Would a Warmoth Fatback solve my neck issue?

hhholden

New member
Messages
2
Hi all,

First off, I want to express my gratitude for this website because it has been very helpful to me in many ways. I know I might be beating a dead horse with some of my questions, but I figured I'd see if I can get any insight here because this would probably be the best source.
I have a Squier CV JM I’d like a new neck for. Warmoth stuck out to me for all the different  options for profiles, woods, etc., even though I’m going for something pretty standard/basic. My main complaint with the neck I have is that it hurts my hand after playing it for an hour or less. Some guitars I can play for much longer and they remain comfortable, so my hand’s endurance isn’t an issue. I noticed that it doesn’t “fill” my hand the way my preferred necks do, so I believe I need a thicker/rounder/deeper neck? I also want a 7.25 inch radius, for reference, and I'm thinking a 1-5/8 nut width.
If it’s helpful, I measured a few necks that I like, and, like I guessed, they're all larger than my JM neck. I measured a Harmony H-804, a Squier VM Tele Custom, and a 1970s style MIM Strat reissue with a 7.25 fretboard and the bullet truss rod and everything. My absolute favorite neck is just a player series Mustang neck, but I ruled it out as a reference because of the different scale length- should I still take it into consideration?
Since I believe my issue is with the depth or profile of my JM neck, and with how much I enjoy that Strat neck and my Harmony neck (I know this might be an obscure guitar, I don’t really know neck vocabulary well enough to describe it though), I think the Fatback with its 1 inch depth and its “Deep U” shape would be my best bet… I’ve ruled out the boat neck as many online have recommended to others asking similar questions simply because I’ve never played a V neck and don’t want to risk it- again, my JM doesn’t “fill” my hand, I don’t think a V would either.
So- here’s what I know. I’m attracted to the Fatback because of the U shape and its depth. It’s larger than the necks I measured, but given my circumstances I think something .1 or .15 inches larger than my measurements will be better for me than .1 inches (or more, like my JM) smaller than them. I’ve also ruled out the standard thin because I’ve read many people say that it’s too thin for them, and it’s also smaller than the necks I measured.
My only concern is that the fatback is TOO much of a U shape, or that it's bigger than I might be expecting, any thoughts? Any insight into this would be greatly appreciated. If I made any poor assumptions on something, please please let me know. If you made it to the end of this, thanks for reading it all- I just really wanted to be thorough. This is my first post here, so if I made any errors in using the site then please just let me know and I’ll fix it accordingly :)
Thanks!
 

mayfly

Senior member
Messages
8,309
Hi there and welcome.  I too have problems with thin necks, but for me it was because I broke my thumb on my left hand some years ago.

I went through several neck profiles before I found the one I liked (in my case the boatneck).  I imagine that you might end up doing the same.  Because of that I would recommend that you get the  fatback as a cheap showcase neck.  The cheaper the better.  Maybe it will be great, or maybe it would be too fat.  If it's the latter, then you can sell it off and get a different style.  If it works for you, then you can either keep it on there or build another guitar!

BTW - is the Harmony a BobCat?
 

daizee

Active member
Messages
29
Same issue here with a Squier CV neck. I went up to a 1-11/16" neck on an Ibanez AM53, which also has a thicker profile at 0.825" behind the first fret. The Ibanez is totally manageable, but I'd prefer more width.

1-5/8" is narrower than the stock CV Tele. (1.625" vs. 1.650")

Currently prepping a 1-3/4" wide "standard thin" warmoth neck to go on my Squire CV Tele. It's approaching an acoustic neck feel. I think neck *volume* is important. Wider or thicker can both work. Depends how much room you like between the strings too. See other current thread here.

 
S

swarfrat

Guest
I have a fatback but my next one will be something with a bit of taper. Maybe a 59. Fatback is ginormous.
 

stratamania

Senior member
Messages
9,481
I think the best advice has already been given by Mayfly.

You need to try it and arrive at your own conclusions based on your thoughts so far. You may be in luck the first time or not but that is part of the game.

I will also add something that I often say in these types of threads. You will get (and already have) folks saying I love this profile or neck width etc. and that is okay for them but that was their journey. Each person has their own hands, their own preferences etc. so it is subjective.

 

jay4321

Senior member
Messages
1,284
With a 24" Mustang neck being your favorite, I definitely wouldn't discount that data. A shorter scale conversion neck might be a good option, maybe a 24.75" scale Warmoth might be worth a try over a Fender-scale 25.5"?

Also your choice of nut width will be felt with your choice of contour. I can tell you that a fatback is a lot, and the one I had was 1 5/8" nut width, I can't imagine on a wider neck. Some swear by it, I hated it. I filed it down to what is now a much more manageable although unremarkable neck. I'd never have bought it but a guy sold me a pile of abandoned projects in a lot for like $500 which had 3 necks, 2 bodies and a bunch of unwanted new and used hardware, included a new Nashville TOM and TP from TonePros and a nice set of tuners too and a bunch of mostly Warmoth pickguards. I wonder what the build completion rate is for the original purchaser of Warmoth stuff actually is.

Anyway, best guess based on your info: 1.650 width, 59 roundback, conversion scale, vintage or 9.5 radius. If I'm off you're in kind of middle ground territory and you'll have a clearer direction for future necks. And I highly doubt you'd have any issue comfortably playing the thing.
 

daizee

Active member
Messages
29
Just finished my wide/thin neck install (see other thread), and it fills my hand very nicely vs. the stock CV neck. I'm pretty well convinced that neck volume overall matters vs. merely one specific dimension. VERY glad I decided at the last second not to go with the 59 profile on this 1.75" wide neck, even though I like the thicker/rounder neck on my 1-11/16" Ibanez AM53.

 

vetteman

Senior member
Messages
274
Tried to like a Fatback neck, but even though I have pretty big hands I found that it was just too big.  The 59 roundback suits me the best.
 

hhholden

New member
Messages
2
Hi all, left this post up for a few days during the week while I was busy and was surprised to see this many responses! They've all been helpful, so thank you guys. I don't know how to respond to specific posts on here, but I do see the quotation function so I'll just use that for now.
I've done a bit more reading, and I'm comfortable with the idea of the fatback. Maybe a 59 roundback, but the fatback seems to be the best option as of now.
Mayfly said:
Hi there and welcome.  I too have problems with thin necks, but for me it was because I broke my thumb on my left hand some years ago.

I went through several neck profiles before I found the one I liked (in my case the boatneck).  I imagine that you might end up doing the same.  Because of that I would recommend that you get the  fatback as a cheap showcase neck.  The cheaper the better.  Maybe it will be great, or maybe it would be too fat.  If it's the latter, then you can sell it off and get a different style.  If it works for you, then you can either keep it on there or build another guitar!

BTW - is the Harmony a BobCat?

I'm not opposed to the idea of buying a neck and seeing if it's for me, but I'd rather just get it right the first time or slightly rework it (its not much bigger than the necks I like to begin with). Also, no, its an H804, but I'd love to get a BobKat eventually.

jay4321 said:
With a 24" Mustang neck being your favorite, I definitely wouldn't discount that data. A shorter scale conversion neck might be a good option, maybe a 24.75" scale Warmoth might be worth a try over a Fender-scale 25.5"?

Also your choice of nut width will be felt with your choice of contour. I can tell you that a fatback is a lot, and the one I had was 1 5/8" nut width, I can't imagine on a wider neck. Some swear by it, I hated it. I filed it down to what is now a much more manageable although unremarkable neck. I'd never have bought it but a guy sold me a pile of abandoned projects in a lot for like $500 which had 3 necks, 2 bodies and a bunch of unwanted new and used hardware, included a new Nashville TOM and TP from TonePros and a nice set of tuners too and a bunch of mostly Warmoth pickguards. I wonder what the build completion rate is for the original purchaser of Warmoth stuff actually is.

Anyway, best guess based on your info: 1.650 width, 59 roundback, conversion scale, vintage or 9.5 radius. If I'm off you're in kind of middle ground territory and you'll have a clearer direction for future necks. And I highly doubt you'd have any issue comfortably playing the thing.
Scale length really isn't an issue for me, I have a Tele and the longer neck doesn't get in the way at all. I discounted the Mustang neck because I didn't know how the first and twelfth fret measurements would compare since it's a shorter distance between the two on the Stang. Do you know what the effect specifically on the profile the nut width was? I've heard that before and, naturally, I tried to see what the effect was, but I can't seem to. Also, kind of hit the nail on the head at the end. Only two things I'm considering changing about my original idea was the nut width from 1.625 to 1.650 and a fatback or a 59.

daizee said:
Just finished my wide/thin neck install (see other thread), and it fills my hand very nicely vs. the stock CV neck. I'm pretty well convinced that neck volume overall matters vs. merely one specific dimension. VERY glad I decided at the last second not to go with the 59 profile on this 1.75" wide neck, even though I like the thicker/rounder neck on my 1-11/16" Ibanez AM53.
I saw your neck, looks great. What made you choose last second against the 59 Roundback? I don't think I'd like a 1-3/4 nut width, but trying to decipher the relationship between profile and nut width like I said a little earlier in this response.
stratamania said:
I think the best advice has already been given by Mayfly.

You need to try it and arrive at your own conclusions based on your thoughts so far. You may be in luck the first time or not but that is part of the game.

I will also add something that I often say in these types of threads. You will get (and already have) folks saying I love this profile or neck width etc. and that is okay for them but that was their journey. Each person has their own hands, their own preferences etc. so it is subjective.
This is really important, thanks. I knew that was going to happen, and I'm taking everything into account but, like you said, a lot of it is subjective and personal too, so I'm trying to find a balance between subjective opinions and whatnot.

So, to wrap this post up, currently considering a fatback or a 59 roundback (but not a boatneck), sticking with a 7.25 radius, 1 5/8 nut width or maybe 1 11/16. I left some questions above, so thanks in advance if anyone's able to offer insight towards those and thanks again for all the responses currently.
 

stratamania

Senior member
Messages
9,481
I suppose I can add a couple more observations that may be helpful.

If you change the width of the neck for a given profile it does feel different. e.g. I have Standard thins in 1 5/8" and 1 11/16" and this is the case. I have many guitars Gibson and Fender amongst them and there are necks in different widths and profiles that I enjoy. Ergo I don't think there is necessarily a perfect neck shape but rather different neck shapes and sizes. Some of those necks I find more suited to different playing styles than others, so they all have their place.

The Warmoth 59 with 1 5/8" I had and is shown in the Tele Build linked in my signature. It was a good neck shape and width however with what I wanted to play and feel on a tele it felt a little thick ultimately for me. So after some years went by I sold it and it now belongs to forum member Zebra who loves the neck.

The other thing with necks even when comparing depth at 1st and 12th fret two necks with similar dimensions and a "C" profile for example can feel different. Whose C profile and how much shoulder there is can make a difference and one man's meat can be another man's poison as the saying goes. To others they may be okay with either of the others preference.


 

Steve_Karl

Senior member
Messages
1,626
stratamania said:
If you change the width of the neck for a given profile it does feel different. e.g. I have Standard thins in 1 5/8" and 1 11/16" and this is the case.
I find it to be the same for me. I have 2 boat necks - one is a 1-11/16" and the other 1-3/4" and they feel quite different all the way up and down.
But some of it might be that the fret heights are very different also.
1-11/16" has ss6100 frets and the 1-3/4" has 6230 frets.


 

daizee

Active member
Messages
29
hhholden said:
daizee said:
Just finished my wide/thin neck install (see other thread), and it fills my hand very nicely vs. the stock CV neck. I'm pretty well convinced that neck volume overall matters vs. merely one specific dimension. VERY glad I decided at the last second not to go with the 59 profile on this 1.75" wide neck, even though I like the thicker/rounder neck on my 1-11/16" Ibanez AM53.
I saw your neck, looks great. What made you choose last second against the 59 Roundback? I don't think I'd like a 1-3/4 nut width, but trying to decipher the relationship between profile and nut width like I said a little earlier in this response.

I read some descriptions of the "standard thin" vs. other "standards", which convinced me that it wasn't THAT thin, and that when stretched across 1.75" it would be enough.

I have size-large male hands, but relatively thin, which means I can hold a lot of volume inside my hands. The narrow nut means my fingers are vary cramped up reaching for nearly my palm. A rounder profile helps with that substantially (think my Ibanez AM53 has equiv to a Warmoth 59 Roundback profile: 1-11/16 w/ 12" radius and ~0.825 behind Fret-1), but so does wide. And flat-wide doesn't rock in the hand. I have a Seagull S6 acoustic with a 1.8" wide nut and the same 0.800" thickness behind Fret-1 as the stock CV neck and the Warmoth Standard Thin. That Seagull is the most comfortable guitar I've played in my left hand. I need more string spacing for open chord accuracy, prevent buzzing, etc. The wider neck prevents my palm-meat from squeezing around and buzzing the high E string too.

It's all so very personal, but I can't fathom the utility of the skinny electric necks unless all one plays is power chords. But I'm a n00b, so keep your salt shaker handy. ;)

 

musicispeace

Senior member
Messages
997
I have both the fatback and boatneck and to my hand they are different. I can play the fatback all right but it is indeed an almighty chunk of timber. The boatneck is, for me, more comfortable and fills my hand. But then you have that slight V thing in the boatneck. I agree about going 1 5/8 nut width as I suspected that was going to feel good with the larger neck and for me it does.

I find the fatback is like a big U as you say, and its nice and I do like it. If you are looking for the rounded U rather than a V you would likely not be disappointed. The closest production guitar I found at a brick and mortar store to try to check out was the Nash strat with the boatneck. I can;t think of anyone doing production guitars with fatbacks. Sometimes we all have to take a bit of a chance and I would suggest going with your gut.
 
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