Wishlist disappeared?
- Thread starter rooser53
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electric__steve
Junior Member
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Yeah, it seems like I can't have more than one item in the wishlist at a time. Add something, and it replaces whatever was in there.
NedRyerson
Senior Member
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Yeah, I'd call that a bug. 
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It's intentional. Wishlists on the Warmoth site are a huge problem, so we have had to limit them. This is because so many of our products are one-of-a-kind. If someone puts something on their wishlist, and another person buys it, what happens then? Answer: pandemonium.
A massive percentage of the products we sell are simple products with a quantity of 1. The Qty drops to 0 when sold, and never, ever gets "restocked". It just floats around forever in the database, like an asteroid in deep space waiting to strike a planet and end all life. It's a pickle.
For example, person #1 specs out a body and includes a Unique Choice lam top. Then person #2 comes along and buys a body they spec that includes the same UC lam top. A month later person #1 goes to their wish list and puts their body in their cart. Now the best-case scenario is Warmoth will double-sell a UC lam-top, and somebody is going to be pissed they didn't get what they wanted. What actually happens is an error on the second order prevents it from entering our production queue, so no one even knows about it until two months later when the customer calls to check up. Additionally, the order person #2 placed that was already underway also gets messed up. (Please don't ask me how I know this.)
Similar complications exist with any item from the showcase that gets put on a wish list.
Now I hear what you're saying: "If person #2 buys a showcase item that was in person #1's wish list, then it should simply be removed from their wish list. Easy-peasy. And they are right...that could be done. However, Unique Choice items aren't sold as a single product. They are sold as a line-item option within the larger product of a body or neck. Essentially a product inside a product.
On a personal note: This is one of those Dunning-Kruger-type things that never even occurs to outside web developers as they are criticizing our website. And there are about a thousand more.
A massive percentage of the products we sell are simple products with a quantity of 1. The Qty drops to 0 when sold, and never, ever gets "restocked". It just floats around forever in the database, like an asteroid in deep space waiting to strike a planet and end all life. It's a pickle.
For example, person #1 specs out a body and includes a Unique Choice lam top. Then person #2 comes along and buys a body they spec that includes the same UC lam top. A month later person #1 goes to their wish list and puts their body in their cart. Now the best-case scenario is Warmoth will double-sell a UC lam-top, and somebody is going to be pissed they didn't get what they wanted. What actually happens is an error on the second order prevents it from entering our production queue, so no one even knows about it until two months later when the customer calls to check up. Additionally, the order person #2 placed that was already underway also gets messed up. (Please don't ask me how I know this.)
Similar complications exist with any item from the showcase that gets put on a wish list.
Now I hear what you're saying: "If person #2 buys a showcase item that was in person #1's wish list, then it should simply be removed from their wish list. Easy-peasy. And they are right...that could be done. However, Unique Choice items aren't sold as a single product. They are sold as a line-item option within the larger product of a body or neck. Essentially a product inside a product.
On a personal note: This is one of those Dunning-Kruger-type things that never even occurs to outside web developers as they are criticizing our website. And there are about a thousand more.
Last edited:
stratamania
Mythical Status
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Dunning Kruger effect refers to those who have a cognitive bias to think they are smarter than they are.
electric__steve
Junior Member
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Pandemonium? Dunning Kruger? Warmoth's unhappy customer #2 is gonna go Freddy Kruger on poor Aaron! That's the real reason he fled Puyallup!
"However, Unique Choice items aren't sold as a single product. They are sold as a line-item option within the larger product of a body or neck. Essentially a product inside a product."
I totally get where you're coming from. I'm an IT guy, and I feel like I understand how complex software can be. And I'm sure there are extra challenges for a smallish company running its own ecommerce website that may be partially or fully custom developed. Still, the problems that you describe still need to be fixed. And it's certainly fixable; it's just software, and the database has all the data. Whether it's easy, or high-priority for Warmoth / their web team is another matter entirely.
Honestly, it might be less confusing if Warmoth were to disable the wishlist feature entirely until the issue is sorted out.
"However, Unique Choice items aren't sold as a single product. They are sold as a line-item option within the larger product of a body or neck. Essentially a product inside a product."
I totally get where you're coming from. I'm an IT guy, and I feel like I understand how complex software can be. And I'm sure there are extra challenges for a smallish company running its own ecommerce website that may be partially or fully custom developed. Still, the problems that you describe still need to be fixed. And it's certainly fixable; it's just software, and the database has all the data. Whether it's easy, or high-priority for Warmoth / their web team is another matter entirely.
Honestly, it might be less confusing if Warmoth were to disable the wishlist feature entirely until the issue is sorted out.
S
Spud
Guest
I think we can all live without a wishlist.
Rick
Epic Member
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I saw dunning kruger on the bbc, and they were talking in the context of smart people, about how smart people think they are stupidier than they really are. But the inverse makes sense too. Boy does the inverse make sense, have you ever been on Jury duty in the USA?
bagman67
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The Dunning Kruger phenomenon is associated with people not being able to assess their own competence or knowledge accurately. For many this means that once they know a little about something, they mistakenly believe they know and understand more than they actually do. And as their experience increases, they realize how much bigger the subject is than they did when they thought they were on top of it - and they thus underestimate their own competence/comprehension. And finally, over time, assuming ongoing learning and experience accrue, the true masters recognize what they know, and what they don't, and can make allowances for uncertainty.
Where Dunning-Kruger crops up in recent popular psychology is in the form of folks who have learned something on Google, or from their cousin's uncle who's an awesome guitar tech, or whatever, and then they never learn more. And so they are stuck at the early stage: Their understanding is far less complete than they think, and their confidence is far greater than their understanding merits.
I'm reminded of an old bumper sticker: TEENAGERS: MOVE OUT NOW WHILE YOU STILL KNOW EVERYTHING.
Where Dunning-Kruger crops up in recent popular psychology is in the form of folks who have learned something on Google, or from their cousin's uncle who's an awesome guitar tech, or whatever, and then they never learn more. And so they are stuck at the early stage: Their understanding is far less complete than they think, and their confidence is far greater than their understanding merits.
I'm reminded of an old bumper sticker: TEENAGERS: MOVE OUT NOW WHILE YOU STILL KNOW EVERYTHING.
S
Spud
Guest
I am old enough to know I am true master of nothing. (though procrastination could be getting close)
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Yes, the "Dunning-Kruger effect" is the tendency humans have to overestimate our ability at things we only have a little knowledge of, or skill at.
DK statements usually sound like: "If the department of transportation wants to ease traffic on the roads, all they have to do is...."
- or -
"If we want men and women to be paid equally for the same work all we have to do is...."
When in actuality the issues are much more nuanced, and smart people who have spent their whole lives studying those things struggle with the solutions.
The more our knowledge of a topic grows, the more we realize how difficult the thing really is, and how much less we know than we thought we did.
At the extreme other end of the curve are experts who have spent their whole lives studying something, and drastically underestimate their skill.
DK statements usually sound like: "If the department of transportation wants to ease traffic on the roads, all they have to do is...."
- or -
"If we want men and women to be paid equally for the same work all we have to do is...."
When in actuality the issues are much more nuanced, and smart people who have spent their whole lives studying those things struggle with the solutions.
The more our knowledge of a topic grows, the more we realize how difficult the thing really is, and how much less we know than we thought we did.
At the extreme other end of the curve are experts who have spent their whole lives studying something, and drastically underestimate their skill.
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Yes they do, and we are working on it every day. Hoping for early 2023 launch.
NedRyerson
Senior Member
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I definitely appreciate the background info, and it makes sense. But all you really should do is......
(sorry, couldn't resist
)
Or "Warmoth should just hire more people?"
(sorry, couldn't resist
)Or "Warmoth should just hire more people?"
rooser53
Newbie
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Wow... I didn't realize I was the only one using the wishlist for a specific purpose... I understand the technical side of the problem having developed a lot of websites (problems that I had to figure out) but the way the wishlist worked i.e. I go to my list and it shows item "sold out" I remove that item from my list. Not sure why that item is not just added to the live orders and purchased? Or how the wishlist is created from something other than inventory?
...the amount of bodies and necks that are displayed on the site... that I have to review looking for the specs I want, requires a lot of time. Adding the notes on weight, neck heel, grain etc. is a lot of work, but the only way I can keep up with prospective build parts so-to-speak. I'm looking for specific stuff and frankly, that's one of the best things about Warmoth from a building standpoint. When I started building guitars from Warmoth parts, I spec'd out exactly what the weight needs to be for a neck and bodies to hit a target weight for a build... I'm now going to have to build a database to note part no. and specs and add an image field to do what the wishlist used to do.
I hope the wishlist isn't removed entirely as it was a "useful" and integral part of the Warmoth company to me. But that's as a builder of guitars not a one-off "partscaster" customer.
...the amount of bodies and necks that are displayed on the site... that I have to review looking for the specs I want, requires a lot of time. Adding the notes on weight, neck heel, grain etc. is a lot of work, but the only way I can keep up with prospective build parts so-to-speak. I'm looking for specific stuff and frankly, that's one of the best things about Warmoth from a building standpoint. When I started building guitars from Warmoth parts, I spec'd out exactly what the weight needs to be for a neck and bodies to hit a target weight for a build... I'm now going to have to build a database to note part no. and specs and add an image field to do what the wishlist used to do.
I hope the wishlist isn't removed entirely as it was a "useful" and integral part of the Warmoth company to me. But that's as a builder of guitars not a one-off "partscaster" customer.
rooser53
Newbie
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Update... I knocked out a quick database with the wishlist features for myself. I have to do some additional work creating and saving the images but it functions for what I used the wishlist for. Hopefully it's fixed and/or updated as I think it's a useful tool for us builder types. Onward.
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