Lightening a heavy guitar
- Thread starter Doughboy
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swarfrat
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If you sell it, you'll reduce the weight to a few grams
What Cagey said. How soon is the first gig you have where you'll need to hang it from a strap? Days, week, months? Do you have any gigs with your band at all yet, do you HAVE a band...Because all this talk of drilling sideways-radiating mineshafts all through the body radiating outwards from the center is totally batshit crazy. Just accept this one as your sit-down, serious learning and practice tool and by the time the "problem" needs to be fixed, it will have been - I promise.
At the very least, 50% of what is said to be "good" on solidbody electric guitars is just a gradual sedimentation of completely-hilarious B.S. made up by guitar companies who ran out of anything legitimate to brag about 30 years ago. And after enough people repeat this idiotspeak for long enough, it becomes "accepted truth"- with no need whatsoever to BE true...
LIGHTWEIGHT! Lightweight! lightweight... it doesn't matter, because you're not playing 4 sets in six hours at a bar 4 nights a week. And in fact that's totally contradictory in regard to Mantra #2, which is sustain Sustain! SUSTAIN!!! Which is also a quite worthless way to try to decide if a guitar is "good" or not. Name all the songs you play that need you to play notes that sustain more than 1 entire 1000-millisecond long second. Wait a minute - CAN you play any songs, or are you too busy hiding in the closet from your mean old guitar.... somewhere in the new Premier Guitar mag there's yet another review of yet another Beetz-O-Twanker, which according to the reviewer has "it's sustain and tone markedly improved with a TonePros bridge". Except - he didn't take them out of that specific guitar, install a different bridge, and record all the samples and have them analyzed by an audio engineer, did he? If he had, he would've found out what everyone else has known for a decade - the sound doesn't change when you UN-lock a TonePros....
Put it this way - as soon as you can find me five guys who never made it to Carnegie Hall specifically because their guitar was too heavy - I'll find you 500,000 who never made it to Carnegie Hall specifically because their intellects were way too light.
At the very least, 50% of what is said to be "good" on solidbody electric guitars is just a gradual sedimentation of completely-hilarious B.S. made up by guitar companies who ran out of anything legitimate to brag about 30 years ago. And after enough people repeat this idiotspeak for long enough, it becomes "accepted truth"- with no need whatsoever to BE true...
LIGHTWEIGHT! Lightweight! lightweight... it doesn't matter, because you're not playing 4 sets in six hours at a bar 4 nights a week. And in fact that's totally contradictory in regard to Mantra #2, which is sustain Sustain! SUSTAIN!!! Which is also a quite worthless way to try to decide if a guitar is "good" or not. Name all the songs you play that need you to play notes that sustain more than 1 entire 1000-millisecond long second. Wait a minute - CAN you play any songs, or are you too busy hiding in the closet from your mean old guitar.... somewhere in the new Premier Guitar mag there's yet another review of yet another Beetz-O-Twanker, which according to the reviewer has "it's sustain and tone markedly improved with a TonePros bridge". Except - he didn't take them out of that specific guitar, install a different bridge, and record all the samples and have them analyzed by an audio engineer, did he? If he had, he would've found out what everyone else has known for a decade - the sound doesn't change when you UN-lock a TonePros....
Put it this way - as soon as you can find me five guys who never made it to Carnegie Hall specifically because their guitar was too heavy - I'll find you 500,000 who never made it to Carnegie Hall specifically because their intellects were way too light.
Doughboy
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StubHead said:
I don't get your statement at all. Have you never played a couple of hours with a heavy guitar around your neck? I have & do all the time. It's not fun & it keeps getting less fun as time goes by. Reducing it by even a 1lb would make a HUGE difference.
I'll give you an example. I have a strat that weighs 8lbs. I can play it straight for hours & have no problems. I have an almost identical strat that weights 1.5lbs more. You'd think that such a small amount would be bearable, but after a while, it cause problems with my shoulder, neck, then runs down my arm etc. It's not only uncomfortable, but painful. It doesn't matter if I'm playing it in Carnegie Hall. This is a comfort/pain issue, hence my desire to lighten my guitar.
Rhubarbpastrychef
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My guitar doesn't even have strap buttons, sometimes it's nice to sit and play a great guitar, keep it!
Cagey
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Doughboy said:
I don't think Stubby or anyone is denying or downplaying the problem you have. I'm sure most, if not all of us have experienced it. What he's saying is your solution doesn't make practical sense; it's an exercise in futility, which I think others including myself are also saying: you're going around your thumb to get to your elbow. What you need is a lighter guitar, not to modify the one you have. You're going to spend a lot of time and money and not get to where you want to be.
You can get 3lb. bodies. You can get 1lb. necks. You can get junk tuners. You can build a guitar that'll only weigh 6lbs. or so. Just takes patience.
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swarfrat
Guest
If the criteria is Ash body, crazy maple top, and 3lbs, you could do worse than:
And saving your reputation from being labeled an "Art Major" is worth something, is it not?
And saving your reputation from being labeled an "Art Major" is worth something, is it not?
EDITED for clarity & apologetic pre-script:
P.S. (I tend to throw phases like "totally bat-puckie crazy" around rather freely, and I didn't mean to aggress [to initiate an attack, war, quarrel, or fight]. I'm sorry if it came off as overtly personal. :sad1: My bats were referring to the idea, not your general demeanor or state of being. But, if even MY bats don't like it...
)
Umm, 2 hours X 300 times a year X 20 years would be 6,000 times. Only it's more like 40 years, 365 days in a year and I used to practice 8 - 12 hours a day, including a fair amount standing with a band & either a 10 lb. P-bass or 8 - 9 lb. guitar on a strap. Round it off to 10,000 times... My left shoulder is 1" lower than my right.... :doh: :toothy12:
If you already have a Foredom or a Dremel with the flex shaft and hanging stand, this isn't an impossible job at all. If you don't have one, it looks like a little north of $200 will get one. I've never heard of a hole-cutting bit for 30,000rpm machines but you need one. Put your left hand down on the body for support and your right hand on top of that.
The biggest non-time & non-money problem I see would be that in taking out wood from the center of the guitar, the result is a hollow-ish center and a solid, heavy perimeter. I don't know what that would sound like, but I do know that there are dozens or hundreds of guitar designs with the exact opposite - heavy center, hollow wings. My guess would be there's a reason for that, but maybe not.
If you held a gun at my head and said "Lose two pounds!" I would use a hole-cutter bit and start taking 1.5" deep plugs out around the perimeter from the back and then connect them via HAND chisel to make chambers, chamfer the inside edge of the chambers then cover the back with a nice 3/32" hardwood plate. Besides the gun, you're gonna have to buy me about $300 - $500 worth of tools. Since you've got the gun I won't charge you for the 20 - 25 hours it's going to take, but if it sounds like crap you don't get to shoot me, it's still your fault. :icon_thumright:
If you keep an eye on Ebay, there's a whole category of nice bodies that have been goinked by bad ideas and/or bad craftsmanship. It can be instructive, in a way. As can the observation of how gadzillions of trained smart people have approached the question of "light solidbody guitar?" As can the observation that discomfort is part of playing - Jerry Garcia played a 13 lb. guitar for 15 YEARS because he liked the sound, many of Mahavishnu John McLaughlin's greatest early momos came with either his Gibson EDS 1275 doubleneck or his THIRTY-POUND Rex Bogue "Double Rainbow."
When you ask a question and twenty people all give you the same answer - "There are other pretty tops" - it's not because we conspire against you.
P.S. (I tend to throw phases like "totally bat-puckie crazy" around rather freely, and I didn't mean to aggress [to initiate an attack, war, quarrel, or fight]. I'm sorry if it came off as overtly personal. :sad1: My bats were referring to the idea, not your general demeanor or state of being. But, if even MY bats don't like it...
)Umm, 2 hours X 300 times a year X 20 years would be 6,000 times. Only it's more like 40 years, 365 days in a year and I used to practice 8 - 12 hours a day, including a fair amount standing with a band & either a 10 lb. P-bass or 8 - 9 lb. guitar on a strap. Round it off to 10,000 times... My left shoulder is 1" lower than my right.... :doh: :toothy12:
If you already have a Foredom or a Dremel with the flex shaft and hanging stand, this isn't an impossible job at all. If you don't have one, it looks like a little north of $200 will get one. I've never heard of a hole-cutting bit for 30,000rpm machines but you need one. Put your left hand down on the body for support and your right hand on top of that.
The biggest non-time & non-money problem I see would be that in taking out wood from the center of the guitar, the result is a hollow-ish center and a solid, heavy perimeter. I don't know what that would sound like, but I do know that there are dozens or hundreds of guitar designs with the exact opposite - heavy center, hollow wings. My guess would be there's a reason for that, but maybe not.
If you held a gun at my head and said "Lose two pounds!" I would use a hole-cutter bit and start taking 1.5" deep plugs out around the perimeter from the back and then connect them via HAND chisel to make chambers, chamfer the inside edge of the chambers then cover the back with a nice 3/32" hardwood plate. Besides the gun, you're gonna have to buy me about $300 - $500 worth of tools. Since you've got the gun I won't charge you for the 20 - 25 hours it's going to take, but if it sounds like crap you don't get to shoot me, it's still your fault. :icon_thumright:
If you keep an eye on Ebay, there's a whole category of nice bodies that have been goinked by bad ideas and/or bad craftsmanship. It can be instructive, in a way. As can the observation of how gadzillions of trained smart people have approached the question of "light solidbody guitar?" As can the observation that discomfort is part of playing - Jerry Garcia played a 13 lb. guitar for 15 YEARS because he liked the sound, many of Mahavishnu John McLaughlin's greatest early momos came with either his Gibson EDS 1275 doubleneck or his THIRTY-POUND Rex Bogue "Double Rainbow."
When you ask a question and twenty people all give you the same answer - "There are other pretty tops" - it's not because we conspire against you.
Doughboy
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I finally got this back from my luthier today. He routed out as much as he could under the pickguard & used a dremel to drill sideways as well.
The result was 3/4lbs less in weight which puts the guitar is a comfortable zone for me.
The strat sounds almost the same, but a wee bit more fat sounding for some reason. I like this better since it was a a little shrill & high endy before. No idea how this happened, but over all, it was successful & my neck & shoulder are happy. :hello2:
The result was 3/4lbs less in weight which puts the guitar is a comfortable zone for me.
The strat sounds almost the same, but a wee bit more fat sounding for some reason. I like this better since it was a a little shrill & high endy before. No idea how this happened, but over all, it was successful & my neck & shoulder are happy. :hello2:
Jumble Jumble
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mullyman said:
Doughboy said:
Phinox said:
Kids these days and their reading comprehension.
StübHead said:
Kids these days and their mental arithmetic.
C
Cederick
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Tie some helium baloons to the guitar
ThtOthrPrsn
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I hear that nowadays you can hire someone to carry it for you, rumor is they do it just for the company.
S
swarfrat
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Equally as radical is Finn Schatvet-Riisager's lightening mod: (His fretboard extension is also pretty radical - I swear I saw some older pics where he had mounted a rosewood two string 1 fret extension behind the nut, but his approach is much simpler. Only the 1st and 2nd strings pass over the nut. 4-6 are actually "zero-fretted" at the 1st fret. So he gets open strings in P4 tuning. I also like his jack placement
I've seen this guy's guitar a few times since I've been playing P4 tuning for a while - and it's plastered all over 30% of the internet resources on P4 tuning. Recently he posted this video, and I thought "Doh! I bet these guys are known as "the band with the guitar player with the piano fingerboard".
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6OciokNaM-o&noredirect=1
I've seen this guy's guitar a few times since I've been playing P4 tuning for a while - and it's plastered all over 30% of the internet resources on P4 tuning. Recently he posted this video, and I thought "Doh! I bet these guys are known as "the band with the guitar player with the piano fingerboard".
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6OciokNaM-o&noredirect=1
