Another Gibson Fail ??
- Thread starter m4rk0
- Start date
Really, the recipe for success with Gibson can be summed up in three simple steps:
1- Make guitars that are the classic stand-bys, and maybe have a few models that have a couple extra new-fangled things thrown in.
2- Charge a reasonable amount of money for what you are spending on production instead of $1000 extra because of the brand name.
3- Put QC into overdrive making sure your products aren't defective.
I don't know why they continue to try these stupid ugly guitars and don't just go for the obvious ways to increase their business. I guess they just no longer understand or care about musicians.
1- Make guitars that are the classic stand-bys, and maybe have a few models that have a couple extra new-fangled things thrown in.
2- Charge a reasonable amount of money for what you are spending on production instead of $1000 extra because of the brand name.
3- Put QC into overdrive making sure your products aren't defective.
I don't know why they continue to try these stupid ugly guitars and don't just go for the obvious ways to increase their business. I guess they just no longer understand or care about musicians.
Cagey
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Right. So do I. Not that their stuff is exactly inexpensive, but at least it's justifiable. You get what you pay for, are glad to get it, and they're happy to provide it. It's a fair deal for both parties, and everybody is happy, satisfied, and proud in the end. It would be great if all transactions in life could work out that way.
Jusatele
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Look at Fender, they have an American line you can get for just over a grand and a upgraded model for 16 hundred, then the custom stuff
plus a MIM line they have developed to where it gets respect now
and the rest of the stuff
If Gibson would make a Line that could compete with them in price, fit and finish and be 300 dollars higher due to the nuances of a set neck and laminated body in the LP
price the plank stuff accordingly and develop a decent import line such as the MIM fender stuff, then they would have the respect of the public again. But as long as they offer off beat stuff like this under the Gibson name, continue to charge 3200 bucks for an American LP with a decent finish and refuse to deal with the QC issues of their import line. well they are going to lose ground with the upper end buyer.
I honestly believe that the gains that Companies like PRS have made, among others, is strongly built on people like myself going down to buy a Gibson and after handleing the guitar, and looking at it like a informed and experienced buyer, go off and find a Axe of the quality they want. It is not coming from Gibson, PRS guitars are as much as they are so do not claim it is a price issue, it is a quality issue.
plus a MIM line they have developed to where it gets respect now
and the rest of the stuff
If Gibson would make a Line that could compete with them in price, fit and finish and be 300 dollars higher due to the nuances of a set neck and laminated body in the LP
price the plank stuff accordingly and develop a decent import line such as the MIM fender stuff, then they would have the respect of the public again. But as long as they offer off beat stuff like this under the Gibson name, continue to charge 3200 bucks for an American LP with a decent finish and refuse to deal with the QC issues of their import line. well they are going to lose ground with the upper end buyer.
I honestly believe that the gains that Companies like PRS have made, among others, is strongly built on people like myself going down to buy a Gibson and after handleing the guitar, and looking at it like a informed and experienced buyer, go off and find a Axe of the quality they want. It is not coming from Gibson, PRS guitars are as much as they are so do not claim it is a price issue, it is a quality issue.
Nando Vallart
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I hope this guys goes to Texas and people there just say as Dangerous Doug says: "your honor, he just NEEDED killing..." :laughing7:
Graffiti62
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Jusatele said:
I think that's what they to have Epiphone do for them. The biggest problem is that its a challenge to ever really find any of their more unique and polished models (Casino, WildKat, Casady Bass). The prices are attractive, to say the least, but not many people get to demo these at guitar stores.
Disco Scottie
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I just saw this thing for the first time today. I have no words.
Sooooooo glad I'm a PRS guy. And now Warmoth, of course.
Sooooooo glad I'm a PRS guy. And now Warmoth, of course.
Jusatele
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I can say this about my PRS, after 7 years it has it share of dents and scratches, but I never have had a guitar that has had no issues with hardware or the neck joint like this one.
I think it is extremely solidly built, I usually can have a LP wiggling by now and need it to be reset.
I think it is extremely solidly built, I usually can have a LP wiggling by now and need it to be reset.
Cagey
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I had a PRS for a while about 17-18 years ago, and was highly impressed. They make some fine instruments. Even the modern low-end stuff romps, and of course the higher-end stuff is almost without peer. Probably should have kept the one I had, but I saw something else I felt like I couldn't live without, so I sacrificed it. I think that's when I bought the Levinson. Not too many of those out there, but those that have them are some happy campers. Mark makes some fine instruments, too.
It's funny. In all the time I've played guitar, I've always sorta been a "one instrument" kind of guy. If I found myself unhappy or restricted, I just modified or replaced what I had rather than add to the list. It's only been since I started goofing around with Warmoth parts that I'm developing a collection. I gotta say, hanging out here doesn't help <grin> All the great work people here do just makes me crazy. I might even have a Tele someday <grin>
It's funny. In all the time I've played guitar, I've always sorta been a "one instrument" kind of guy. If I found myself unhappy or restricted, I just modified or replaced what I had rather than add to the list. It's only been since I started goofing around with Warmoth parts that I'm developing a collection. I gotta say, hanging out here doesn't help <grin> All the great work people here do just makes me crazy. I might even have a Tele someday <grin>
Jusatele
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Cagey
The reason I got the PRS is when I went to play a LP In 2003 I was shocked at how cheaply the fit and finish on Gibson's were. It sucked and I had GC pulling ones out of the back, not only that but they were not even set up from the factory, that is a shame. I decided that they were as bad as they said they were, Funny the 72 I was replacing was top notch, just the neck was toast by then. I am hard on guitars.So I tried a PRS and never turned back
It had a 10 top, and was set up with the Artist package which is really nice. No Brainer I decided, and still love it.
The reason I got the PRS is when I went to play a LP In 2003 I was shocked at how cheaply the fit and finish on Gibson's were. It sucked and I had GC pulling ones out of the back, not only that but they were not even set up from the factory, that is a shame. I decided that they were as bad as they said they were, Funny the 72 I was replacing was top notch, just the neck was toast by then. I am hard on guitars.So I tried a PRS and never turned back
It had a 10 top, and was set up with the Artist package which is really nice. No Brainer I decided, and still love it.
Cagey
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Funny you should mention the '72 Paul - that was a turning point for a buddy of mine and myself with guitars. Although Gibson had already been bought by Norlin at that point, the '72 was near the end of the Kalamzoo era instruments, so they were still being made by the original craftsmen who made the Gibson name what it was. That ancient factory was just infested with tone elves and finish fairies, and they turned out some of the finest electric guitars ever made. I've been to that plant (I lived in Kalamazoo for a couple years) and you'd never in a million years expect the kinds of things to come out of that place that did. It was... decrepit. Old like end-of-days old. You'd expect the place to catch fire and burn from an electrical problem any second, if only it wasn't waterlogged from 80 bajillion leaks.
Original Gibson Plant, Kalamazoo, Michigan
Anyway, we come from poor stock, and ol' Jefe had scored a job with GM at one of the local Cadillac plants. So, he was making money like none of us had ever heard of. First thing he did was save up to buy a Gibson, which was every boy racer's dream. Only took a few weeks at the rate he was earning, and a Les Paul Custom only went for $600-$700 back then. We finally knew why you paid the big bucks for a Gibson Holy Grail Guitar. This thing was tits on cake. Take it in for a setup? Are you kidding? You didn't pay $600 for a guitar that needed a bloody setup! The dealer delivered it perfect. What a joy that thing was.
After that, it was a steep downhill slide for Gibson. Quality deteriorated like raw chicken in the sun while the price increased like Mexican peso inflation. Just ridiculous. Now, the MSRP of a Les Paul Custom is over $5K, and you can't really get one for less than $3.5K no matter where you go, and the South Koreans are making higher quality instruments for $400.
Original Gibson Plant, Kalamazoo, Michigan
Anyway, we come from poor stock, and ol' Jefe had scored a job with GM at one of the local Cadillac plants. So, he was making money like none of us had ever heard of. First thing he did was save up to buy a Gibson, which was every boy racer's dream. Only took a few weeks at the rate he was earning, and a Les Paul Custom only went for $600-$700 back then. We finally knew why you paid the big bucks for a Gibson Holy Grail Guitar. This thing was tits on cake. Take it in for a setup? Are you kidding? You didn't pay $600 for a guitar that needed a bloody setup! The dealer delivered it perfect. What a joy that thing was.
After that, it was a steep downhill slide for Gibson. Quality deteriorated like raw chicken in the sun while the price increased like Mexican peso inflation. Just ridiculous. Now, the MSRP of a Les Paul Custom is over $5K, and you can't really get one for less than $3.5K no matter where you go, and the South Koreans are making higher quality instruments for $400.
I held a Gibson SG fresh out of the box at guitar center today.
fretboard felt like a sawblade.
they hung out so far they actually left red scratches on my hand.
how is THAT supposed to feel fast?
add to that the "Hand shaped neck" felt bumpy.
so I sat that 1,100 dollar one down. and picked up the 350 dollar Epiphone SG next to it.
felt much better.
THAT DOESN'T MAKE SENSE.
fretboard felt like a sawblade.
they hung out so far they actually left red scratches on my hand.
how is THAT supposed to feel fast?
add to that the "Hand shaped neck" felt bumpy.
so I sat that 1,100 dollar one down. and picked up the 350 dollar Epiphone SG next to it.
felt much better.
THAT DOESN'T MAKE SENSE.
Cagey
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Incidentally, that plant is still there on Parsons street, and that's where they make Heritage guitars now. If you want a hand-made Les Paul by the old craftsmen like Gibson used to make, that's what you buy. In fact, the company was founded by ex-Gibson employees who didn't want to move when Gibson shifted down to Nashville. They're pretty dear - you'll pay $3K-$5K for one of their instruments, too. But, at least the old-world quality, American craftsmanship and personality is still there and it won't feel like you wasted your money.
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