Questions About A Guthrie Govan-Style Build

[HALENisking]

Hey Guys,

New to the forum, but I've been on the Seymour Duncan forums for awhile and I've been a Warmoth customer since 2011.

I've been thinking about a new Warmoth project, in the style of Guthrie Govan's sig. Charvel, and I've got a few discussion questions floating around in my head- perhaps a few of you guys can impart some wisdom  :icon_thumright:

As far as bridges go, what would be the closest match I could feasibly get on a Warmoth, since his sig bridge is proprietary? I've found that recessed floyds sort of shape tone in a way I don't care for. I love Supervees, but don't know how they'd compare of fare with a recessed route. Perhaps a Gotoh/wilkinson trem?

Anyone know what the neck profile is like on his Charvel?

And finally, I wonder if basswood would be the most similar option to the roasted basswood body that Charvel makes?

Thanks!

 

[line6man]

I'm not sure about the bridge, but you should be choosing the neck profile that fits your own hand, rather than some other player's hand. You will be the one playing the guitar, so it should feel right for you.

 

[stratamania]

I agree go for a neck profile for you. I've not tried the Guthrie Charvel, but did try the Suhr GG model. I didn't like the asymmetric neck profile too much on it. Although I do like the Suhr even C slim. But that's me and may have no bearing on what you prefer.

For the tremolo the prototype Charvel had a non fine tuner Floyd which is about the closest you will get to what is on the production models now. But again build the guitar for you perhaps as an inspired by Guthrie. The Suhr GG spec had a Gotoh 510 trem.

 

[HALENisking]

I agree go for a neck profile for you. I've not tried the Guthrie Charvel, but did try the Suhr GG model. I didn't like the asymmetric neck profile too much on it. Although I do like the Suhr even C slim. But that's me and may have no bearing on what you prefer.

For the tremolo the prototype Charvel had a non fine tuner Floyd which is about the closest you will get to what is on the production models now. But again build the guitar for you perhaps as an inspired by Guthrie. The Suhr GG spec had a Gotoh 510 trem.

I'm not sure about the bridge, but you should be choosing the neck profile that fits your own hand, rather than some other player's hand. You will be the one playing the guitar, so it should feel right for you.

Thanks guys, great points. I would of course never pick a profile that doesn't suit me, but I do like some different profiles on different guitars, my Warmoths range from the Wizard to the Wolfgang. I think my ideal would be a slightly thinner Wolfgang, but hey. Good to know about the Gotoh 510, the tuner lacking Floyd, and the asymmetrical profile.

Honestly what I want from this project is the incredible tonal versatility he gets from his guitar (Although of course it's in his renaissance man playing as well). I have a similar warmoth build that sounds amazing, but is mahogany/zebrawood, and has super heavy honky mids that are incredible sounding, but not as appropriate for some styles of music.

 

[HALENisking]

I wonder why he opted for the floyd lacking fine tuners...

 

[Cagey]

Modern locking tuners and low-friction nuts have essentially eliminated the need for locking nuts, so you don't need the fine tuners at the bridge any more, either.

 

[HALENisking]

Modern locking tuners and low-friction nuts have essentially eliminated the need for locking nuts, so you don't need the fine tuners at the bridge any more, either.

Sweet, makes sense. I hate locking nuts, love to take them out of the equation!

 

[Cagey]

Well, there are still some situations where a locking nut is helpful, or even necessary. Namely, when you have a headstock design that takes the strings off at an angle from the nut to the tuner, like this for instance...

In that case, you might want a locking nut even if you have a hardtail. The strings are almost guaranteed to hang up on a standard nut, so keeping the thing in tune would be a real challenge.

 

[DangerousR6]

Well, there are still some situations where a locking nut is helpful, or even necessary. Namely, when you have a headstock design that takes the strings off at an angle from the nut to the tuner, like this for instance...

In that case, you might want a locking nut even if you have a hardtail. The strings are almost guaranteed to hang up on a standard nut, so keeping the thing in tune would be a real challenge.

This is true, it's quite possible a locking nut could be of some use in that situation. But for the most part just the string tree bar is necessary. That's all Kramer ever used on the hardtails with a regular nut.

 

[Cagey]

Yeah, but you can't always trust what the OEMs do. Look at all the vibrato bridges before the Floyd. None of them were worth their weight in scrap metal.

 

[musicispeace]

I thought Guthrie had one of the Gotoh two point trem bridges (not necessarily the "Wilkinson") on the video I watched of the prototype of his Charvel. I don't keep up with him that much but I thought I recalled that. I believe he had a Graphtech nut. Somewhere on line should be a video where he talks about his current rig. Musikraft is doing roasted bodies so you might check them out but I am at a loss about roasted basswood. I have at least one example of a Warmoth neck going on a body from another quality aftermarket outfit just fine so that can be done. Last video I saw of his Charvel it had a birdseye maple top on a basswood body and, of course, a roasted maple neck. If you Google interviews with him some where may be something about his preferred neck profile. But as others have said here you ought to go with a neck profile YOU like to play as you will be the one playing it. His pickups were wound by a guy who may be in Germany. You'll have to do your homework if you want to go into that much detail.

 

[DangerousR6]

Yeah, but you can't always trust what the OEMs do. Look at all the vibrato bridges before the Floyd. None of them were worth their weight in scrap metal.

True...

 

[HALENisking]

I thought Guthrie had one of the Gotoh two point trem bridges (not necessarily the "Wilkinson") on the video I watched of the prototype of his Charvel. I don't keep up with him that much but I thought I recalled that. I believe he had a Graphtech nut. Somewhere on line should be a video where he talks about his current rig. Musikraft is doing roasted bodies so you might check them out but I am at a loss about roasted basswood. I have at least one example of a Warmoth neck going on a body from another quality aftermarket outfit just fine so that can be done. Last video I saw of his Charvel it had a birdseye maple top on a basswood body and, of course, a roasted maple neck. If you Google interviews with him some where may be something about his preferred neck profile. But as others have said here you ought to go with a neck profile YOU like to play as you will be the one playing it. His pickups were wound by a guy who may be in Germany. You'll have to do your homework if you want to go into that much detail.

I think I've seen just about every video Guthrie's in at least a couple times...  :toothy12:  Never once a mention on neck profile, from what I remember. Also worth noting, he actually ditched the graphtec ASAP because his heavy trem use was sawing the strings into the slots, lowering his action, messing with his set up, etc...
Thanks for bringing up that Musikraft provides that service, I really appreciate it.
And honestly I love the Wolfgang profile but might gun for the standard C on this one. Oddly enough, I really also want to try an Seymour Duncan Stag Mag in this hypothetical guitar haha. Love his pickups, but I love plenty of pickups, I don't need to go on a wild goose chase with that one.

I will say I have a roasted maple neck on my #1 guitar and it's miraculous, so I'm curious about it possibly showing benefits in context of a body.

 

[HALENisking]

Well, there are still some situations where a locking nut is helpful, or even necessary. Namely, when you have a headstock design that takes the strings off at an angle from the nut to the tuner, like this for instance...

In that case, you might want a locking nut even if you have a hardtail. The strings are almost guaranteed to hang up on a standard nut, so keeping the thing in tune would be a real challenge.

Generally speaking, the biggest factor for me in choosing a headstock design is if the string travel is straight from the nut, (even above aesthetics) for the exact reasons you posted!

 

[stratamania]

I've not seen any reference to a Gotoh 510 on the Charvel only on the Suhr as I said earlier.

Another point to note about a non fine Tuner Floyd, to add to what Cagey said about locking tuners and nuts ( which I think GG opted for bone in the end ) is the following. The only remaining point to lock the strings is the bridge which is exactly what the Floyd will do. An extra contribution to tuning stability.

 

[Kostas]

GG prefers slim necks. Check the specs of his Suhr models, his current neck profile should be close in dimensions. You can also email Suhr for the exact numbers and shape, they will answer you.

He was using 510 tremolos in all his Suhr guitars because John Suhr is always searching and using what he believes is the best available on the market. All Suhr guitars have 510 tremolos unless the customer requests a different bridge.

The Floyd he is using in his Charvel model is the prototype Floyd Rose had created in the beginning. You can find it on the market, it's available again
http://www.floydrose.com/catalog/tremolos/6:non-fine-tuner/original

 

[MikeW]

I've been to the NAMM here in So Cal the last couple years and have played the GG Charvel both times. For my money it's one of the best guitars in the show, hands down.

These are the two that were on display this year (2016).

The neck profile is not quite as thin as a Wizard, but also not quite as thick as a Standard Thin. Charvel is calling that profile the "Speed Profile" in it's latest catalog. Either one of the Warmoth shapes will be close to what GG has so pick your favorite and you'll be close.

The bridge is, in fact, the non-fine tuner Floyd. The only guitar that I've seen it in use on is the GG. He claims he likes them because there's no slippage with the wrappings around the ball. I've not experienced that, but like everything YMMV. I think you'd be pretty close with the Wilkinson bridge. It's got a similar feel as far as touch and range goes. The Floyd does have a heavier block to it so there's a bit more inertia, if you know what I mean.

The pickups are pretty close to SD Jazz - SD Classic Stack - SD Custom (N-M-B). I think the one you'll have the hardest time replicating is that bridge pickup. It's got the growl of the Custom but doesn't have as much compression in the top end, if that makes sense. It's nice and open, doesn't drive the preamp very hard, but can still get pretty gritty if you crank the gain on the amp.

I'm sure you've probably seen this, but I'll post for others to check out as well.
Guthrie Govan Charvel Strat

edit: spelling oopsie

 

[Rich5150]

The Bridge on the production Govan is not a non fine tuner Floyd Rose, it is a Charvel bridge based off of it. He originally had the Floyd Rose on it but changed it, Why I dont know?

 

[Cagey]

I don't know about the Charvel bridge, but I wouldn't want to use the NFT Floyd because of the string clamps and the unwieldy intonation adjustment. What a pain in the shorts! Besides, there are plenty of bridges out there that are just as nice or nicer for less money. For instance, this Schaller part is very similar to the NFT Floyd, but without the clamps. However, it does add roller saddles. Plus, you don't have to carry tools to change strings. They market it as a Fender replacement, but it has Floyd fulcrum post spacings.

It's nice that Floyd Rose finally realizes you don't need the locking nut and fine tuners any more and took all that complexity out of the nut/bridge, but keeping the clamps was an unnecessary complication.

 

[HALENisking]

:hello2:  You guys are killing it with the great info!! Thank you so much MikeW, Cagey, Kostas, Stratmania, and others. Makes me proud to be part of the Warmoth community. Anyways, I agree Cagey, I just don't find a locking tremolo necessary for me, and am looking forward to avoiding the heartache of them.

MikeW, I was hoping to get a response with someone with hands on experience! I'm honestly super surprised that his neck profile is that slim. Just because he is so darn toneful, and has pretty big hands. I will personally shoot for the Standard Thin.

I'm thinking I might honestly just throw another EVH Frankenstein in the bridge. That pickup should be the universal definition of "growly but open sounding" (at least in my book)

Also contemplating the 510, Hipshot Contour, VS100... decisions, decisions