feed my family and some friends for a year on one kill.  In the case of a moose, we will eat very well.

As for the the guns having no positive effect on society. I call BS.  Tell that to a farmer.  A firearm is a tool.  If you have gophers digging holes that break your hoses legs, the horses that are a huge part of your livelyhood, than you need a .22 to go out and take care of the problem.  You could use poison.. sure.. if you don't mind poisoning the animals that eat your gophers.  Its been stated twice already about population control.  The environmentalists will argue that they should be left alone, and I agree, if this was 300 years ago.  We are left with a huge mess because of the trappers and hunters that abused the land when they first moved here and we have to deal with it. If we don't we're going to be faced with huge problems including overpopulation, disease, and possible extinction of several species.  It may seem counter intuitive, but its true.  White guilt be damned, I have an obligation to hunt, it's conservation and survivalism, nothing else.  Granted.. I don't own any pistols or military type guns, I don't see the point as a civilian other than "that's cool".  Those type of guns that I DO have run on air and shoot paint.

also the Inuit in the arctic would have a very difficult life were it not for their guns.  They eat deer, caribou, and seals.  There is nothing else up there to eat.  And without guns they'd have to use spears and slings and whatever else they used to.  And I think they'd nearly extinct themselves otherwise.  TOOLS.

I also shoot maybe 2 to 3 shots a year with my rifle, unless I'm zeroing.
Nando.. I don't know what it would take to get a hunting license up here.  The classes are easy (you do have to pass them or no license for you) but I don't know the policy on foreigners hunting.  You could come up here with me, if I go buy a deer tag I'd let you take the shot.  You'd also have to help with the work though so I hope you're not squeamish!

 

[Cletus]

For us Americans, it's a freedom issue.  It's in our Constitution, however left up to interpretation by whoever's in charge.  What's also open to interpretation is why it's there in the 1st place.  Some say so the citizens can keep the government in check.  I'll guarantee those with them feel safer than if the govt. took them.  FWIW, I don't own a gun.

We're goih down a dark path if we continue this discussion super, so I'll leave it there. Take it easy, Cletus.

 

[Cagey]

There are lunatic arseholes with guns walking the streets everywhere. What we've found is that if the sane, law-abiding folks also have guns, the lunatics are kept at bay. You need to be able to defend yourself, otherwise the lunatics have the upper hand, which is unacceptable. The criminal element will always have guns; that's a given. They don't obey the law and they appreciate overwhelming force. That's why they seek out guns. They make it dramatically easier for them to get their way. But, outside of a few truly and outrageously insane psychopaths, the survival instinct is intact and a criminal won't target someone they think is going to defend themselves with potentially lethal force.

Don't get me wrong - I'm not trying to talk you into obtaining a gun. If they frighten you or you believe they're too dangerous keep at hand, then by all means, stay away from them. You might inadvertently hurt yourself or others. But, don't fool yourself into thinking they're anything but tools. And like most tools, if you aren't schooled in their use, you can do a great deal of unintentional damage. So, either get educated/trained, or stay away from them. That's for your own as well as everybody else's good.

 

[OzziePete]

Hey guys!! I've always wanted to have guns and hunt, but nowaways I'm getting really interested in doing it.

Problems:
Here in Brazil you are not allowed to hunt anything, basically.
And there is a huge burocracy (we brazilians call it burro-cracy as burro is our word for donkey) and you can't have a rifle at home for example. IF you are afilliated to a Shooting Club, etc you can get after a lot of sweat the permision to own a gun, but you can CARRY it, so it must remain in the shooting club you're affiliated  :doh:  :sad:

Well, after this lets talk about my plans...

I'm thinking in try to go hunt something in a year or two in USA or Canada (don't know where is allowed)... Probably would need to be a big thing, as I've never shoot anything and I doubt I'd ever hit a bird or something small.
I would like to know if somebody know about a "Hunting Camp" or something like this, where people that don't know to shoot/hunt have classes of shooting and go hunt with a experienced guy helping you... I didn't have time to search for it on Google, hope I can do it soon... But if somebody knows something I'd like help

Cheers!

OK Fernando just a few thoughts here from me.. no particular order, just how they came to my head as I type.

1) You have to decide if you want to hunt or shoot.......If you just want to shoot, then target shooting and a rifle/pistol ramge and club is the thing to go for. You can as you mention, join one down there. I guess each club would have a beginners class or something like that, and you can hire a weapon to try out maybe? I'd strongly suggest you try that first, and see how that appeals to you. There is technique involed in firing guns, rifles  and handguns/pistols. Each is different. Get involved with a club and people can show you how to shoot better.

2) You will need to be shooting quite OK if you want to 'hunt', particularly in places like the USA where some of the 'game' can get mighty upset at someone taking pot shots at them and turn on you and kill you. If you are going to take a shot at a dangerous animal you better kill it quickly.You will only usually get one chance to fire the weapon at your game target, after that it either runs off never to be seen again or comes back to hunt you (depending on the animal). A wounded moose or bear is not something I want lurking in the bushes if I was hunting there, so yes, learn to hit the target and place the shot well. Heck, I have even had an experience with a Kangaroo or two,  years ago that had a go at me, so if something as usually placcid as a 'roo can get angry, do yourself a big favour and be proficicent with the weapon you will use.

3) With game hunting, there's usually a licence and arrangements to be guided in the area. I'd say being a foreigner visiting, people would insist on it. Expect to pay for the privilege of being told what not to shoot.

4) If hunting be prepared to walk and rough it, and lug that damned rifle all day long without firing a shot. It does happen like that sometimes.

5) If you are going for bigger animals you will need to have a caliber of rifle that will bring it down clean in one shot. Leave the 'bow and arrow hunt of the wild boar' to the likes of Ted Nugent. We want to hear from you again, OK?  :icon_biggrin:  :icon_thumright:
That sort of caliber will have recoil, and some kick like a mule/Brazilian Government Public Servant. Check with your physician about that shoulder of yours, it may not like firing a round that sends a mule/burro kick back on it. Even a decent sized revolver will have recoil and you will notice the aching wrists and arms the next day. If you go for a lightweight rifle of reasonable caliber, expect the thing to kick you heavily. There is a compromise between the weight of a barrel and the amount of comfort you get from carrying that lighter weight all day, vs. the hell of a kick it gives you because the barrel is lightened and there's no absorption when you fire a round. A longer heavier barrel can get you better accuracy too. And get a gun that has a decent stock to it too.

6) If going with a guide into the bush, listen to what they say to you. Ditto for when you are learning how to shoot from an instructor at a range. Safety of everyone around you is paramount, not listening to what you are being told is one way to find yourself within crossfire when out in the bush or making a fool out of yourself on the range. I have real issues with the term "accidental discharge" as I have yet to see a gun, rifle or handgun/pistol fire itself. It is usually someone not paying attention that fires them - sometimes with tragic results. Know how to engage and disengage the SAFETY function on your weapon first.

7) Have you ever bush walked? That in itself is a lost skill for many people. When hunting you walk a lot slower than say if you are hiking, and you keep as quiet as you can. It is magical when the nature of where you are, springs to life if you stay still enough, and I must say, the best memories of the times I went shooting as a kid with my Dad are often of the wildlife we didn't shoot at and me seeing them up front and close. You will gain an appreciation of the wild animals, their survival instincts are phenominal and their senses are so freaking fantastic, you wonder how humans ever managed to make the first millenium, as we are so inadequate in comparison.

8. There is a difference between 'hunting' and being chased by a wild animal in fear of your life. Most animals will avoid human contact, a lot detest us. They will do what they can to keep away a lot of the time. But your guide and even yourself should be alert when in the bush, this isn't a walk in the park, and should be looking for signs of animals about nearby. I cannot think of anything more tragic than clumsily stomping on a bear's nuts when he was taking a kip in the midday sun in the long grass  :doh:. That scenario probably wouldn't happen tho, as the bear would have heard and scented you long before. But you get my point? You, the hunter, have to find them. A lot of animals stink, that should be a good clue you are getting too close, as well as the fresh urine smell, droppings and broken foliage. Steaming turds means you are very close......

 

[Cletus]

There are lunatic arseholes with guns walking the streets everywhere. What we've found is that if the sane, law-abiding folks also have guns, the lunatics are kept at bay. You need to be able to defend yourself, otherwise the lunatics have the upper hand, which is unacceptable. The criminal element will always have guns; that's a given. They don't obey the law and they appreciate overwhelming force. That's why they seek out guns. They make it dramatically easier for them to get their way. But, outside of a few truly and outrageously insane psychopaths, the survival instinct is intact and a criminal won't target someone they think is going to defend themselves with potentially lethal force.

Don't get me wrong - I'm not trying to talk you into obtaining a gun. If they frighten you or you believe they're too dangerous keep at hand, then by all means, stay away from them. You might inadvertently hurt yourself or others. But, don't fool yourself into thinking they're anything but tools. And like most tools, if you aren't schooled in their use, you can do a great deal of unintentional damage. So, either get educated/trained, or stay away from them. That's for your own as well as everybody else's good.

I'll simply say I disagree, as do most people in my country and most of the western world. America is free to decide it's own rules and I'm not going to circumbscribe those.

 

[-CB-]

Believe what you like, I simply invite you to look at the murder rates in similar countries to the U.S. (England and Australia), compare their levels of gun ownership, and their levels of gun related deaths. Guns are undeniably a negative in society. Sorry.

Believe what you like, but in US states that have instituted procedures to allow citizens to carry arms in public, violent crime has decreased - including murder, rape, armed robbery, etc.

 

[m4rk0]

Plus I'm not sure what the laws are here in the states for non US citizens visiting the US shooting or possessing firearms.

I guess I should give it a try, so you know
I was never a particular gun lover, but it is part of American culture.. Plus, I like the fact that (unlike in other countries) not only the bad guys own guns, but good people do too..
I also like the fact that you can legally shoot intruders without getting in trouble.. if you hurt a burglar in Holland or England, you'll get sued and locked up!!! it's crazy!

 

[nexrex]

fellow australian here. banning all guns is never going to be the answer. for law enforment officers (my soon to be career) they are definately required.

anyway i have two words for you "zombie apocalypse". its gonna happen someday, and then that shotgun that you handed in is going to seem pretty damn useful.  :laughing7:

 

[Nando Vallart]

There is also a tsunami of evidence that those countires that don't have guns have a vastly less murders. Sorry, had to get the last word in and not allow a bad argument stand.

Did you ever came to the third world?

If you don't like guns and hunting, WTF do you enter in a topic about it? People like and won't care about you don't liking trying to say to us stop it (or don't start it, in my case)
If you didn't know, I'll tell you THE FIRST LAW of doing fine on internet forums: If the topic is about something that you don't like, DON'T ANSWER...


Thanks Andreas and Curtis, I'll think about that!
And in deed I believe that (liking or disliking) the part of taking the fur and cutting the whole thing would be in... You're hunting to eat, have the fur to make clothes, etc...

Thanks for your post, Pete! I'm thinking in hunt... The part of planning it to 2 or 3 years ahead is not only monetary, but to get my shoulder Ok and practicise a little here shooting in a Club.

Of course that if my shoulder doesn't get good all the thing would go down, the same if the shooting teacher says I can't kill a mouse with a 12 gauge shotgun in 1 meter distance :laughing7:
And yes, I say Camp because there all that stuff that you say and I just won't know... It's not something that you learn reading a book, but going hunting many times with someone saying what is good and what is bad to do...
About the bear, I was thinking that people had the rifle with scope and something like a .50 Desert Eagle with lots of bullets in the case you wrong the first shoot and it turns to your way...

Plus I'm not sure what the laws are here in the states for non US citizens visiting the US shooting or possessing firearms.

I guess I should give it a try, so you know
I was never a particular gun lover, but it is part of American culture.. Plus, I like the fact that (unlike in other countries) not only the bad guys own guns, but good people do too..
I also like the fact that you can legally shoot intruders without getting in trouble.. if you hurt a burglar in Holland or England, you'll get sued and locked up!!! it's crazy!

+1, here you can get in trouble too... You'd have to prove that the guy had a gun, you saw it and you shoot when he was entering your house... Also 5 rounds in the head is not accepted here as "warning shots" :laughing7:
If you shoot someone without gun or running away, they'll lock you by murdering...

Thanks for all answers guys

 

[lafromla1]

I'd be curious to know the statistics in the US showing the numbers of murders that were gun related to the number of drunk driving murders (yes, driving drunk and killing someone is murder since that person chose to drink and drive, it wasn't forced upon them) over the past 10 years (taking out accidental gun deaths and accidental (sober) vehicular deaths).

Just remember, if you remove all guns from society, people that want to attack someone will use something else (i.e. rock, stick, pole, scissors, knives, etc...).  Guns don't shoot themselves.  It's the f'd up people in society that are the problem.

BTW, If anyone knows of a good used .308 for sale, I may be interested.  :laughing7: Going to GA for some deer hunting in late December.

 

[hannaugh]

I wish the news would broadcast that on average, every woman over 18 owns 2 guns.  Even if it wasn't true, if that was big news, you know the rape numbers would go down.  No one wants to get shot in the balls.