Rear-routed bodies: getting pots to fit.

[Ace Flibble]

To get right to the point, regular (short) shaft pots don't fit through Warmoth's tops. The threaded section simply isn't long enough and the tops are left too thick. Long shaft pots will fit, but long shaft push-pull pots won't and some types of control pot are hard, if not impossible, to get in a long shaft form (some types of blend pot, Fender's various tone pots and most of the EMG tone and blend pots being the main culprits).

Anyone got a solution to this problem? I was planning on a rear-routed Jazzmaster body and using an EMG SPC control but that's out the window given it won't fit through. The obvious answer is to make the inside of the top thinner, though I don't really see how that could be done accurately enough at such a shallow depth (and/or without expensive, professional routing equipment that I'm sure many of us do not have - at least I certainly don't). Any ideas?

 

[jmohil]

I've run into the same problem (I LOVE the short-shaft bourns pots), and my solution was to break out the dremel tool and carefully route out about 1/8" of wood around each pot hole in the control cavity by hand.  It's not the most elegant solution, and isn't as clean looking as a machine routed job, but it worked.  Even though my work was a little ragged, it's on the inside of the guitar so no one is the wiser!

 

[Steve_Karl]

I've run into the same problem (I LOVE the short-shaft bourns pots), and my solution was to break out the dremel tool and carefully route out about 1/8" of wood around each pot hole in the control cavity by hand.  It's not the most elegant solution, and isn't as clean looking as a machine routed job, but it worked.  Even though my work was a little ragged, it's on the inside of the guitar so no one is the wiser!

Same fix for me with the mini bat switches I use. Dremel!

What do you like about the bourns pots? Are they able to be cleaned if necessary?

I had some sealed ones during the '80s and they felt wonderful. Very easy to turn but eventually the got scratchy and since they were sealed they couldn't be cleaned.

 

[jmohil]

I've run into the same problem (I LOVE the short-shaft bourns pots), and my solution was to break out the dremel tool and carefully route out about 1/8" of wood around each pot hole in the control cavity by hand.   It's not the most elegant solution, and isn't as clean looking as a machine routed job, but it worked.   Even though my work was a little ragged, it's on the inside of the guitar so no one is the wiser!

Same fix for me with the mini bat switches I use. Dremel!

What do you like about the bourns pots? Are they able to be cleaned if necessary?

I has some sealed ones duing the '80s and they felt wonderful. Very easy to turn but eventually the got scratchy and since they were sealed they couldn't be cleaned.

I'm not sure if there's a way to clean them.  I've only been using them for a couple of years...haven't had any issues with scratchiness yet, but now you have worried!  They do feel great though...super smooth.

 

[Steve_Karl]

Well ... take note that the ones I had were probably a much older design than yours.

 

[Cagey]

What do you like about the bourns pots? Are they able to be cleaned if necessary?

I has some sealed ones duing the '80s and they felt wonderful. Very easy to turn but eventually the got scratchy and since they were sealed they couldn't be cleaned.

Bourns pots are very smooth, they're sealed, and they're slightly smaller than the typical 2W parts used in most guitars/basses. Cleanability isn't a feature, though. For that matter, it really isn't a feature on any pot. Once they start sounding scratchy and/or erratic, the open types like the CTS parts many people use can be shot through with contact cleaner and you'll buy a little time with that. But, it's a lot like chemotherapy - it's not a cure. The problem still exists and will come back with guns blazing before long. if you're going to go through the trouble to remove your pickguard, you may as well just replace the pots. It's faster and easier in the long run.

If you expect keep a guitar for a long time, it's worth it in the grand scheme of things to buy some good pots to start with. These mil-spec Clarostat pots are stainless steel, sealed, smooth-operating, and will last a very long time if not forever.

They're a little pricey - $13 vs. $5 for CTS pots - but you don't have to worry about them. For the $16 to $32 adder it'll put on your $1,000+ build, they make good sense. The only downside is for those who need friction-fit armatures for their knobs. These things need set screw knobs.

 

[Ace Flibble]

Cheers lads, looks like I'm going to be making a purchase of a dremel soon then.

 

[Steve_Karl]

Dremels are very handy for many things. I think you'll find it a good investment.

 

[TJD]

I had this exact problem buyt made it work. I used a 1" round drill bit style router. You can buy the individual bit for a few bucks and simply use any electric drill. It has a drill tip to cener it and a barrel shaped shear..kinda like a hole saw except solid thru. I'm sure there's a woodworking guy here who can give you the rear name of the part. Gotta be careful with this method though it worked for me and is super clean looking if you really care about the inside of your guitar. I can send you a photo if you want one tonite when I get home.

 

[bagman67]

I had this exact problem buyt made it work. I used a 1" round drill bit style router. You can buy the individual bit for a few bucks and simply use any electric drill. It has a drill tip to cener it and a barrel shaped shear..kinda like a hole saw except solid thru. I'm sure there's a woodworking guy here who can give you the rear name of the part. Gotta be careful with this method though it worked for me and is super clean looking if you really care about the inside of your guitar. I can send you a photo if you want one tonite when I get home.

Are you referring to a Forstner bit?

 

[Cagey]

Sounds like you're talking about a Forstner bit...

They'll do what you say and are a great solution to the problem described here, but unless you're using a drill press they really need that center point.

 

[richship]

I used a router and a template bit and thinned the whole control cavity out for my Gadget guitar (have to get back to that soon). The wall of the cavity is all you need for a template. Lots of push pull post and switches made it necessary.

 

[TJD]

Sounds like you're talking about a Forstner bit...

They'll do what you say and are a great solution to the problem described here, but unless you're using a drill press they really need that center point.

Yup that's the one. I knew somebody would know the actual proper term for the router bit thingamabob. Worked great.

 

[nexrex]

Sounds like you're talking about a Forstner bit...

They'll do what you say and are a great solution to the problem described here, but unless you're using a drill press they really need that center point.

Yeah, I had to use a forstner bit and a drill press to thin the top on a friends soloist. From my experience, its near on impossible to use them in a hand drill. Even on slow, they are too wobbly.

 

[Cagey]

That's true, particularly of the larger diameters. Smaller stuff you can get away with if you're careful. Still poor practice, but it's doable if there's no finish involved.

 

[Stew]

I'm confused by this ...

Long shaft pots will fit, but long shaft push-pull pots won't ...

Long shaft push/pulls won't fit in a rear-routed cavity? How are people doing coil taps etc. in Les Pauls & VIPs? Sorry, maybe I'm missing something  :icon_scratch:

 

[Ace Flibble]

In a carved top it's a little different, some of the depth is eaten up by the top although it's still a tight fit and actually the carved top Tele can't take them, it's about 1/3" too shallow. In a flat-top rear-routed guitar the long shafts come right down to the back of the guitar and the push-pull bit sticks out.

 

[Stew]

Thanks for the clarification.

Crazy stuff ... who'da thought you'd have to go through all that just to fit pots in your guitar!! 

 

[stubhead]

Seems like it would almost be easiest to forst it if you glued a temporary plug back INTO the hole (or even, gasp, ask Warmoth to leave the holes out and do the whole soup-to-nuts thing yourself). As my devie little mind takes hold, you COULD even plug it with a dowel section hammered into a 3/8" string ferrule - get your heights right, and the ferrule would act as a drill STOP - thought it would eat up the drill bit unless you jiggered it so that the non-cutting inside part of the drill hit the stop. Turn the ferrule upside down...(?)  Machinists, O machinists where art thou...

foolproof - it's a good thing.

 

[Cagey]

Thanks for the clarification.

Crazy stuff ... who'da thought you'd have to go through all that just to fit pots in your guitar!! 

Well, back in the dawn of carved tops, there really weren't many people trying to put 32 bajillion switches and pots in their guitars. You didn't need a great deal of body depth or dangerously thin top relief to accommodate pots with switches attached to their housings or sub-miniature switches that were never designed to be used on wooden panels, and if you use long-shaft pots like you should there's no problem there, either.