Prometheus
Junior Member
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- 135
Oh no, keep the hat. It looks quite fetching on you. Really it does. :icon_biggrin:
Strat Avenger
Hero Member
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Nowadays, the only (and I mean only) legitimate reason for having a single-coil in a guitar is if that guitar is a highly collectable (vintage?) guitar that is worth a fortune, in which case any of the original components that are removed/modified will reduce its value.
Aside from that, the mystery for getting stacked S/Cs to sound like traditional S/Cs has been solved and there's no reason not to use them.
Of course if your particular style consists of "clean" only (meaning, you never ever use overdrive/distortion), then you probably won't get enough hum with a traditional S/C to matter.
Aside from that, the mystery for getting stacked S/Cs to sound like traditional S/Cs has been solved and there's no reason not to use them.
Of course if your particular style consists of "clean" only (meaning, you never ever use overdrive/distortion), then you probably won't get enough hum with a traditional S/C to matter.
DarkPenguin
Senior Member
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- 370
Right....
I come from the perspective that I absolutely HAVE to have the "Little Wing tone" both for my mental health and the need to be able to make that sort of noise in some sorts of music. And in fact the quieter the music is and the less people playing the more important it gets. When you've got five people prancing around and the firewater is gnawing away, strat-tele-p90-PAF-overwound-split-series-parallel-stacked - oh come on. JUST SHOW THEM YOUR TEETH.
I'm convinced to my own satisfaction that it's specifically and only the width of the field that matters for what I want, just because I've tried really hard to get that exact same sound out of every combination of wider humbuckers, mini-hums etc. You'd think a split humbucker with one coil just dead would have the same sound, but I've not gotten it. I don't believe it's a treble/bass, canceled-frequency thing at all, so there's no reason that a stacked single shouldn't be able to get it without sounding "wrong", and that is in fact what I... don't hear, when it's not doing it? :laughing3:
And I also live in a semi-roo-rull area of the country where all the fluorescent bar beer signs are at least 20 years old and getting extremely creative, and all the bar owners had gotten in touch with their inner master electrician right around the time their bar got wired; and I guess maybe all the building inspectors are cheap drunks too? "Experiencing a buzz" gets way meta, way quick 'round these hyar parts, IYKWIM.
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I'm convinced to my own satisfaction that it's specifically and only the width of the field that matters for what I want, just because I've tried really hard to get that exact same sound out of every combination of wider humbuckers, mini-hums etc. You'd think a split humbucker with one coil just dead would have the same sound, but I've not gotten it. I don't believe it's a treble/bass, canceled-frequency thing at all, so there's no reason that a stacked single shouldn't be able to get it without sounding "wrong", and that is in fact what I... don't hear, when it's not doing it? :laughing3:
And I also live in a semi-roo-rull area of the country where all the fluorescent bar beer signs are at least 20 years old and getting extremely creative, and all the bar owners had gotten in touch with their inner master electrician right around the time their bar got wired; and I guess maybe all the building inspectors are cheap drunks too? "Experiencing a buzz" gets way meta, way quick 'round these hyar parts, IYKWIM.
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S
swarfrat
Guest
In this case, the firewater is being served in thimble sized shot glasses, so when the band is playing very very quietly, its even more important that the guitar player's buzz not distract.
S
swarfrat
Guest
Back to the issue at hand. I can do something about my buzz. My mean 90 guitar has a dummy start of the same DCR and the magnets ripped out. I have designed and had a board built but not made a circuit to give the dummy coil about 3db gain, provide inverted and uninverted copies, and give buffered outputs for two pickups where each one can use a balance trim pot to pick the base him/antihum level to inject into the pickup ground. Its a one off, so I'm not extremely worried about EBMM's patent on "exchange of O2 for CO2 through mucous membranes" or the one about "Force for mutual attraction of two distant objects based upon their masses and distance between them"
Dealing with other folks buzz... I think I have a way using the band bus, of which said guitar is a member, containing instruments but not vocals, and feeding the guitars noise gate off that. What I'd really like to do is to move his gate threshold dynamically, but while the board can do some crazy stuff (digital mixer) it doesn't seem to do that precisely. But in effect I'd like to say gate him below -35db when nobody is playing, but when we have stuff going on above 120 hz, back his gate down to -50db or so.
Dealing with other folks buzz... I think I have a way using the band bus, of which said guitar is a member, containing instruments but not vocals, and feeding the guitars noise gate off that. What I'd really like to do is to move his gate threshold dynamically, but while the board can do some crazy stuff (digital mixer) it doesn't seem to do that precisely. But in effect I'd like to say gate him below -35db when nobody is playing, but when we have stuff going on above 120 hz, back his gate down to -50db or so.
DarkPenguin
Senior Member
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There are ways to record away from sources of noise ...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q-qxeC-QOsM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q-qxeC-QOsM
MikeW
Hero Member
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- 976
Street Avenger said:
I've got a single coil in the 8 Ball, but I rarely use it as a single coil. The setup is an HSH and I've got a 5 position switch wired so that in positions 2 and 4 I tap coils from the humbuckers and combine with the single coil to get the correct phase. It's a great solution to the hum problem and still allows nice strat-y sounding combinations.
Strat Avenger
Hero Member
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MikeW said:
Yes, I'm familiar with that configuration (Steve Vai uses it), and had one of my Strats wired that way for a few years. I then tried Dimarzio's "Area" series pickups and that did it for me, so now everything is wired the standard way again.
But yeah, that a good configuration.
musicispeace
Hero Member
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- 1,006
Maybe speak to the man himself, Ilitch, at http://www.ilitchelectronics.com/ I am still not ruling out working with him if the hum really gets me down. His customers seem to swear by rather than at his system options.
markbastable
Newbie
- Messages
- 9
So I have a 90s USA Standard Strat that's totally noiseless. I have no idea why. But if I could work out why, I'd make a fortune.
Super Turbo Deluxe Custom
Epic Member
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Never noticed any of it at gig level volumes, only at the, "Everyone be quiet! Y'all hear that?", volumes.
musicispeace
Hero Member
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What about this guy? http://www.ilitchelectronics.com/pgncs-s/ I haven't tried him yet but I foresee giving it a go on a build I might do in the future. Talked to him on the phone and he comes across well. I am not very accepting of hum in this new century. I put some Klein pickups in a Warmoth build (no RWRP) and love them and am just keeping my fingers crossed. So far with a power conditioner they are acceptable on the hum level and sound good. I'd end up trying out Illitch if they ever really annoy the crap out of me. I know shielding the guitar inside is no cure all but it seems to help a bit and I am all for sum of all parts solutions.
Bill Lawrence L-280's seem to sound really good for noise canceling singles (I would totally try them) and people like the Areas as another option. Wolfetone single coils are supposed to be comparatively quieter because of how he winds them. I am a recent convert to the single coil sound and dynamics and am keeping an open mind but the hum seems really yesteryear in terms of what could be done. The ISP Decimator is supposed to be about as good as noise gates get, although that is not directly about the 60 cycle hum. So, I think there are some options to keep it in check but I am up for giving Illitch a try sometime.
Bill Lawrence L-280's seem to sound really good for noise canceling singles (I would totally try them) and people like the Areas as another option. Wolfetone single coils are supposed to be comparatively quieter because of how he winds them. I am a recent convert to the single coil sound and dynamics and am keeping an open mind but the hum seems really yesteryear in terms of what could be done. The ISP Decimator is supposed to be about as good as noise gates get, although that is not directly about the 60 cycle hum. So, I think there are some options to keep it in check but I am up for giving Illitch a try sometime.
QuasarQuail
Junior Member
- Messages
- 36
After a spell of trying to become a tone crusader gearhead troubleshooter, I'm now way into the path of least resistance:
Single-coils = great for recording
'Buckers = usually the best choice for live gigs
As a classic country freak, I LOVE the sound of single-coils, but I have come to realize that when you're playing live, not a soul in the audience is going to miss the tone of your single-coil pickups, and they definitely won't miss the colossal hum or ear-murdering high-end. And those things only get worse the louder your band plays.
On the other hand, I've heard plenty of loud guitarists with single-coils sound just fine, so who knows. I guess in my old age, I've just decided I'd rather waste time making up riffs than stressing about how to make a 60-cycle hum machine NOT spew 60-cycle hum.
Single-coils = great for recording
'Buckers = usually the best choice for live gigs
As a classic country freak, I LOVE the sound of single-coils, but I have come to realize that when you're playing live, not a soul in the audience is going to miss the tone of your single-coil pickups, and they definitely won't miss the colossal hum or ear-murdering high-end. And those things only get worse the louder your band plays.
On the other hand, I've heard plenty of loud guitarists with single-coils sound just fine, so who knows. I guess in my old age, I've just decided I'd rather waste time making up riffs than stressing about how to make a 60-cycle hum machine NOT spew 60-cycle hum.
TBurst Std
Hero Member
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I think some part of a noise somewhat-free live performance is centered on volume control when not playing.
Maybe I am insensitive to this, I do not know.
Most recently I was practicing with my strat (currently being redone with a new body and an enhanced neck by Cagey) at home. DB were at 101 avg measured at playing position. (I love my wife for allowing me to practice at volume or above even at times). This is in a room with 3 rheostats. No annoying hum while playing. When I don't play, the finger is quick to pull down the Vol (as it is on all my guitars all the time).
When I pull the volume down, all I hear is the cooling fan on the PA. When I play all I here is my guitar and the notes I am playing. And I spend most of my time in positions 1, 3, 5. (Yes the middle pup is RW for HBing in positions 2 and 4).
Side track - position 3? Yes I know a lot of people don't use this but I love the middle pup for things. It's the go to position for anything Trower :headbang:
Maybe I am insensitive to this, I do not know.
Most recently I was practicing with my strat (currently being redone with a new body and an enhanced neck by Cagey) at home. DB were at 101 avg measured at playing position. (I love my wife for allowing me to practice at volume or above even at times). This is in a room with 3 rheostats. No annoying hum while playing. When I don't play, the finger is quick to pull down the Vol (as it is on all my guitars all the time).
When I pull the volume down, all I hear is the cooling fan on the PA. When I play all I here is my guitar and the notes I am playing. And I spend most of my time in positions 1, 3, 5. (Yes the middle pup is RW for HBing in positions 2 and 4).
Side track - position 3? Yes I know a lot of people don't use this but I love the middle pup for things. It's the go to position for anything Trower :headbang:
The middle position is actually pretty popular among heavy-duty "strat guys"* - Knopfler, Clapton & E. Johnson for sure; but in a sneaky way. It's quite common to use the same pickup in the middle and neck position, and because the string is vibrating wider over the neck PU, that one is louder. And if you use a bridge PU sufficiently wound so as to be as loud as the neck (or louder - or HB), you've got a middle PU that's kicking maybe 80% of either neck or bridge. Now what this does is be enough to sufficiently "quack" in the tweeners and supply the hum-bucking part of humbucking (even 40% will do that) BUT - it also gives you an instant "clean rhythm" setting on the git!
You can buy sets that are matched in volume, but quite a few of those sneaky ones use a really overwound or even two-coil humbucker in the bridge, a wimpy middle and a somewhat more ballsy neck PU. Which then corresponds to a screaming lead, clean rhythm, and dirty rhythm selection of outputs into a one-channel amp, all offa one switch. PLUS yo quacky tweeners. Theoretically.... I'm not a "strat guy" but this has been explained to me in excruciating detail time after time*~* by a few extremely talented strat guys; I have a luverly Warmoth HSS swamp ash strat body just lying around, and all the pickups, tuners, pickguard materials etc. I just need to be sufficiently craving the smell of sawdust & mineral spirits to get up offa all fours and DO it. I'm always three projects behind.... :sad1: :dontknow: :icon_thumright:
*(Of which I am not one, nor a "tele guy" or "Les Paul guy"....(?) Boo hoo hoo, I'm a lost soul :toothy12
*~* https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hL5JrivCaLM
You can buy sets that are matched in volume, but quite a few of those sneaky ones use a really overwound or even two-coil humbucker in the bridge, a wimpy middle and a somewhat more ballsy neck PU. Which then corresponds to a screaming lead, clean rhythm, and dirty rhythm selection of outputs into a one-channel amp, all offa one switch. PLUS yo quacky tweeners. Theoretically.... I'm not a "strat guy" but this has been explained to me in excruciating detail time after time*~* by a few extremely talented strat guys; I have a luverly Warmoth HSS swamp ash strat body just lying around, and all the pickups, tuners, pickguard materials etc. I just need to be sufficiently craving the smell of sawdust & mineral spirits to get up offa all fours and DO it. I'm always three projects behind.... :sad1: :dontknow: :icon_thumright:
*(Of which I am not one, nor a "tele guy" or "Les Paul guy"....(?) Boo hoo hoo, I'm a lost soul :toothy12
*~* https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hL5JrivCaLM
