Screws on new Ebony neck won't go in all the way

[rgand]

Be a  good excuse to buy some drill bit depth-stop collars while you're at it. Hate to drill through the fretboard. I use tape markers in a pinch. Just be sure to use something. The price of failure is high.

This is good advice. Those stop collars are good to have. In a pinch, though, you can drill through a piece of wooden dowel to use as a stop. Either way, you're better off than just winging it.

 

[jond4]

I'm definitely not going to wing the depth, I know myself and that would guarantee catastrophic failure, haha

My drill press has a depth stop gauge and I also do the tape on the drill bit as well as a second measure but I didn't know about the drill bit collars, just looked them up, I like those.

 

[rgand]

I'm definitely not going to wing the depth, I know myself and that would guarantee catastrophic failure, haha

My drill press has a depth stop gauge and I also do the tape on the drill bit as well as a second measure but I didn't know about the drill bit collars, just looked them up, I like those.

:icon_thumright:

 

[jond4]

Well, I drilled the neck heel pilot holes out to a straight 1/8", no problem there.

Attempted to attached it to the body and the two bottom screws are now broken off inside the neck pocket.

Ridiculous.

 

[Cagey]

I'm afraid that awshit just wiped out all your attaboys. My condolences.

 

[Cagey]

See here.

Unfortunately, you need to be able to reverse your drill motor, which presses don't often allow. May have to figure something else out.

 

[jond4]

See here.

Unfortunately, you need to be able to reverse your drill motor, which presses don't often allow. May have to figure something else out.

Thanks Cagey, I'll order one of those at some point and get the screws out. Maybe in the future I'll try the insert thing.

To be honest I really am starting to believe there is some silly universal force trying to tell me to not bother with making guitars and that I'm a guitarist not a builder, definitely not both.

I have had setbacks every single step of every build I've attempted, it's laughable to me at this point. I seriously didn't even have these screws in halfway, I didn't even feel them break. The neck suddenly started pushing out.

The more I think about it and while writing my reply, I'm done. Just done with trying to make guitars. I realize I could have bought three great used ones by now and been spending my time making music.

 

[Cagey]

We all have our days. And, sometimes we shouldn't do something. I've known electrical engineers I wouldn't trust with a flashlight design, and a buddy of mine has a master's degree in mechanical engineering but can't be trusted to mow the lawn.

Maybe you just need to step back for a couple days and think/calm down. Sometimes a fresh perspective changes everything.

 

[jond4]

We all have our days. And, sometimes we shouldn't do something. I've known electrical engineers I wouldn't trust with a flashlight design, and a buddy of mine has a master's degree in mechanical engineering but can't be trusted to mow the lawn.

Maybe you just need to step back for a couple days and think/calm down. Sometimes a fresh perspective changes everything.

Thanks Cagey, I truly appreciate that. Some days a thing just doesn't go right for any particular reason.

Perhaps the funny thing is I wasn't even originally going to get ebony, it was going to be roasted maple. I poked around the shop in stock section before ordering and saw this one which was all the same choices but in ebony and just got the gas for it, which I normally don't experience. It of course didn't occur to me that screwing it to the body was going to turn out this difficult.

I made some pretty good extra change this weekend doing a sound gig on the side so I'm considering just doing my choices in maple which I know will be fine and leave this ebony neck for another day.

 

[Strat Avenger]

Wow. Did you use wax on the screws?
I wonder if they were made of the wrong grade of metal. I think threaded inserts are inevitable at this point. They're better anyway.

 

[mayfly]

ooo I am very sorry to hear this.  :sad1:

 

[rgand]

Broken screws are a drag. You could use one of those extractors Kevin showed with one of this type of drill stand and your hand drill.

 

[spe111]

Brazilian ebony is a pretty tough material to work with. I'm not a wood worker and don't want to be, but you can tell how hard it would be to work with just from the density. It seems like you could make a tire iron out of it.

 

[Cagey]

I thought about it, and did a bit of research to fill in the gaps. It's a nasty problem, particularly in hardwoods. Those extractors basically just create a cylindrical cutout around the leftover screw shank in the original hole, and you need to be able to snap that out as the cylinder would still be attached at the bottom of the hole. Being Brazilian Ebony, it may not want to do that. Then, the leftover hole has to be perfect because with an insert that isn't installed at a perfect 90° the risk of cross-threading the machine screw is pretty high. Since reversible pillar drills and/or reversible threading gear attachments for existing tools are both surprisingly expensive - MUCH more than the cost of even an expensive neck - it doesn't seem practical. So, you'd end up having to try doing it by hand with a portable drill motor, which is notoriously inaccurate in a situation where precision is paramount.

If it was my neck, I'd be tempted if for no other reason than to save a total loss, but I think the chances of success are pretty low.

 

[Rick]

Tell us you used the beeswax ...

You have two good holes, and I've seen fenders with just three bolts.  I'd leave the two screws in, file them down flat.

Bring the neck to a luthier and have him drill the third hole in the desired location.  Have him drill out a neck plate, or maybe get a three hole plate. Have him (or her) install, problem solved.

I'm at work and can't see any pics.  I'll look when I get home.

 

[jond4]

Thanks for the excellent ideas everyone.

I took some pics if anyone is interested in seeing,

https://photos.app.goo.gl/AiZhpt9VUCQKL9JH6

Another option mentioned to me is drill them out with a larger bit and then dowel the holes. Which I'm confident I could do.

I got these screws at the local hardware store and even though they looked to be an exact match they are quite clearly made of a cheap metal. One broke barely halfway in and the other broke when I was removing it and that one was not any farther in either. My original screws (warmoth ones) almost made it all the way. The original screws though were too torn up after that to try again with them.

Knowing there is a decent amount of pilot hole still under the broken screws, I may just try and drill them out. I did a little test with an 1/8" bit and it definitely will eat those screws out, however I would have to use a larger one to really get them out.

So I'm still deciding on a plan of attack

 

[Strat Avenger]

If the dowel attempt doesn't work, I think I would do the suggested 3-screw option but use threaded inserts & machine screws so you know that neck isn't going anywhere.

 

[Rick]

That's a good looking piece of wood.  That is also a perfect candidate for the three hole treatment.  I don't know what your body looks like, but I'd get the three hole plate, and give the mess to a luthier to file down the screw remnants and install the neck.  In the body, if the two screw holes are exposed, I'd either fill with pearloid dots, or  fill them up with wood filler and top with shiny black lacquer, so it looks like two black dots, which I think would look pretty cool. 

 

[rgand]

You could have Doug (DangerousR6) make a square plate with three holes in it instead of four. Then the extra holes in the body would be covered cleanly.

 

[jond4]

Considering this is my personal and somewhat experimental guitar, I'm not terribly concerned about it's looks on the backside, just that it plays and sounds good.

So with that in mind, I'm sorta leaning towards the dowel idea, it's feeling like it may be the easiest to pull off. I'm going to look for some dowels first so that I can be sure whatever wood those are made of is plenty strong enough for the job.

For example, drill the screws out with a 1/4" bit (a little smaller if I can get away with it), glue in some dowels and drill new 1/8" pilot holes. Sounds easy when I say it....haha.

I've got a lot of things to do the next couple weeks so there's lots of time before I can get to trying this.

There is also a wood crafters business in town so I'm going to swing by there first to see about dowels. It's a Ma and Pa type place and they mostly deal with furniture / house kinda things but I'm feeling they'll certainly be a better shot than home depot or lowe's.