Threaded inserts - neck/body attachment

[-CB-]

There's a company called McFeeleys that has STAINLESS inserts.  Nice stuff.

 

[tfcreative]

Ok, I'm looking into this for my current 5-string bass build. I'm looking at the following, but could use the experience of those that have gone before:

http://www.mcfeelys.com/product/3604-STS/10-24-Steel-Threaded-Inserts

http://www.mcfeelys.com/product/3604-SRT/10-24-Stainless-Steel-Threaded-Inserts

The stainless ones look like they won't have that much bite, but I don't know the danger of hitting a stiffening bar with the straight steel inserts. Any input on this?

 

[SkuttleFunk]

both of those require a 15/32" drill size - OK for a 5-string, but too big for a guitar or 4-string IMO

take a look again at the mystery insert in my first image of this thread. there is enough wall thickness for solid threading of the screw, but nothing excessive like is found on many of the heavy duty inserts like EZ-Lok makes.

I'm not sitting where I have access to measure the inserts I utilize until this weekend

all the best,

R

 

[tfcreative]

both of those require a 15/32" drill size - OK for a 5-string, but too big for a guitar or 4-string IMO

Sounds like you're favoring the stainless (which is actually a 9/32 drill size after I checked again). Do you see any issue with the 3/8" length - it seems fine to me, but I've never done this.

One other question: do you use ferrules on the body for the machine screws that go into the inserts?

 

[SkuttleFunk]

3/8" long seems about right if my memory serves me ... and yes, I definitely prefer the smaller diameter insert

I did not use ferrules as I prefer the neck plate for a more even distribution of the clamping load

all the best,

R

 

[RobSm]

how much clearance do you have between the mounting hole centerline and the edge of the neck?

all the best,

rR

...there are 5/15" from the centre of hole to the egde of the neck...

 

[dm251z]

Hey folks,

I asked the guys at Warmoth, and they said that installing threaded inserts would void the warranty.  So, do you still think it's worth doing?

thanks

 

[SkuttleFunk]

I just re-read the Warmoth warranty page, and I don't catch where installing inserts voids the warranty. maybe someone from Warmoth could point to the text that is being referred to so we can know the technical side of this

all the best,

R

 

[dm251z]

I didn't see it on their warranty page, but the guy that I spoke to is Brian Eckels (eckels@warmoth.com)

 

[rahimiiii]

I just re-read the Warmoth warranty page, and I don't catch where installing inserts voids the warranty. maybe someone from Warmoth could point to the text that is being referred to so we can know the technical side of this

all the best,

R

Anytime you modify something beyond its design you will most likely void the warranty. Installing threaded insert isn't part of the normal expected things you'd do to a Warmoth neck but applying a finish is. Same thing if you pull out the fret and replace it...

 

[Wyliee]

I just re-read the Warmoth warranty page, and I don't catch where installing inserts voids the warranty. maybe someone from Warmoth could point to the text that is being referred to so we can know the technical side of this

all the best,

R

Anytime you modify something beyond its design you will most likely void the warranty. Installing threaded insert isn't part of the normal expected things you'd do to a Warmoth neck but applying a finish is. Same thing if you pull out the fret and replace it...

Exactly.  Installing inserts, doweling/redrilling, etc... would be considered a modification of the neck and not covered under the warranty.  I've seen several necks where the customer had the mounting holes omitted, drilled their own (clearly too small), mounted the neck and split the heel.  Operations such as this would not be warrantied.

 

[dm251z]

yikes   the thought of splitting the heel of my new warmoth neck gives me chills and goosebumps.  I think maybe this modification isn't that important for the first couple times I install the neck.

 

[SkuttleFunk]

I can see cracking a heel not being covered, no prob.

how about the remainder of the neck - is the warranty void for the entire neck including warpage, glue joints, wood stability, fret work, etc ... would the warranty be completely void, even for an issue that is totally unrelated to the inserts?

all the best,

R

 

[Wyliee]

Tough question.  Let's say something goes wrong, warranty terms are repair or replace at manufacturer's descretion.  (This is a common phrase in warranties, BTW. )

.hmmm .. much stuff written and deleted trying to write up a cognizant answer...  ... really tough question as there are so many possible scenarios ...

Best I can offer is the inserts, just like any post sale finish work, fret work, decals, etc... would not be repaired/replaced under warranty.  If the modifications caused whatever the problem is, I could see it voiding the warranty.

 

[SkuttleFunk]

Tough question.  Let's say something goes wrong, warranty terms are repair or replace at manufacturer's descretion.  (This is a common phrase in warranties, BTW. )

.hmmm .. much stuff written and deleted trying to write up a cognizant answer...  ... really tough question as there are so many possible scenarios ...

Best I can offer is the inserts, just like any post sale finish work, fret work, decals, etc... would not be repaired/replaced under warranty.  If the modifications caused whatever the problem is, I could see it voiding the warranty.

that is a totally fair assessment that I can completely agree with and stand behind. I can completely take responsibility for my work and any impact it may have on the original neck I purchased. I would still think that any warranty claim would require that Warmoth have the opportunity to inspect the neck and make a full assessment before any kind of agreed warranty remedy could be worked out.


it's definitely NOT Warmoth's fault if a neck cracks at the heel due to a poor insert installation (location, materials, technique, etc ...), and I would expect to have a claim that definitely is caused by this to be rejected.

it is upstanding and to be commended if the warranty claim is honored for something else that is completely unrelated to the inserts  :icon_thumright:


I also realize that this is just your unofficial comments here, and that this conversation will in no way hold Warmoth accountable to adhering to what we're discussing. thanks for speaking so freely and for giving us such a well thought out and open response!

all the best,

R

 

[snowblind56]

This is the way they taught us to build a bolt-on at Roberto-Venn.

 

[Alfang]

Having read this entire post, I am now wondering, how many warranty claims does Warmoth deal with?

I would think probably not many, and if thats the case, thats means they make some good shiite, and if it's so good, we as idiots, owe it to the industry to push the damn envelope and install threaded inserts and use oils to finnish our necks, and to order a $5.00 part and pay $25.00

and if they fail, stfu and buy another one.

 

[simple]

how many warranty claims does Warmoth deal with?

Very few considering the number of bodies and necks that ship from Warmoth everyday.

Hey Snowblind56, we have a couple of RV guys here at Warmoth.

 

[snowblind56]

I was planning on applying at Warmoth, but after I was done with school I was unable to afford to go out there to interview.  Now, I ended up getting a job using my business degree that I received before I went to R-V.  The fire still burns inside for guitars though.  The sales job that is advertised on the website has me intrigued though.  I would also end up spending my entire paychecks on Warmoth products.

 

[Xplorervoodoo]

Back to the threaded insert topic for a sec...

I saw a "zinc alloy threaded neck insert kit" on www.onyxforgeguitars.com.  It seems pretty reasonable to me, though I remember you mentioning that larger diameter holes could jeopardize the neck...  In your experience, do you think that a 15/64" hole is too large for a guitar neck?