Burnishing Raw Necks

[Jumble Jumble]

Also, it's very easy when we're talking about one single thing to say "Jeff Beck could play great on any (neck finish|body weight|bridge arrangement|material of threaded neck insert*|nut material|potentiometer value)".

But could he really play great on an instrument that had the worst of all of those? A guitar is pretty much equal to the sum of its parts, so yes when you're looking at an individual part then you can always stand to lose a little. But stick with that attitude and soon you'll have what experts call "a POS".



* Stubby, I'm sure it was you telling us we should get steel over brass, just in case. What do you think would happen if you asked Robben Ford about that?

 

[Cagey]

... stick with that attitude and soon you'll have what experts call "a POS".

A "Point Of Sale"? :icon_biggrin:

 

[Doug Bryan]

That looks great, but just make sure as always that you do not leave it in a dry area for any extended period of time. Also you may want to consider nourishing the wood with something that will soak in but not take away that silky smooth feel. On a harder wood such as maple I use Birchwood Casey Tru Oil followed by their Wax.

Great looking neck!! :kewlpics:

 

[Brent Gable]

Interesting subject. It reminds me of when I was growing up and we had a pool table. As my brothers and I got more proficient at the game my dad would buy us better and better pool cues. The better the cue the less finish seemed to be on it and the slicker they were to shoot with. At some point we stopped using talcum powder on them and used an ultra fine 3M pad to keep them super slick. I come from a wood working background and this may sound weird but when I do a raw wood item that I want to burnish, usually figured maple or tropical hardwood I sand up to 2000 grit and then I do the final "polish" with an ordinary brown grocery bag and lots of elbow grease. Sounds crazy but it really does take it to the next level.

 

[AutoBat]

That looks great, but just make sure as always that you do not leave it in a dry area for any extended period of time. Also you may want to consider nourishing the wood with something that will soak in but not take away that silky smooth feel. On a harder wood such as maple I use Birchwood Casey Tru Oil followed by their Wax.

Great looking neck!! :kewlpics:

If you use Tru Oil it's no longer a raw neck. Tru Oil is a hard finish, despite its name.  Although I do agree that it is an excellent choice for maple.

 

[stubhead]

I think that "nourishing" thing was what tonar does with the raw linseed oil. But not gooping it on, then scraping it off. The raw stuff doesn't "set", which is why you'd not want to soak it too long - you just end up with soggy wood, albeit oil-soggy rather than water. When I read a finishing procedure that has that involved - putting on an extra-thick layer, then scraping it off - I can't help but wonder if that's some adaptation from a high-volume production line, and maybe furniture at that.

 

[mystique1]

Played the first gig last night with my Wenge/Ebony neck on chambered Swamp Ash body Strat. I noticed this morning that the Wenge grain had lifted a tiny bit in the lower positions, and so out came the 1000/1500/2000 grit wet and dry sandpaper. I spent no more than half an hour gently sanding it, and now the neck is super smooth and a good bit shinier. Thanks to Patrick from Davies for pointing me in the direction of this thread.

 

[KrisRichmond]

I followed the advice on here and sanded my neck to 3000.  I sanded for about 10 mins, then rubbed down with damp cloth, then sanded again for 10 mins, I repeated this process with each grit.  Then I gave it a light oil and it was looking and feeling great.  I played it like that for about a month, then I repeated the process with 2000 and 3000 grit and reoiled.  It is now about as smooth as I think Wenge can get and it looks fantastic. 
It has made a big difference to the look of the neck, It is now lighter and the grain is a lot more pronounced.
Big thanks to everyone on here for the info.

I also took the finish off the back and headstock of an old maple neck guitar and sanded it to 3000 as well.  The maple is mow possibly the smoothest thing I have ever touched.  It gets played daily and I live in Australia, so far it is still strait, and if it stays that way through an Queensland summer I will be ordering a Warmoth maple neck and doing the same to that.

Couldn't post the picture, so here is a link:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/100566751@N02/9560837338/

 

[Updown]

I followed the advice on here and sanded my neck to 3000. 
Big thanks to everyone on here for the info.

Good stuff  :icon_thumright:  ..... another happy  :toothy10:

Be interesting how the Maple goes, keep us informed please.
I know how the Queensland summer can be, i'm in NSW.
Cheers neighbour 
ccasion14:

 

[Steve St.Laurent]

I think this may be the best place to ask my question.  Now that I've felt the heaven that is a raw neck (Bocote sanded to a polish as stated in this thread) the neck on my strat has really lost it's luster.  It's a maple neck with a vintage tint satin finish.  I've played it enough that it's polished the finish to a gloss and I don't like how sticky it is.  I love the look of the vintage tint and am looking for something as close as I can get in a raw finish.

It looks like Canary is as close as I'm going to get to the vintage tint finish.  Has anyone here sand polished a canary neck and a bocote neck and can compare the feel?  Will the canary neck feel as slick as my bocote neck?  Thanks in advance for any input you can give.

-Steve

 

[Cagey]

I can't say about the Bocote, but the canary neck I put on the L5S got that treatment and came out excellent. Smooth as silk, and no finish to wear/chip/scratch/discolor. Here are some shots where you can see the original, then the reflection after it's been polished...

 

[Updown]

Will the canary neck feel as slick as my bocote neck? 

After the same process.
Simple answer .... YES

When you 1st got the Bocote.
I bet it had a Fluffy feel to it ?  ..... mine did.
The Canary is way smoother to start with compared to Bocote. Even thou they are ALL factory sanded to 220.

Do what this thread is all about on ANY RAW neck, and you will find they all, can be slick as .....
Well all mine are  :icon_biggrin:

(I can't speak about necks that have had a finish, that's a different kettle of fish)

The tightest grip you'll ever need to use on the neck after giving it the treatment in this thread.
Is when you pick it up out of a stand.  :laughing7:

 

[elgravos]

Just reporting in after finishing the polish job on my new wenge neck. As per the pics, it works just fine on wenge.  I've got it mirror smooth. I kind of mixed up all the recommendations on the thread to get to the end result.

I used the 3M polishing paper that Cagey recommended and threw in a 2400 micro-mesh pad in there as well (equivalent to 900 grit - 12 microns) as the polishing paper skips straight from 600 to 1200 and I thought it might be good to have something in between the two. I also used a soft foam pad behind the paper at times when I really wanted to power in length wise and make sure I got over the heel and headstock joints without hindrance.

Couple of things worth noting:  I really like the 3M polishing pads though it's a shame they're missing a 900/1000 grit.  You can work those dry.  Though there are some conversion charts out there, I find that they are not all that accurate.  Even when you go by the micron measurements, the polishing paper just doesn't "cut" as much as it's equivalent "regular" sandpaper.  For example, I bought some 3M 2000 grit wetordry paper which I thought I would use to finish the neck off.  Turns out, that cut in way more than the 1200 3M rated polishing paper (i.e. light blue 9 micron / 1200 grit).  I had to forget about that, go back to the 1200 to recover the finish.  After that I figured I'd just go to the pink 3 micron (4000 grit) paper for a while (i.e. 30 minutes) and that worked out just fine.

Here's the low down on my approach:

3M Polishing Paper - Green (400 / 30 microns): 30 minutes - dry
3M Polishing Paper - Gray (600 / 15 microns): 30 minutes - dry
Micro-Mesh 2400 (900 / 12 microns): 30 minutes - wet (this paper cuts more than the 3M and loads up really fast so dry sanding is not an option)
3M Polishing Paper - Light Blue (1200 /9 microns): 30 minutes - dry
3M 2000 wetordry paper - 5 minutes - wet - I think this was not necessarily worthwhile, it was in my opinion a step back and equivalent to the 900 micro-mesh from a "cut" standpoint.  It did allow me to catch any final "rough grain spots" that subsisted so maybe it was of some use.
3M Polishing Paper - Light Blue (1200 /9 microns): 20 minutes - dry - had to go back to the 1200 to recover from my experiment with the 2000 paper.
3M Polishing Paper - Pink (4000 /3 microns): 30 minutes - everyone says this level is unnecessary and they are probably right if you have a 2000 paper that is less abrasive than the 3M wetordry paper I used...  I found this helped bring out the final shine.  The paper did load up a little bit, not enough to rinse, so it was still catching something.

The results speak for themselves.  By the time I was done with the 900 I was already blown away.  Even my wife is impressed.  Can't wait to take on the rosewood neck on my telepaul.

Thanks to everyone who contributed to this thread.

 

[Updown]

Just reporting in after finishing the polish job on my new wenge neck.

Even my wife is impressed. 
Thanks to everyone who contributed to this thread.

And ..... Thanks for reporting in, and the details on how you went about it  :icon_thumright: .... another happy  :toothy10:

No wonder the wife likes it, great job your've done there.    :headbang:

There where some doubting how it would work on Wenge, you have just shown them.  :icon_biggrin:
The Rosewood will come up great too.
I got both those, and other RAW ones done.

 

[elgravos]

Cheers Updown.  This thread is what the forum is all about.  Can't think of another one that has made as many happy campers  ccasion14:

 

[stubhead]

That "grit equivalency" stuff is kinda weird. In addition to all the different manufacturers having somewhat different ideas about which "numbers" correspond to which... micron size? ...of grit? Are they measuring the entire abrasive particle - diameter... or just the protruding size  -circumference? Sounds hopeless nerdy, dweebish, nitpicking & anal - but anybody who's had to backtrack could stand to know that (thas' everybody, ya frickbooters... :evil4

I am also convinced, by my own evidence, that sometimes, on some certain materials, a finer grit may actually remove more material-per-swipe than a coarser grit, even from the SAME MANUFACTURER!!!

Sounds hopelessly dwerbishanitnal, but the only thing I can think of is that it may have to do with the size of "sand" that just rolls over finish molecules (big), and which size "locks" into them (smaller) and slices them instead. In general, I find that 150 grit removes less material than 220 grit, and the 150 seems better suited to just scratch stuff up.  :icon_scratch: And wet sanding, for some weird reason... 400 wet is far smoother than 600 dry, and again I can only figure that the liquid lube is "floating" the 400 grit up higher off the surface. To make it effectively an 800 grit?

I have a woeful old Yamaha bass neck that somebody gave me with a busted truss rod with that good ol' 1980's REAL THICK plastic finish, and I just scrape off a patch and use it to test grits and dyes and things before they get to the good stuff. It's starting to look pretty weird.

 

[Cagey]

I am also convinced, by my own evidence, that sometimes, on some certain materials, a finer grit may actually remove more material-per-swipe than a coarser grit, even from the SAME MANUFACTURER!!!

Sounds hopelessly dwerbishanitnal, but the only thing I can think of is that it may have to do with the size of "sand" that just rolls over finish molecules (big), and which size "locks" into them (smaller) and slices them instead. In general, I find that 150 grit removes less material than 220 grit, and the 150 seems better suited to just scratch stuff up.  :icon_scratch: And wet sanding, for some weird reason... 400 wet is far smoother than 600 dry, and again I can only figure that the liquid lube is "floating" the 400 grit up higher off the surface. To make it effectively an 800 grit?

I've noticed the same thing, and I suspect that it's because in certain ranges, with a finer grit you have more cutting surfaces per square inch. Also, the cutting edges dull as they break under use, so if you have fewer of them, any loss in cutting power is more easily noticed. Then, it depends what you're sanding. Removed particles can be abrasive, albeit less so than the rocks or oxides the sandpaper is made of, so they help cut the surface up to a point. If they're too fine, they just wad up and clog the paper and nothing good gets done. That's where water and a little lubricant comes in handy. Keeps the particles from clogging up the paper, so it stays effective longer.

 

[KrisRichmond]

Cagey,  Did you manage to get the frets in that Canry neck without damaging the work you did polishing the fret board?

 

[Cagey]

Yes. Once they were installed and bevelled, I masked the fretboard off to do the end dressing and polishing. Otherwise, that would have wrecked the surface. Even on very hard woods such as Ebony, you can't sand against the grain without it being obvious.

 

[KrisRichmond]

Cool, I am thinking of polishing the fretboard on my next guitar.  Might have to practice installing frets on a beater first