Richlite or other synthetic fretboard material

[DaveT]

I won't use any of the exotic woods for the fretboard neck or body.
I choose maple for the neck because it comes from what I hope are sustainable forests near to Warmoth.

I would happily use something like Richlite.

I have a Kramer fretless bass that I bought new 43 years ago. That has a synthetic fretboard of some kind. It is still fine despite years of using round-wound and sometimes flat-wound strings depending on what mood I'm in.

 

[zebra]

I second this.  From what I hear, Ebony is getting scarce, but sometimes a sleek black fretboard is still a desirable thing to have.

 

[Cagey]

The real crime is that a great deal of it has been simply wasted. While it's a renewable resource, it takes forever to grow, and much of it that wasn't pure black was burned or allowed to rot.

 

[Rick]

About 30 years ago I was down in Oaxaca and going through a forest of Mexican Ebony , I think it's katalox.  I asked them what they used it for and they said firewood.  I almost cried.

FYI, They might grow sugar maples near the mothership, but most of the maple comes from the northeast USA on the other side of the continent.  Same with poplar, or what we call tulip.  Also walnut.  I think Washington state has lots of alder.

As long as the wood is grown sustainably I have no problem with exotics, in fact I like them, though I don't mind man made products.

 

[mayfly]

It's a strange world.  I once heard a story where an entire forest was burned to make pasture for cattle.  This was because the wood in the forest (Brazilian rosewood) became a listed product that was suddenly, because of legislation, very difficult to sell.  So they burned it.  All of it.  For burgers.

Be careful what you wish for.

 

[NonsenseTele]

It's a strange world.  I once heard a story where an entire forest was burned to make pasture for cattle.  This was because the wood in the forest (Brazilian rosewood) became a listed product that was suddenly, because of legislation, very difficult to sell.  So they burned it.  All of it.  For burgers.

Be careful what you wish for.

Take a look a deforestation of Amazon for cattle fields in the next 10 years...
Then take a look what our new president says and does...
Hope you don't need anything that comes from Amazon in 20 years

 

[Logrinn]

Like oxygen ... :sad1:

 

[Nightclub Dwight]

I'd be happy to use Richlite.  I don't have much money, so screw the rich.  But I bet if Richlite becomes more popular, the rich are going to insist on on restrictions and regulations.  Until then, screw them, and continue to make fretboards out of the rich.  Heck, Jeff Bezos is local to Warmoth.  Imagine how many fretboards you could make out of that guy.

 

[mayfly]

But would it have the tone of ebony? 

 

[Cagey]

My understanding and experience has been that the way you tell Richlite from jet black Ebony is the Richlite is TOO perfect. Kinda like the latest diamond fabrication technique - if there are no flaws at all, it's not "real". One of my brothers just bought a new Godin with that fretboard material, and has the same take on it. Lovely stuff.

 

[DaveT]

Well. That stirred things up a bit!
For me Burgers are a 'distress' purchase. I'm hungry, I'm tired, I'm in the middle of 'foreign' on my motorcycle and don't need the hassle of speaking French or German. So I have a Burger - washed down with red wine or beer because you can do that in McDonalds in France.

And I still won't buy anything at all that uses 'exotic' animal or vegetable products.

 

[AirCap]

I don't think the world or its resources are ending any time soon, but I think a replacement for ebony is called for simply because I like choices. The biggest impediment to not using ebony is the stupid guitar buying public who thinks ebony is the best. It's not about what's best. It's about what you want. I want more choices, and Richlite, Rocklite Ebano, and other quality composite materials are just fine for fingerboards. Manufactured fingerboards are more uniform and predictable than wood, and if that's what you want - you should have it. 95 percent of all players can't tell the diff anyway (I'm counting all the doofus players, too - but only because they have money).

 

[aarontunes]

Would everybody still be willing to choose an Ebonal fretboard if it cost 50% more than an Ebony one?
Would people be just as upset about the presence/use of chemicals like methanol and formaldehyde in their fretboards as they are about the environmental impact of using Ebony?
Will using a synthetic material diminish the perceived value or history/prestige of our product?


These are the questions guitar manufactures are asking themselves.


Before coming to Warmoth, I worked in the fine-jewelry business for 25 years. As Cagey said, a Cubic Zirconia is more perfect than a diamond. No inclusions at all, and perfectly white in color. However, they never sparkle quite like a real diamond. To a trained eye they can be spotted a mile away...they are as dead as the eyes on a fish. They also wear out WAY quicker than a real diamond...all the facets become worn/rounded in just a few years. They are infinitely cheaper. A carat diamond might cost $4k - $10k, while a 1 ct CZ costs about $12. They GREATLY diminish the perceived value of any brand that uses them. In the fine jewelry world CZ's are junk.

Fretboards made of Ebonal/Richlite/wood-substitute-dejour aren't as far removed from real woods in price and functionality as CZ's are from diamonds, but they are still different in some pretty important ways. Mostly importantly, they are not a cheaper substitute. They are actually more expensive. They do wear quite well....until it's time for a refret (I'm told...maybe Cagey or someone can weigh in on this.)

I don't really have a position one way or the other. I'm just throwing these ideas out for discussion.

 

[spe111]

Not to be entirely off topic, that cubic zirconia analogy is a good one for people who want to argue that "different kinds of woods don't sound different". I would never be able to tell the difference between that and a diamond, but someone that knows what they're doing can spot it from a mile away. How could that be different for tone woods?

 

[stratamania]

I would not mind trying, for example, Rocklite which is made by a UK company. The do an ebony and rosewood type. It is apparently made from sustainable woods using an environmentally friendly process and according to luthier Chris Larkin can be re-fretted better than ebony. Ebony is prone to chipping for example when redoing frets.

In the US it is available from LMI.

 

[Rick]

Exotic and sustainable are two different concepts. 

I like going out to a local farm, once a year, and buying half a cow, the butcher cuts it up for me and I keep the meat in my freezer.  It's delicious.

If the wood is farmed respectfully, I'm OK with using nature's bounty, it's unlikely man can make something better than nature.  If there is, and it can be done more cheaply, I'm on it.

Anyway, I hope The Aaron has time at the meeting to bring up a field trip to the Alder forest.  It doesn't have to be a video, it could be a photo essay for the blog.

 

[amon]

The problems with the Ebony alternatives are 1) They're too slick feeling under the fingers, especially when you sweat on them; 2) they're tougher on tooling; and 3) the surface is easy to tear up when you clean them, especially with a green scratchy pad.

Actually, I would like an alternative to Maple for a fingerboard.  That is to say, a light colored board that looks like a vintage Fender, but doesn't need a hard finish on it.

 

[Cagey]

Actually, I wasn't talking about CZ vs. diamond. There really is a process now where they can grow real diamond with all the characteristics of naturally-formed diamonds such as are mined in Russia, S. Africa, etc. But, it's too perfect. You don't hear about them much due to he very real threat to the value of natural diamonds and DeBeer's monopoly in that market.

 

[Rick]

To even think that there could be alternatives to natural wood shows that we live in an age of wonderment.

 

[stratamania]

The problems with the Ebony alternatives are 1) They're too slick feeling under the fingers, especially when you sweat on them; 2) they're tougher on tooling; and 3) the surface is easy to tear up when you clean them, especially with a green scratchy pad.

Is this anecdotal or based on an actual comparison?