Anyone successfully "brightened" up a dark guitar with a new neck?

[RockStarNick]

I've got two almost identical Warmoth guitars. (see below).

Both have maple/rosewood necks, and mahogany bodies.  However, the cherryburst has an alder laminate top, and the goldtop is solid mahogany.  The cherryburst is noticeably more alive, snappier, and vibrant sounding. 

I know that at first glance, one would blame the lack of a laminate top, but for some reason, I can't help but think that it's the NECK on the goldtop that's making it duller/warmer.

Do you think that there's a chance that the neck on the goldtop just resonates differently, and is a warmer sounding neck?  Perhaps I can bring the goldtop up to speed with the cherryburst by getting a new maple/pauferro neck?  Do you think that will get them to even level of brightness? 

 

[rockskate4x]

is the duller one a 24 3/4 conversion and the snappier one a 25 1/2?

 

[tfarny]

Next time you need a string change, play them both, swamp necks, restring, then play both again.
Generally, this kind of story is why I'm mistrustful of the claims that you can predict a guitar's sound by the wood species - two guitars with the same woods won't sound alike necessarily.

But if what you really want is the go-ahead to buy a new neck, then yeah - Go ahead! You really need a maple / pao ferro neck!  ccasion14: ccasion14:

 

[RockStarNick]

Next time you need a string change, play them both, swamp necks, restring, then play both again.
Generally, this kind of story is why I'm mistrustful of the claims that you can predict a guitar's sound by the wood species - two guitars with the same woods won't sound alike necessarily.

But if what you really want is the go-ahead to buy a new neck, then yeah - Go ahead! You really need a maple / pao ferro neck!  ccasion14: ccasion14:

I'm making an excuse to get some new Warmoth gear! haha  :headbang:

I've been asking some opinions, and doing some research, and the more I dig into this, it seems that a LOT of people feel that the neck has just as much to do with the tone of a guitar as the body does - sometimes even more.

I even did a recent body-swap on a Telecaster. Went from an ash body, to an alder one - keeping the same maple neck. And suprisingly, the tone is 85% the same, I'd say. 

I'm predicting that if I did a neck swap, the tone would follow the neck, not the body.

 

[RockStarNick]

Here's the guitars in question...

I've always wondered about the rosewood on the Gold Top one... it looks suspiciously light for an indian board (I did NOT specify madagascar RW at all...), but my indian board neck sounds brighter.

Both are quarter sawn.

 

[tfarny]

I remember those beauties. If you can find a way to re-use the strings, an A/B recording would be really interesting - does the tone follow the neck or the body? Because everything else is basically the same you've got a rare opportunity to do actual research on tone.

 

[jackthehack]

No two pieces of wood are EXACTLY alike, you can get a good bit of differentiation between 2 "identical"  maple or mahogany necks....

 

[big bob]

I would try changing the capacitors first.

 

[-CB-]

YUP, absolutely.  Swapped goncalo for maple, and maple with pau ferro board, both were MUCH brighter than goncalo.  I liked the goncalo best - its on the thinline tele in another thread.

 

[Patrick from Davis]

I think that the solution to the problem is an Ebony, Pau Ferro, or Satine neck.  Really, go raw, go bright.  But in this case, for me, money is no object, so yeah grab a totally Pau Ferro neck and rock on.

From the experimental perspective, this is quite fun.  If you do not mind burning through a couple of sets of strings then swap away.  Do they have the same pick ups?  I didn't see that in the post.  And of course, Jack's point about two pieces of wood behaving differently is the ultimate factor to consider.  But, I think to have relevance you would have to have a Pau Ferro neck in there so that you have a positive control.  It is just proper experimental procedure.  Ahhh, what an enabling nincompoop I am.
Patrick

 

[-CB-]

Reading the detail of what the OP said, completely through, here's some more to chew on.

First - pickups.  Check the DC resistance of each.   You'd be surprised at how much this varies.
Volume pots - can vary all over the place, by 20 percent or more between low and high value.  IOW, a 500k pot would read from 375k or upto 550k or so.  There's a huge range and it makes a difference.
Take the tone circuit out of the circuit on a temporary basis.
Make sure the poles on each pickup are the exact same elevation as their counterparts
Make sure the pickup elevation is the exact same elevation as its counterparts
Change strings to the same brand and gauge on both guitars

Now see what you got.

I like the swap neck idea.... which is exactly what I did back years ago (and will be doing again real soon)

Also, do you play each guitar through the SAME cord?  Makes a difference!~

 

[RockStarNick]

Thanks for the replies everyone!  I'm mainly doing the swap for acoustic/resonance purposes.

Using different potentiometers, pickups, etc... I could definitely tweak them to sound identical, electrically.  That's not the main issue for me.

When I play them unplugged, they feel different, and more importantly, respond differently.  I want to try to get them closer in sound, unplugged.

 

[djf67]

What about the nut? Are they both cut as well as each other? I've had two guitars sound awful (unplugged or plugged) until the nut was cut properly.
Following up on JtH's point, are the bodies of similar weight?

 

[RockStarNick]

What about the nut? Are they both cut as well as each other? I've had two guitars sound awful (unplugged or plugged) until the nut was cut properly.
Following up on JtH's point, are the bodies of similar weight?

Good points DJ, for sure.  The bodies are ballpark same weight, and the nuts are both cut great too.  But, that being said, they both respond differently on fretted notes as well... so it's definitely not the nuts.

Next month, I'm definitely pulling the trigger on a nice quartersawn maple neck with a PF fingerboard for the duller one... and then going to do some tests adn neck swaps.

 

[vtpcnk]

maybe it is the black pickguard!

but seriously, imo these beauties would look even better with better aesthetically matched pickguards.

 

[stubhead]

In my opinion, pau ferro is in between rosewood and ebony. So, there's not going to be that dramatic a move. However, you have the exact guitars in hand, and as mentioned all woods are different. I've always felt that you can do an awful lot by "re-tuning" a guitar afterwards, with pots, caps, pickups... Alluding to CB's post, I no longer even buy 250K pots, because I actually started testing all the pots before I even put them in. It doesn't matter if they're Alpha, CTS, Warmoth's whatever brand, they all test either at spec or low - I have some 250's that test at 180, 200, wanna buy one? :laughing3: If you buy 500's you can lower them to 300 by bridging a 750k resistor across the outside lugs, so all the 500's I had that tested at 420 are now 250's with the resistor, if you dig my verbs, dude.
READ THIS! BOOKMARK THIS!:

http://www.projectguitar.com/tut/potm.htm

I have a truckload of 750k resistors if anybody wants one (postage?) it was as cheap to ship 100 to me as to ship 1. Plus I'm kind of excessive, I'D SURE HATE TO RUN OUT..... :hello2:

But anyway, if I was trying to fix this woodily, I would go straight to ebony or all-maple.

 

[alexmyla]

Here's the guitars in question...

I've always wondered about the rosewood on the Gold Top one... it looks suspiciously light for an indian board (I did NOT specify madagascar RW at all...), but my indian board neck sounds brighter.

Both are quarter sawn.

ok that has got to be the best lookin telecaster i've ever seen.... im not a fan of tele's but this kinda makes me want a similar one... well done dude
i agree with one of the comments before, there will only be average differences between species but cerain species will have greater tonal variations. my LP is mahogany and the neck is a maple and ebony combo so i believe that the bass and mids will come from the mahogany more and the highs and high mid's will come from the neck. i chose those woods because i thought they'd cover the hwole spectrum lol.