This is a Warmoth?!?

Warmoth is a business, those selling on Ebay are not and in not beingg a licensed and insured business can come and go at will
those on craigs list may not be a business, but you have the ability to see and handle the item first
now say my arguments are full of rhetoric if you want, but as I said, you still all have this list of things to do before you decide to trust the guy and buy

that is the issue I bring up, you guys have to decide if you are going to trust the guys, and why? Because you all know I am correct, it is easy to get scammed on ebay.

whether you ever do business there again is not the issue here, I hope you continue a long and successful career of business there. The issue is you refuse to admit it is full of scammers and get upset when I point it out.  So what if it is, you all are using a list of ways to protect yourselves. And you all feel as long as you do you will never have an issue.

I just find it HILARIOUS how far you all go not to admit what I say.
 
it is not that I can't, it is that I choose not too.

Like I said, you yourself admit you need a list of things to do to protect yourself, I leave it at that, say what ever you guys want, but in the end you all have to protect yourselves when doing business there

and that proves I am correct.
 
Ok........ my point and reason for arguing is this- you keep making statements like "full of scammers" and "den of scammers" etc. What I am saying is it is not nearly as bad as you are making it out to be. I am very confident you would be able to find a nice overpriced misrepresented item for some fool to take you up on your challenge. I am positive along the way you would find a plethora of legitimate items with realistic prices from very good people. As far as the rhetoric yes you are using grossly exaggerated statements like they are factual. You keep saying the same thing over and over in an attempt to counter a point yet you are just repeating yourself. Have you ever seen an item in a store that didn't work as described? Have you ever found a particular brand in a trusted store that you would not buy? Of course. This is pretty much standard fare as a consumer. It isn't just isolated to eBay. Have you ever seen retailers return policies? It's not nearly the way you make it out to be. Many stores have Exchange only policies. No returns after 30 days. Must have a receipt even for Exchange. Restoring fees. Refund issued in the form of a check from corporate even if you paid with cash. These are all out there and just as inconvenient as having to email a seller with a discrepancy. I get that you do not trust making a purchase sight unseen from someone you do not know, but why can't you just leave it at that? You clog the post with these generalized and embellished statements that do nothing more than paint you as a bitter person with a grudge and a loose sense of reason.
 
Jusatele said:
Then you admit it is easy to get scammed on ebay unless you are careful?
Click to expand...

It is easy to get scammed ALMOST ANYWHERE unless you are careful. That includes eBay and all the places you shop too. Do you admit that?
 
But at Guitar center I can take the item back, I can handle it before buying, I do not have to go in there and check out the reputation of the salesman. If I get a bad product I can bring it back, thier license to do business depends on that.

You can get scammed anywhere, however,

every one of you want to twist the basis of this discussion, I say ebay is full of scammers and in order to do business there you need to go in knowing that you have to be careful.
you guys get offended by that and tell me I am wrong but every one of you say an intelligent person checks this and that and investigates this and that.

if they were not afraid of being scammed, then why not just buy it sight unseen and send cash?

I can buy with cash at guitar center and still get my money back.

you say I keep saying vauge things, I say you are trying to twist the subject by not dealing with the issue

the issue is, Can you go into ebay and handle the product, can you buy with cash, can you trust that you will be able to find every seller there is on it to refund your money
or... do you have to verify the product, investigate the seller, pay with a method you feel safe you will get your money back, maybe. so you can PROTECT yourself from scammers


that is the simple thing being discussed, You want to prove me wrong that ebay is a up and up environment to do business in, and I say if you need to go in with a list of ways to protect yourself than it is a place where scammer are rampant,  otherwise you would need no list of ways to be intelligent and not get scammed.

I cannot see were I am wrong here, I can see were you all keep saying you need protection.
 
Jusatele said:
the issue is, Can you go into ebay and handle the product, can you buy with cash, can you trust that you will be able to find every seller there is on it to refund your money
or... do you have to verify the product, investigate the seller, pay with a method you feel safe you will get your money back, maybe. so you can PROTECT yourself from scammers
Click to expand...

So am I correct to assume that you NEVER purchase anything from an online/phone/mail-order retailer? You only buy local and always pay cash?

Because all these awful, terribly difficult steps you've listed (verify the product, investigate the seller, pay with a method you feel safe, etc) apply to shopping ANYWHERE that's not a physical storefront in your area (and I'd still be careful locally, but hey, more power to ya).

I've purchased well over 50 guitars and basses since 2004, the vast majority on eBay due to particular interests in older gear. Even though eBay is "full of scammers" I'm sorry to report I've never had one bad deal among them. The ONLY time I got scammed was a deal that didn't occur on eBay... I was sent a guitar with a different trem than was pictured. The seller refused to respond, and since I had used Paypal I simply went through the process of disputing the sale, and after a short time they refunded my money. Now I'm sure you'll probably have all kinds of bad things to say about Paypal, but I've used it since the beginning and again, no problems. Both buying and selling.

If that deal, or any other, happened on eBay, you would have Paypal AND eBay there to protect you. You keep going on about how hard it would be to get your money back from a bad seller... they've made it STUPIDLY easy to do so. If anything, eBay favors buyers much more than sellers now. Sellers can't even leave negative feedback for buyers anymore.

I shall now pop some popcorn and await a response.  :toothy12:
 
It's easy to scammed anywhere if you're not careful - the operative term being "if you're not careful." For whatever reason you still want to pretend that buyers using good common sense in their business dealings is a concept that only applies to eBay, and at this point nobody buys for a minute that you actually believe that. Maybe I'm giving you too much credit, I don't know. Maybe you are used to being lied to and taken advantage of all the time, but that doesn't mean everyone else is.

What this all "proves" is that you like arguing and are absolutely terrible at it. Lots of people gave you an honest assessment of their experiences on eBay and how it functions.

If you had just said, "yeah I don't like/don't use eBay," fine, whatever. Lots of people don't, same with Paypal. That's perfectly reasonable. Where this gets weird is that you seem to have a real axe to grind with everyone who has had a positive long-term experience with it, to the point where you're practically calling anyone who says they have a liar. If I speculated that you lost your dispute for trying to pull a fast one on someone yourself, you probably wouldn't appreciate it very much, correct? Whatever the story is, the point is people who have used eBay for a long time know what they're talking about; you don't. You can put your hands over your ears and yell "I'm right, I'm right" 100 more times if you want, and you'll still be wrong. 
 
You also said that the only people who defend ebay are addicted, you think we're all crazy for using it, it's a den of scammers where you can't do business, and you don't believe anyone who tells you that they've done well there.
 
Jusatele said:
so again you want to twist the subject instead of answering the question?
Click to expand...

No one is under any obligation to answer your question. Any question includes assumptions that merely answering would validate. Instead, people are providing information relating to your general claims. Demanding answers to arbitrary questions is a poor form of argument.
 
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