What to do (if anything) with the #3 control (third potentiometer spot) on a Str

[Neo Fender]

...Strat Pickguard

I’m mentally working up a pickguard for a Stratocaster build.  Today, my thoughts are on a two humbucker, two volume and two tone setup using a spin-a-split wiring scheme. 

I’ve seen four potentiometers in a Strat cavity and it looks like more like a science project than a serious guitar, therefore I’m thinking two stacked (concentric) potentiometers; neck volume/tone and bridge volume/tone.  I understand, Warmoth will drill a pickguard with just two potentiometer holes.  I could go this way and would probably leave the Control 1 spot (closest to the bridge) empty, as I’ve inadvertently spun that volume control down more than once – not something you want to do in a middle of a jam, outside of Madison Square Basement.

Another pot?  Another switch?  I don’t need a jack there, as I already have the angle mounted football jack.  Don’t want or need a kill switch either.

Thanks.

 

[line6man]

Here are some options.

1. Bass cut pot.
2. Varitone.
3. Series/parallel stuff on a rotary toggle switch.
4. Diode distortion control. (*These sound awful, but some people like them.)
5. Dummy control. (To satisfy others when you are asked to fix your tone, but don't want to.)

 

[Cagey]

Y'know - you don't have to have three holes. Warmoth will let you spec/buy pickguards with no switch or potholes at all. Or, any combination of some or all.

You may be working too hard, or at least planning to. It's a LOT easier to have a single volume and tone control, and I'm not sure you even want a tone control. But, let's pretend you do. A single volume and a single tone control is a lot easier to deal with in real life than some Rube Goldberg setup that barely works. With a single volume/tone control, the knobs are always in the same place. There's no searching around for the "right" control while you're playing. So, it becomes second nature. Nothing to think about. Change pickups, you can adjust immediately.

When you're playing live, you really don't want to have too much on your mind. You don't have time for bullshit. Too many other things going on. Things should be fast and easy. You make your guitar complicated, and it becomes your enemy.

 

[drewfx]

Good thing Cagey wasn't a keyboard player!

:icon_jokercolor:

 

[Verne Bunsen]

5. Dummy control. (To satisfy others when you are asked to fix your tone, but don't want to.)

Haha! I like this one!

Y'know - you don't have to have three holes...

You may be working too hard, or at least planning to...

You make your guitar complicated, and it becomes your enemy...

This. Simple is good.

First, to address your proposed configuration, when you say "two volume and two tone setup using a spin-a-split wiring scheme," do you actually mean volume, tone and spin-a-split control for each pickup? The spin-a-splits that I've seen have actually replaced the tone control, so it's just volume and spin-a-split, no tone control. That might be what you have in mind, but I'm a bit unclear with how you worded it. If you want all three, there's the thing you can put in the third pickguard hole: another stacked concentric pot with spin-a-split for each pickup. Can't say I've seen it done that way myself, but I don't see why it couldn't be.

That being said, I repeat my earlier statement: Simple is good.

Here is my take on the configuration you have in mind. I have lots of uses for pickup specific volume and tone controls, there's cool stuff you can do there. Set the bridge red hot and the neck smooth and clean so you can swap back and forth with the flick of the pickup selector, turn one all the way down for cool Zakk Wylde pickup selector stutters, dial in unique combinations of both pickups, there's lots of potential. But I find that configuration is most efficiently executed in a guitar with 4 separate pots. It's been my experience that concentric pots on guitars are actually quite cumbersome in "real world" application. The wrong one is always getting knocked about while you fumble for the right one and I find it really makes for a very frustrating situation. Your experience may differ, that's been mine. And I agree, 4 pots on a Strat starts getting crowded.

If I were designing a control scheme for a HH Strat and I didn't want the standard 1 Volume / 2 Tone configuration, I would go Master Volume / Master Tone and use the 5-way single wafer Oak Grigsby "1/2 Super Switch" for pickup switching and coil splitting. I have diagrams for doing this on a HH Tele, but a Master Volume / Master Tone HH Strat would wire up essentially the same way. I don't have them handy right this moment, but if it's something you're interested in then I'll be happy to post them later. Depending on how you want to do it, you can get:

Bridge (full)
Bridge (split)
Bridge (full) + Neck (full) OR Bridge (split) + Neck (split)
Neck (split)
Neck (full)

I like this set up because it gives you coil splitting functionality without the fuss of push/pulls, micro switches, etc. Here's a good place to find said Oak Grigsby switch (no affiliation):
http://darrenriley.com/store/fender-5-way-super-switch-grigs-0039003000/

If the spin-a-split is a must have feature however, I'd go with a standard 3-way switch, Master Volume / Master Tone, and a dual-gang pot for the spin-a-splits. This will give you one knob attached to one shaft attached to two pots, and will adjust both spin-a-splits simultaneously. There is a good diagram of that set up here:

https://sites.google.com/site/phostenixwiringdiagrams/hh-guitars

That's my two cents. Hope some of it helps!

 

[Cagey]

Good thing Cagey wasn't a keyboard player!

Wasn't?? I'm still smoking, drinking and letting assholes break my guitar strings and scratch my finishes! "Isn't" is the contraction you want  :laughing7:

When you don't hear from me for several days, then you can start sniffing around for that dead chicken smell and speaking of me in the past tense <grin>

 

[stubhead]

I grew up with the 4-knob Gibson setup, all the lovely shadings possible with the three-way selector in the middle - but it does demand attention and nuance, if you're a more modern "preset" kind of player with a "lead tone" and "dry rhythm" and "crunch" all predefined and have no interest in playing things differently according to mood, the four-knob may be a bit much. But I personally would endorse the stacked-pot arrangement, with the bridge PU knobs in the #2 position and the neck PU in the #3 (furthest away). Be aware that if volume-knob pinky swell stuff is vital to you, the stack knobs are a Pain-In-The-Ass, but if you put the volume part on the littlest center knob it's still do-able.

I would also personally wire both HB's with a 2-way series/parallel mini-switch each*, but NOT "coil-cut." If experimenting with various combinations of "quacky" single-coils extracted from each HB matters you can build up to all sorts of switchy complexity, but quack never interested me -
- it's the opposite of clear & loud. <-Me LIKE clear & loud. :icon_biggrin:
The parallel humbucking sound is still clear, bright, and it loses somewhat less volume than a total coil cut. And it makes for some intriguing four-knob balancing acts, once you find the li'l buggers. The textbook lesson on four-knob whoopie is Duane Allman's solo on the Fillmore "In Memory of Elizabeth Reed" - I won't insult you with an Mp3 crap-n-yr-ear link. That Page fellow did OK too, on the live albums - "Since I've Been Loving You" etc. Warren Haynes knows....

XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

P.S. Just read the above about the "Super Switch" and while I have wired up a few for a few things, be aware that they will take a whole day and a whole pot of coffee to wire up, and make you blind, wild & crazy - set aside another 12 hours or so for howling at moons & other pertinent decompressions. However you hook them up, they're not really an intuitive type of tool - if you're like me, I like to think of the simplistic water-running-downhill-thru-li'l-doodads analogy to keep my mind straight as to what I'm doing to the signal. Which can, obviously, lead to a lot of switchy li'l doodads in a row if I'm in one of those moods*. There's a lot of options I know to leave off my guitars NOW, but only because I tried them all myself - not because someone ELSE said "Simplify, young man" or some such thing.

*(Like, for example, I don't initially ever want any switch or position that does the same thing to both pickups at once. I want to hear what it sounds like to have only one pickup changed in combination with the other pickup - and vice-versa. And I am almost baffled by the people who feel some urge to "nail it the first time out" - in fact, if you like to try different pickups, woods, scales, wirings etc. the idea that you can "nail it" like that is goofy & delusional, unless you're doing an exact "homage"-type dead-straight "classic strat" setup or something. How are you sure it's perrr-fect.... until.... :evil4: There's no shame in re-wiring (and re-re-wiring!) a guitar to make it better. Natch, this works a whole lot better if you're working on your own gits, not farming out yer talents to the whole swim team. Other people are a pain in the ass, they think they know what they want until you give it to them, then they want something else. Almost as if they were... human or something. :icon_tongue

 

[Verne Bunsen]

Admittedly, the Super Switch does require a bit more.... patience... than your average switch. It's worth noting, though, that the single wafer Super Switch is only half as infuriating as it's dual wafer cousin!  :toothy12:

 

[Neo Fender]

I'll install a potentiometer and a "Talent" knob.

Here are some options.
5. Dummy control. (To satisfy others when you are asked to fix your tone, but don't want to.)

 

[Neo Fender]

Understood.  I was aware of this but didn't acknowledge it in my kludged up post.

Y'know - you don't have to have three holes. Warmoth will let you spec/buy pickguards with no switch or potholes at all. Or, any combination of some or all.

 

[Neo Fender]

Thanks all for your feedback.  To clarify, I’m using the spin-a split configuration in lieu of the typical tone layout.

The bottom line is I’m trying to duplicate the wiring scheme from a Peavey T-60, which I’ve mentioned in a previous post.  I assume the Peavey wiring scheme below accomplishes the spin-a-split function.

http://www.peavey-t-60-parts-for-sale.com/wiring-diagram.html

Seymour Duncan has a schematic which hits a little closer to home since I plan on using SD pickups (the ubiquitous Seymour Duncan JB/Jazz combo).  However the Peavey schematic shows a 2 way on/on (phase) switch and the SD schematic does not:

http://www.seymourduncan.com/support/wiring-diagrams/schematics.php?schematic=2h_2v_3w_2sas

The T-60 calls for 250K Ohm audio taper pots and 250K Ohm linear taper pots, whereas I will go with what I can find which are concentric 500K audio taper pots.

I may have to use that third control spot for the on/on switch.  Thoughts?

 

[drewfx]

Good thing Cagey wasn't a keyboard player!

Wasn't?? I'm still smoking, drinking and letting assholes break my guitar strings and scratch my finishes! "Isn't" is the contraction you want  :laughing7:

When you don't hear from me for several days, then you can start sniffing around for that dead chicken smell and speaking of me in the past tense <grin>

Actually, I meant "wasn't" as it was back in the '70's when synth players had to reprogram their moogs and arps and whatnot on the fly between or even during songs. The last few decades they just had to remember what preset was what.

I just find the whole "simple" argument a little silly when amps and effects and whatnot have lots of knobs, and historically gazillions Gibson (and Ric and...) players have never seemed to have any difficultly with VVTT setups onstage.

I agree that it's silly to have useless controls on a guitar. And I understand that some people don't use the individual volumes and tones for what they do, but many of us like to roll off just one tone on a Gibson and turn down either one PU or the other to get a particular sound.

 

[Neo Fender]

+1

...but many of us like to roll off just one tone on a Gibson and turn down either one PU or the other to get a particular sound.