Headstock Logos on New Builds

Whose Logo Do You Put On Your Warmoth Builds?


  • Total voters
    73
warcripp said:
if the fender decal were a trademarked item they (fmic) would put a stop to other people selling decal replicas.

The Fender logo is trademarked. That's what that little 'R' in a circle following their name stands for - Registered trademark. I suspect the reason they don't prosecute people who sell/use them is because it's free advertising, and possibly even flattering. For instance, putting a Fender logo on a Warmoth is like putting a Ford emblem on a Mercedes. Ford isn't going to mind. People will think they make better cars than they actually do. Now, if you were making Ford copies, putting Ford's name on them and selling them, then they'd get pretty worked up. You'd be eating their lunch, and nobody likes that. Conversely, if you were putting Ford emblems on Chryslers, they might get worked up about that, too, because it diminishes the value of their good name.
 
warcripp said:
if the fender decal were a trademarked item they (fmic) would put a stop to other people selling decal replicas.

Well - in these parts of the world they actually do. But maybe they don't do that in the USA - or some of the illegal traders are so small that they "fly under the radar".
I haven't heard of legal cases. But I guess when FMIC tells a company to stop messing with their trademark - the smaller company obeys.
 
The ebay auctions selling Fender logos often get shutdown.  The websites that sell them often ask that you don't post links in forums to their sites.  If Fender allows it, I would guess they feel it should go on a Fender neck that is being refinished.
 
I don't see a problem with it.  I read the comparison of putting a Ford logo on a Mercedes, and that's not accurate at all.
It'd be more appropriate to say you built a kit-car replica and put the logo on. The body parts may be made of a different material, but it looks like the original or is slightly different.
The original specs come from the brand that you're badging, so either method would be acceptable.

If you don't want any labels on your creation, cool.
If you want to put the OEM style label on your reproduction, cool.
If you want to put the label of the major creator of your new device, sweet.
If you want to put your own name or original name on it, awesome!

It feels to me like this thread is slightly worse than the one about the buff throughs on the pickup routes for a front loaded body.
 
AutoBat said:
I don't see a problem with it.  I read the comparison of putting a Ford logo on a Mercedes, and that's not accurate at all.

definitely agree.

cobra kit car
pic472.jpg


1965 shelby cobra
sep14_08.jpg


i was going to post a picture of a warmoth and fender strat below, but you get the idea. it's not a ferrari logo on a hyundai, it's a ferrari logo on something 99% of the people out there would call a ferrari. there are some of us who know the difference, but to those who don't do the fine details matter? its your build. finish it how you see fit. if fender takes the time out of their busy schedule to hunt down a single hobby builder then you damn well better take that logo off the headstock. but they won't. in letting warmoth make fender licensed parts i'm pretty sure they knew there was a risk people would use them for/in place of real fender parts.
 
Fender "quality" went out the window with the CBS purchase back in '66.

(Don't believe me?  Just ask Forrest White, or at least, see his opinions)
 
AutoBat said:
I don't see a problem with it.  I read the comparison of putting a Ford logo on a Mercedes, and that's not accurate at all.
It'd be more appropriate to say you built a kit-car replica and put the logo on. The body parts may be made of a different material, but it looks like the original or is slightly different.
The original specs come from the brand that you're badging, so either method would be acceptable.

If you don't want any labels on your creation, cool.
If you want to put the OEM style label on your reproduction, cool.
If you want to put the label of the major creator of your new device, sweet.
If you want to put your own name or original name on it, awesome!

It feels to me like this thread is slightly worse than the one about the buff throughs on the pickup routes for a front loaded body.

While every thing you say is true, you're missing the point. I'm not talking about philosophical propriety. I'm talking about legality, and what will fly in court. Logic and reason have no standing. What makes perfect sense in reality has nothing to do with how many laws are written. To make matters worse, many decisions about what's right and wrong and how much one should be compensated for harms real or imagined are made by a committee of people who are too stupid to get out of jury duty. So, beware. We live in a country with so many laws it's difficult to get out of bed in the morning without breaking 4 or 5 of them, and we continue to commit crimes all day long, usually unwittingly. Since ignorance of the law is never an acceptable excuse, forewarned is forearmed.
 
Neither of those cars are "real" Cobras... and while I like the first car, if it were given to me I'd pull off any and all items identifying it as AC.

I can't get past the wheels on the second one. FFS spend the money on new wheels. They don't have to be knock-off knockoffs, just ANYTHING that isn't Mustang. Though they look to be four lug wheels which is a big FAIL on that car... putting AC logos on that is just adding insult to injury if you ask me.
 
I don't put Fender logos on my Warmoths (2 strats; one of which is 1/2 Fender body with a Warmoth neck).

I also don't put Warmoth logos on 'em either because I'm not a big fan of the logo - visually speaking.

But you bet yer @$$ I tell people, "It's a Warmoth" when asked.

(Why doesn't someone come up with a cool turtle graphic and the Warmoth name in a cool font as a headstock decal?)
 
Superlizard said:
(Why doesn't someone come up with a cool turtle graphic and the Warmoth name in a cool font as a headstock decal?)

That "someone" should be Warmoth, and they already have. It looks like this: 
WARMOTHDECAL.jpg
 
Cagey said:
Superlizard said:
(Why doesn't someone come up with a cool turtle graphic and the Warmoth name in a cool font as a headstock decal?)

That "someone" should be Warmoth, and they already have. It looks like this: 
WARMOTHDECAL.jpg

I've got 2 decals of those sitting in the neck boxes collecting dust.

Like I said, "cool".
 
If someone buys that Fender licensed shape from W and puts a Fender logo on it, that crosses a line with forum members?

"You can't put that label on it.  It says it's something it's not."  The headstock shape already says it's something it's not. 
 
Fender Exec to Fender Legal Team:  "There's a guy in TX putting our logo on his private property that we licensed a company to replicate."

Fender Legal Team to Fender Exec:  "So."
 
Superlizard said:
Like I said, "cool".

Warmoth Guitar Products, Inc. is a privately held company with revenues between $5 and $10M annually, owned by Ken Warmoth. You might contact him and tell him you don't like his taste in logos, and see if he'll change it. I'll wait here for you <grin>
 
Super Turbo Deluxe Custom said:
If someone buys that Fender licensed shape from W and puts a Fender logo on it, that crosses a line with forum members?

"You can't put that label on it.  It says it's something it's not."  The headstock shape already says it's something it's not. 

No, the headstock shape makes it appear to be something it's not. The headstock shape has been trademarked by another company - FMIC. That's why Warmoth has to license it in order to use it. But, it's actually a Warmoth neck, which is different than a Fender neck in that they're usually built from different materials and to different specs and quality levels. Since the materials choice, specifications, and quality meet or exceed Fender's own, they don't have any problem licensing their trademark. Its use can't harm them or consumers.

Trademarks and trademark law exist to protect consumers as much as traders. For consumers, they identify a product so there's no confusion as to its origin. For traders, they protect their identity in the market, so other manufacturers can't produce counterfeit or substandard versions of a product and sell it as authentic, or even produce equal or better products to be sold in the same market. To do so would have the effect of market dilution, which is detrimental to a trademark holder's profits.

So, it's clear what Fender and Warmoth's legal motivations are, but why would a builder want to identify a Warmoth build as a Fender? While certainly not insulting, nonetheless it's identifying the instrument as something less than it is. It would seem then that the only one being hurt is the builder. Counter-intuitive as it is, that's not the case. FMIC has spent many millions of dollars building a reputation for greatness around their name. It's not baseless - they do make some good products - but it's greatly exaggerated through promotion. As a result, their name alone implies a value higher than one that's less well-known. That's why the endorsements of celebrities are so highly sought after. Simply putting Eric Clapton's name on a Stratocaster increases its selling price a couple thousand dollars without any material or manufacturing investment whatsoever.

For those in the know, the names mean nothing. One can look at a completely unidentified instrument and judge its material and build quality. Unfortunately, the market is largely populated by the unsophisticated, so if one wants to make a positive social impression or sell an instrument at a higher price, a little name-dropping goes a long way. So, it would seem the only reason to put a Fender name on a Warmoth product is to increase its apparent value to the unsophisticated by lying to them and taking advantage of their ignorance.
 
Cagey said:
Superlizard said:
Like I said, "cool".

Warmoth Guitar Products, Inc. is a privately held company with revenues between $5 and $10M annually, owned by Ken Warmoth. You might contact him and tell him you don't like his taste in logos, and see if he'll change it. I'll wait here for you <grin>

What the hell does the logo have to do with company revenues in this particular case?

(...I'm sure the reason he's so successful is because of those cheesy logos.  :tard: )

The product rocks, the logo sucks.  The reason why he's successful is, of course, superior product.

Perhaps you should refresh your memory here:

http://www.unofficialwarmoth.com/index.php?topic=12575.0

And while you're waiting (and reading), I'll sell you those logos... so you can stick 'em on your forehead... where they apparently belong.
 
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