Please help w/ suggestions (seeking LP/PRS tone)

[JerseyTrash]

Hello forum! This is my first post!

I'm looking to build my first project guitar. My objective is to create a superstrat/soloist-style guitar that sounds BIG and THICK like a Les Paul/PRS guitar.

Basically, a compact, workhorse guitar that I can use and abuse on stage. No frills. Kind of like that Gibson BFG series. Only with inlay markers.

For the body, I wanted to get a rounded Ibanez JS style soloist body from here (http://www.perleguitars.com/custombodies.html) with a standard Fender heel for the neck joint.

Then I wanted to get a Warmoth neck.

I figure a mahogany body + neck (Ebony fingerboard for snazz?) might do the trick and at least get me closer to SG territory.

Questions are:

- What bridge do you guys recommend? At first I assumed a recessed Tune O Matic would be best, but I hear great things about GraphTech Resomax wrap bridges. What are your thoughts/suggestions?

- I loathe the super thin/wide Ibanez-style necks (I play pretty low, so its hard on my wrists). Do you guys think the Warmoth "standard thin" is too close to that? Do I need to get something like a 59 Rounded back? Or do you think I'd be fine with the "standard warmoth thin"?

- What PUs do you recommend? I was thinking something close to a P90 sound in the neck, but I'm still not sure on the bridge. DiMarzio ToneZone to beef it up...? An Alnico 2 perhaps? If it helps, I play heavy rock.

Also, please let me know of any issues/suggestions you might foresee with this.

Thanks!

 

[JerseyTrash]

Oh! Additional questions:

- Because I don't like large frets, I assume I'd prefer the 24 3/4" scale, correct? What do you recommend for fret size? 6130...?

 

[greywolf]

If you are going for that sound I would recommend a mahaogany body . either maple or mahogony neck with a rosewood fretboard , 6130's will help with the LP feel.

Pickup wise is pandora's box ,  I have a slew of HB equiped guitars including a vintage LP Custom , ES-339 . amd SG along with several customs .  My favorite PAF's are the Benedetto PAF ( now built by Duncan)  and the 57  Classic's .  Lollar Imperials are delicious , and the PRS Dragon II is also quite sweet .

Check out the sound bytes on the various sites to get an idea.

Enjoy the adventure

 

[Tipperman]

For a PRS-ish tone? Mahogany Warmoth body, your choice of shape. Maple/Canary/Mahogany neck, rosewood fretboard. Neck wood is your choice, but I'd consider the rosewood mandatory. The Warmoth body will also have very tight tolerances, which is good. Pickups? My first choice would be single coils. Lollar p90s, maybe. Roadhouse p90s. If you have to go humboogies, I'd go with a PAF one. BKP Mules, Lindy Fralin Pure PAF. If you want a humboogler option, but a p90 sound, Lindy Fralin p92s are great pickups. 24 3/4 or 25.5 scale is your decision. Fret size really doesn't matter in terms of scale length. When in doubt, go with 6115s. Stainless steel. Locking tuners. I'd personally go for a hardtail. As great as a floyd is for dive bombing/returning to zero and blah blah blah, a hardtail is going to sound a lot better. Thems me opinions, anywho. Look for someone less crazy to chime in, though.

And yes, the Dragon II is a good pickup, but it's overpriced. Then again, so are BKPs and Lollars.. Also keep in mind you cannot predict the final outcome tone wise. So you won't get exactly what you're looking for, but you can come close. If you really want that 100% exact PRS tone, buy a Custom 22.

 

[swarfrat]

If you're looking for a P90 - the GFS Mean 90 (in a humbucker form factor) is great. (but it is a single coil)

 

[bagman67]

I'm very happy with my Santana II pups that I picked up from Pabloman here on this board.  They're mounted in a maple-topped, mahogany-backed tele with a wenge neck, and it's as close to Les Paul territory as I've ever really needed to be (but then again, I'm building an LP anyway, because the body was too beautiful and too cheap to pass up).

 

[Cagey]

Hello forum! This is my first post! I'm looking to build my first project guitar. My objective is to create a superstrat/soloist-style guitar that sounds BIG and THICK like a Les Paul/PRS guitar. Basically, a compact, workhorse guitar that I can use and abuse on stage. No frills. Kind of like that Gibson BFG series. Only with inlay markers.

First off, Welcome to the forum! I think you'll find this to be a fun place to hang out, and there's a great deal of talent and experience here to draw on from people who are happy to share.

There are a lot of variables involved with a guitar's sound, with some easier to change than others to get what you want. I'll start off by saying if you want a Les Paul sound, your best bet is going to be to build a Les Paul out of traditional woods with traditional hardware and pickups. Some hardware updates here and there to make living with the thing easier may be in order, but the basic design has some unique features that are hard to duplicate.

To get a Les Paul sound, you mainly need some competing characteristics. Something with a lot of inertia but built out of a softer hardwood so it's trying to absorb vibrations but is sized so it can't. Something where the neck is shorter, thicker and more deeply buried so it has less influence. Something that uses traditional Seth Lover-style humbuckers so it has a bit of a comb filter built in.

Nothing buries a neck like the Les Paul design, so forget that. But, you can get a shorter neck made of Wenge or Mahogany, and laminate an Ebony fretboard on it to get back what you lose with the Mahogany. Bolt it on with stainless threaded inserts and machine screws to gain some solidity. Few bodies have as much inertia as a thick-bodied Les Paul made of Mahogany with a 3/4" maple top, but Warmoth's carved top Telecaster body style can come close. And of course, you have your choice of about 3.9 bajillion different humbuckers, but the Seymour Duncan "Hot Rodded Humbucker Set" (SH2 neck, SH4 bridge) is iconic. Put all that together, and you'll probably be about as close as you can get. Use locking tuners, no matter what bridge you use, and while you can use a TOM bridge/tailpiece, they're not hard to improve on. I'm a huge fan of the Scartozi bridge, but Gotoh and Schaller make some nice stuff, too.

 

[JerseyTrash]

Thanks for all the excellent suggestions! Its crazy when you start thinking about all the variables when building a custom guitar.

Can someone tell me the difference, tonally, between a mahogany neck vs. a rosewood one? According to the tonewood guide on Warmoth, they seem to be both in that "warm" section. I just assumed because the body of the guitar would be mahogany, a matching mahogany neck would be best.

To give some more reference, I currently play one of these, which I really dig: http://www.musiciansfriend.com/guitars/gibson-les-paul-studio-electric-guitar/517030000008375
I believe mine has BurstBucker Pros in them, which is an Alnico V humbucker. And they sound just fine to me.

So basically the objective of this custom build is to see how to replicate this sound/feel, but with a smaller Ibanez JS body and maybe a few upgrades here and there (like the Ebony fretboard, and a superior bridge...?). But, yeah, I fully understand the whole "if you want a LP tone, build an LP" argument, but that would defeat the purpose.

I know Ibanez made a similar JS to what I'm looking for waaaay back in like 1992 with the JS-6 (http://ibanez.wikia.com/wiki/JS6), but instead of tracking down a used one, I figured it would be easier to build my own. Plus, like I said, I'm sure bridge technology has improved since the old school Gotoh GTC101. There has got to be some better options out there.

I've heard that bolt-on necks can get comparable in terms of sustain/resonance to a set-neck guitar if assembled professionally. So, I'm willing to give that a try.

Anyone with experience with this GraphTech stuff? Or is that just snakeoil?

Thank guys! As always, super appreciative of the feedback/advice. Getting all the factors together is more intimidating than I thought!

 

[JerseyTrash]

Also, does anyone know what is in Slash's SG in this clip?

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/vQ2doH0s1DQ" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Or does anything just sound amazing when plugged into a Plexi?

 

[KaiserSoze]

I'm no expert but I can tell you that I have the following that sounds alot like that clip.
Mahogany strat body, maple/ebony short scale, standard thin neck with 6130 frets.
Bone nut, Roadhouse neck humbucker, DiMarzio AT1 bridge humbucker with RS guitarworks guts.

The neck pickup in particular is very articulate and clear, almost P90-ish but a bit fatter.  If you like this is a clean clip and also a shameless promotion for Ken at Roadhouse......

http://youtu.be/x1y4srPKgNk
Or a bit dirty
http://youtu.be/0MsFD177PDU

 

[Cagey]

Can someone tell me the difference, tonally, between a mahogany neck vs. a rosewood one? According to the tonewood guide on Warmoth, they seem to be both in that "warm" section. I just assumed because the body of the guitar would be mahogany, a matching mahogany neck would be best.

All varieties of Rosewood are harder than all varieties of Mahogany. So, it follows that Mahogany is going to absorb high frequencies more than Rosewood. They may both be "warm" woods, but "warm" is a relative term.

I've heard that bolt-on necks can get comparable in terms of sustain/resonance to a set-neck guitar if assembled professionally. So, I'm willing to give that a try.

When it comes to sustain, it's not so much the attachment method (especially since bolt-ons are more tightly coupled than glue-ups) as much as it's how much vibration the wood itself absorbs and how much inertia there is in the construction. A heavy build is going to be less affected by the vibrations of the strings than a light one.

Anyone with experience with this GraphTech stuff? Or is that just snakeoil?

The experience I have with Graphtech parts says it's not snake oil, but where I've used their parts I've also done other things simultaneously that could have had an audible effect, so I don't have any definitive, objective evidence. The stuff is dense, hard, slippery and lightweight, so it follows that using it for contact points at the nut and bridge would be a Good Thing. Given a choice, I'd use their parts. Unfortunately, they don't give the stuff away. Figure ~$40 for a set of bridge saddles. But, in the grand scheme of things, that's a drop in the bucket that is the overall cost of a complete build.

 

[Jumble Jumble]

Also, does anyone know what is in Slash's SG in this clip?

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/vQ2doH0s1DQ" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Or does anything just sound amazing when plugged into a Plexi?

I can say with 99.9% confidence that in that double-neck guitar, Slash will be using Seymour Duncan Alnico II Pro pickups.

He has his own signature set now, which are aimed at making his road guitars (ie off the shelf modern LPs) sound like his studio axe. If you are after his tone then they're a good choice but BE WARNED - remember, his tone is not actually a completely classic Les Paul tone. It is hella bright. Lots of people complain when they put their Slash sig pups in that their guitar is too bright. If you want the "classic" Les Paul tone then you might well find you're better off with either a pair of SD 59s, or a perhaps Pearly Gates bridge and a 59 neck.

 

[pabloman]

I replaced my Burstbuckers with regular Alnico II Pro's in my LP Standard and it was perfect. It was a sooooper heavy Los Pablo so that might have something to do with it too. :dontknow: