New Body: Fender HM Strat please

[lkja8uatt33]

I'm a bit surprised that Warmoth has never entroduced the Fender HM Strat body style.
It rocks.  Check out the Wikipedia page for it:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fender_HM_Strat

You may notice that the body is a bit thinner than a standard Strat.  But not as narrow as a Soloist. Still a Strat body. Very cool.
Check out this dude playing a pink HM Strat:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fn5fNAWu0U0
Please, let's get it into production by this coming week, ok?
lkja8uatt33

 

[Mor Paul]

Custom order? They offer both a soloist and a stratocaster shape. I can't see much need for middle ground.

 

[GMGM]

I'll agree. Warmoth really needs to provide a 'true' 24 fret option (not 7/8 sized body with 24.75" scale length or an unreachable extended fretboard, or a soloist). I'd still prefer Ibanez' AANJ type joinery, but I'd buy HM in a heartbeat if it was available. It's not just for metalheads, and it's not rocket science. The only reason I see for Warmoth continuing to avoid this market is they are afraid they'll be swamped with orders from Jem-siters and Ibanez fans (who are currently having to pay custom builders and wait 12-18 months for parts.

 

[Mor Paul]

I'll agree. Warmoth really needs to provide a 'true' 24 fret option (not 7/8 sized body with 24.75" scale length or an unreachable extended fretboard, or a soloist). I'd still prefer Ibanez' AANJ type joinery, but I'd buy HM in a heartbeat if it was available. It's not just for metalheads, and it's not rocket science. The only reason I see for Warmoth continuing to avoid this market is they are afraid they'll be swamped with orders from Jem-siters and Ibanez fans (who are currently having to pay custom builders and wait 12-18 months for parts.

What exactly do you define as a "true 24 fret option?"

The options for 24 frets:
Moving neck pickup down
shorter scale
moving bridge up and having a longer neck

 

[tfarny]

Well since they're in business to make a profit, I imagine that being swamped with business is not exactly a fear they have. More likely either they don't see much of a market or they've been asked by Fender not to do this one, or it's at the end of a long list of future projects. They may also think this would mainly cannibalize soloist / strat demand.
They seem to be coming out with innovations regularly this past year - 720 mod, earvana nut prep, new finishes, etc., even semi-new body styles (rear-rout jazzmaster). Let's see if they keep up the pace.

 

[AndyG]

I'll agree. Warmoth really needs to provide a 'true' 24 fret option (not 7/8 sized body with 24.75" scale length or an unreachable extended fretboard, or a soloist). I'd still prefer Ibanez' AANJ type joinery, but I'd buy HM in a heartbeat if it was available. It's not just for metalheads, and it's not rocket science. The only reason I see for Warmoth continuing to avoid this market is they are afraid they'll be swamped with orders from Jem-siters and Ibanez fans (who are currently having to pay custom builders and wait 12-18 months for parts.

What exactly do you define as a "true 24 fret option?"

The options for 24 frets:
Moving neck pickup down
shorter scale
moving bridge up and having a longer neck

Go and play an Ibanez RG or a Jackson Soloist and you'll see what "true 24 fret" means.  The neck joins the body at a different spot, so where your thumb needs to be on a 22 fret neck is where it is to reach the 24th fret, making 19-22 easier to reach.

 

[Mor Paul]

So, that would be choice #3 The reason W doesn't do that is that they make Fender replacement parts. There would be too many problems with people ordering either the wrong neck or wrong body.

 

[GMGM]

It personally wouldn't both me if someone ordered the wrong neck or body. You shouldn't be building (or should I say assembling) without that basic little bit of knowledge. But I do understand why Warmoth wouldn't want that can of worms opened, but still they offer long/short scaled necks with little problem - I don't see why this needs to be any more difficult.

For me, the true 24 neck is the Ibanez AANJ type. I really & truly hate pointy metal guitars, but I want an Ibanez Jem/RG that just happens to look like a Fender Strat (vintage style trem, single-coils, dot inlays, CBS head - just higher fret access). The HM style is one alternative - though not quite as elegant.

 

[Mor Paul]

It personally wouldn't both me if someone ordered the wrong neck or body. You shouldn't be building (or should I say assembling) without that basic little bit of knowledge. But I do understand why Warmoth wouldn't want that can of worms opened, but still they offer long/short scaled necks with little problem - I don't see why this needs to be any more difficult.

Well, to get more frets but keep the scale the same (24 on 25.5), you need to move the bridge and extend the neck if you don't want an extension. The shorter scale necks are designed so that the 25.5" scale body works with them. Halfway between the nut and 12th fret is the same both ways.

If Warmoth did go the way of customizing their bodies and necks for "true 24 fret" goodness, they would have to redesign pickguards, reprogram routers, make sure people aren't ordering imcompatible parts, stuff like that

 

[GMGM]

Scalelength doesn't change. There are many ways to allow for 24 frets. Yes, you can move the bridge, you could also move the neck/heel joint up into the body a bit more (see Ibanez AANJ). And again, it doesn't bother if this requires retooling/redesign - that's kind of my point here. I want classic styling with modern functionality, plain and simple. A true custom guitar without the prices.

Ever since I had carpal tunnel surgery on my fretting hand, that standard strat heel feels like a huge block of unnecessary wood. Many people never go up into those upper frets, Fine, keep buying the same design. My point is that someone is eventually going to capitalize on this market, why shouldn't it be Warmoth.

 

[tfarny]

BTW, they do make a "true" non overhanging 24 fret 24.75 neck that only fits a particular dinky-sized warmoth strat body, and neither one are on the website, you have to call and ask about it. There's a huge thread on here by Gregg, who has a gorgeous korina dual bucker version, search for that.

 

[Wyliee]

Scalelength doesn't change. There are many ways to allow for 24 frets. Yes, you can move the bridge, you could also move the neck/heel joint up into the body a bit more (see Ibanez AANJ). And again, it doesn't bother if this requires retooling/redesign - that's kind of my point here. I want classic styling with modern functionality, plain and simple. A true custom guitar without the prices.

Ever since I had carpal tunnel surgery on my fretting hand, that standard strat heel feels like a huge block of unnecessary wood. Many people never go up into those upper frets, Fine, keep buying the same design. My point is that someone is eventually going to capitalize on this market, why shouldn't it be Warmoth.

You said you don't care about the development work and you want a custom guitar without the costs.  So who do you propose pays for all the development work?  Anyone but you?  It sounds like you're asking for Sak's Fifth Avenue products and services, but you only want to pay Wal-Mart prices.  Those two just don't go together!

 

[HMstratocaster]

Yeah Maybe Warmoth should offer them, I know I would like it, but they'd also have to introduce a 25.1 inch scale neck (that's what the H.M.s have) and plus if they did H.M.s wouldn't as legendary, because then every 16 year old kid with money could get their hands on one.
P.S. As my name intends I know everything there is to know about H.M.s so if anyone has any questions ask me.

 

[thumb55]

I had one of those.  It was only recently I discovered that it'd had a shorter scale length.  Personally, I never got comfortable with the wide neck, and I always thought the neck pickup didn't sound quite like a true strat. 24 fret necks seem to change the balance of the body on a strat.(to me)  RG's (ibanez) with their different horn seem to compensate for this.  You could always ask for a strat body with a different edge radius if you want that look.  I can't find it on the new web site but there was a way to order a strat with a sharper less rounded edge radious, more like a soloist or tele.  That still dosent fix the fret access thing but.....I've suggested in the past to do a "Rusty Cooley'ish" mod to a strat for fret access on strats.   

 

[GMGM]

I'm aware of the short 24.75' scale on a 7/8's body. That's just a workaround. I didn't realize the HM was a shorter scale as well - less impressed now.

I go back to the need (desire) for Ibanez RG/Jem type parts. What kind of development are we talking about? The proof of design concept has been clearly established by Ibanez. It should be a matter of creating CNC patterns, and I've seen these files passed around on various forums between CNC builders (very likely illegal).

The only pitfall I see is legal. It just seems ironic that Ibanez of all manufacturers would have a problem, since they built themselves on the success of their own Gibson/Fender copies. I'd be interested in knowing what their licensing requirements would be.

I'm further suggesting that the investment in development would be quickly paid for with increased sales for these products. Supply & demand. Don't get me wrong, I'm willing to pay for custom builders, but no one can deliver anything. All the builders who enter this market end up closing their doors so they can handle their backlog. They are literally flooded with orders and can't keep up. Legacy 1, ET Guitars, Chris Sims, and on and on.

If your suggesting that Ibanez RG's are Saks 5th Ave, while Fender is Walmart...          I don't get it  ?

 

[lkja8uatt33]

bump - Still want one.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fn5fNAWu0U0

 

[lkja8uatt33]

Personally, I'm not at all interested in the 24 fret neck of the HM Strat.
All I want is the body contour of the HM. Everything else could be the same as a regular 21-22 fret Strat.
I think the HM body contour looks spectacular for a rear-routed Strat.  Wouldn't be good for a top-rout with a pickguard imo.
I realize that the shorter body might mean somewhat of a weight imbalance with a regular scale nect, but "that don't bother me none".

Here's a page that lists out the differences in body shape:
http://heavymetalstrat.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=board1&action=print&thread=464

Below is a pic of just the contour of the HM superimposed on a modern Strat:
http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5090/5344127980_61a7ac2a4a_b.jpg

So, especially considering that Warmoth has lost some bodies (LP recently and Mockingbird a while back) I think that this would be a very nice addition.

 

[stubhead]

I'm all for it - 24 frets, better access to the high note because of the cutaway... and like you said it's not so much for the little finger playing "E" as for the rest of the hand having access around the "lower" 17th-22nd or so frets - you can use your regular positioning. There must be something really special about high notes, because every good guitarist's solos get up there sooner or later. You kinda wonder why we don't just all play octave mandolins or something.

 

[WarmothRules]

I had one of those.  It was only recently I discovered that it'd had a shorter scale length.  Personally, I never got comfortable with the wide neck, and I always thought the neck pickup didn't sound quite like a true strat. 24 fret necks seem to change the balance of the body on a strat.(to me)  RG's (ibanez) with their different horn seem to compensate for this.  You could always ask for a strat body with a different edge radius if you want that look.  I can't find it on the new web site but there was a way to order a strat with a sharper less rounded edge radious, more like a soloist or tele.  That still dosent fix the fret access thing but.....I've suggested in the past to do a "Rusty Cooley'ish" mod to a strat for fret access on strats. 

It would make more sense if it was called the night swan mod :icon_thumright:

 

[GMGM]

Thanks for that link above. What a great resource for making these little comparisons.

Does anyone know much about Fender's 24 fret strat from just a few years back? I guess it was only marketed overseas. Trying to find some info on it.