D and G strings get lost in a live environment...

[JNRYJD]

So Im on to my third set of pickups on my Jazz bass and have had the same problem across all three sets, so Im pretty sure it's not the pickups fault any more.

What's happening is the D and G strings simply have no presence in a live environment. The bass sounds amazing on it's own but on stage, when there's drums and guitar, the E and A stings are full and present but the D and G have no definition. I've raised the pickups near the D and G stings and lowered them near the E and A but still no cure.

It's a chambered swamp ash body and a maple neck but I wouldn't have though the neck or body would have any impact on the presence of the strings.

The only thing I can think of is that perhaps the passive controls are the problem? I have no idea how but I cant think of anything else...

Any opinions or experience with this?
It's driving me mad cos the bass is an absolute beast on it's own but put it on stage and it's frustrating...

 

[swarfrat]

You need ... Moar Power!

 

[JNRYJD]

Ha ha - We ALWAYS need more power!
I also need to work out whats wrong with this damn thing

 

[Cagey]

There may be nothing wrong with the bass at all.

When you're one of a group of disparate instruments, there's usually some overlap of frequencies they'll each occupy. Where that occurrs, those frequencies can get blurred. Sometimes, that's desirable to some extent. Other times, not so much. For instance, in a rock band, the bass and the drums have some overlap, while the guitar and the cymbals will have some. Vocals have to fit in there someplace. So, the sound guy has to equalize each sound source so it occupies its own space in the spectrum in order for it all to sound even. Usually, each player gets his own monitor and gets fed just what he needs to hear, rather than the whole package that the audience hears. Otherwise, he can't hear himself clearly and gets lost, and the rest of the band thinks he's a dingbat.

There's also what's called the "Fletcher-Munson Curve", which illustrates how the human ear responds to sounds at different frequencies and sound pressure levels. You'll often hear of guys who get their sound all perfect, then show up at practice and complain that it sounds terrible. The only difference is the volume you're playing at. If you set it up at low volume, then crank it, it'll be wrong.

It can be tricky business, which is why there are people who specialize in that sort of thing. It's not enough to know how all the knobs work. I'm not a sound guy, so I can't tell you how to fix it, only that the phenomena exists. Hopefully, someone will chime in with more specific advice.

 

[TBurst Std]

KG has great points.
My 1st Q is, how do you know its lost?
Is that FOH or in your mix?

 

[swarfrat]

I was only HALF joking.

 

[fdesalvo]

I've noticed the same phenomena in the recording environment and it comes down to what KG said - I'd wager you are fighting the guitar/vocals on the higher strings.  Your FOH guy should be EQ'ing in addition to setting levels.  You each need your own slice of the frequency band, but inevitability there will be a bit of overlap.

 

[Fat Pete]

Lots of good points already and lots of variables too. Further to TBurst Std's question, who says they're getting lost - you/the rest of the band/the audience? Try playing some bum notes and you'll find out if others can hear you ok!

What are you getting on stage - backline/monitor/FOH?

Is it definitely a string balance issue - if you play the same notes that seem lost on the D or G, but up the neck on the E or A do they seem to come through better? If they do, maybe a bit of experimentation with string gauges?

What compression are you using?

 

[JNRYJD]

KG has great points.
My 1st Q is, how do you know its lost?
Is that FOH or in your mix?

Look at this stage Im confident in saying it is a definite issue with the bass. Ive had many basses and none have had the inconsistencies that this one has. There are lots of gigs I do where the only thing getting mic'd is the vocals and horns and I've never had a problem being heard with other jazz basses.

I loaned it to another bassist at a gig last weekend and she said the same thing without me mentioning it ie that the D and G are thin and get lost in the mix whilst the E and A are fantastic. She mentioned trying thicker guage strings so maybe I'll try .105, .85, .70 and .55 and see if that makes a difference.

If I play higher notes on the E and A they're nice and prominent...

I dont usually use a compressor. But I have one so I'll see how it sounds...

Oh and whilst I think of it, we have some recurring gigs at loyal venues and so it's a venue where I have had great sound before with different basses but this one aint cutting it...

Could it have anything to do with the chambered body?
Im thinking of buying a cheap prewired set of pots and caps etc on ebay just to see if that makes any difference...