Kreig's Master Class "Vibrato without the bar"

[kreig]

Not to leave anything to chance, I'm assuming everyone here knows that those areas on those finger tips is where you make contact with the strings.
All 4,NOT 3 fingers.
and no smart-aleck posts. . . you know who you are ! There are beginners watching, or budding axe-slingers in the shadows.

The next pic is how someone normally holds a pick.

The last pic is my first "secret of the Turtle Master" , I call it "Choking up on the pick", like a baseball bat . This tip alone is worth it's weight in gold.
Try it right now, and during your next woodshedding practice.And yes that much.

More tips uploaded tonite. :hello2:

 

[stratplayer1]

just push on the floating floyd with your hand instead of the bar kinda like pushing above the nut adds string tension just push the bridge down it adds tension, I'm not that gone, yet..

 

[mayfly]

When playing my old Ricks, I just shook the guitar or moved the neck back/forth.
Doesn't seem to work on my warmoth teles...

seriously now, my vibrato is all done with at least two fingers on the string, moving it up and down as slow as I can.
If I'm using the bender guitar, you can get a really nice controlled vibrato on the B string with some practice.
Then there's aways the option of grabbing the string behind the nut - again you need more than one finger for this.

 

[mayfly]

OK testing

Kreig buddy!  You really gotta get your fingertips checked out at the local hospital!  :laughing7:

 

[Mor Paul]

Looking forward to it. I like using my fingernail to push the string up and down on larger frets. It works best on the higher strings, and it's really subtle.

 

[kreig]

What I'm doing is a primer, all based around Control of your instrument as opposed to it controlling you.

This is called palming. Use the area of your palm I blacked out, and you place it in the "Hot Spot", exactly where I placed that pen, just in the first inch
of the strings from the saddles.Anyother placement of palming is . . . ILLEGAL! Don't do it! ever!
Palming is used for muting, staccato, sweeping and a little trick I do called "Raking", as in leaves.(I'll explain later)

Now, Another Turtle Master secret - pay very close attention to that area on the side of my thumb, it's a HUGE tool. in fact, take a marker and pen that mark on your thumb in that exact area. That's the area I use ALOT. It's used for muting, harmonics, and "pinch" harmonics and another trick that I won't reveal, yet,as it is a part of my signature sound.


and your hand placement  should look like the 4th pic.

 

[kreig]

THE GOLDEN CIRCLE

Here's where it gets JUICY.

Another HUGE amount of knowledge . . . In Zone One, that is called "The Sweet Spot", where ALL the best harmonics CHIME,SPARKLE,SUSTAIN.
But you need to master "pinch harmonics", because thats what you do in the "Sweet Spot".

Zone 2 is where most others do there "pinch harmonics". Still a place of usefulness, but never as HUGE sounding as Zone 1.

If you have an insight on those "pinch harmonics", now would be a good time to post . . .

Are we having fun yet? :hello2: :hello2: :hello2:

 

[RLW]

Okay. You have posted pictures of guitars, and black spots on fingertips. This grasshopper is still waiting, oh Master. And, that's not sarcasm. When you toss out the word "master", you sure as hell better to be able to deliver. Now. Prove me wrong, and make me eat my words. Master.

 

[kreig]

Sorry, I'm done for the night. There's alot to chew on for some out there . . . and don't call me master! well, unless you got man boobs.

and I'm a master of turtles . . . that's all.

 

[DangerousR6]

just push on the floating floyd with your hand instead of the bar kinda like pushing above the nut adds string tension just push the bridge down it adds tension, I'm not that gone, yet..

Agreed, I just use "THE Floyd".... :laughing7:

 

[dbw]

:icon_scratch:  Mkay.  Normally I'm the polite one and RLW is the honest one, but... kreig, get over yourself.  I'm no Hendrix but I don't appreciate being offered lessons.  And I imagine the guys who've been playing longer you've been alive appreciate it even less.

 

[kreig]

OK I'm PISSED... Have you even read this thread from it's 1st post ? Are my posts VALID OR NOT !

I await ALOT of apologies in the morning when I awake ! ! ! This Pig-pile mentality here is so more than I can handle.

Should I call my 30+ years playing ... NOTHING? Doctors have less experience in ther field.

You guys just can't get past the word "Master" being used . . . But don't tell anyone you call yourselves Unofficial Overlords . . .

I'm out of here,. . . just as soon as everyone reads my last post!

I'm sorry for trying to bring something to this forum. Like learning the guitar. and this is all on you dbw.

 

[dbw]

All right... I'm not gonna get into a flamewar over this.  I'll steer clear of this thread 

 

[stubhead]

Maybe some people don't like the approach - I figure they come here for several things, but guitar instruction might not be one of them. (I tend to only smart-ass posts when I think it's appropriate, or they can handle it, or it's funny, or or or....) When I think of vibrato, I tend to think of the forward-backward violin-type that Allan Holdsworth, Vai and others use; the slow, sideways, timed-to-the-beat stuff that Clapton popularized - try this doubled, quadrupled and tripled too; and the shaking-type that's not necessarily timed to the beat... (though it can be). The bar can be used to play any of these, and it's great bar practice to learn to duplicate your own left-hand vibrato, once you've spent a decade or so getting that together.

I followed the Morse/McLaughlin dictates of no whammy bar for most of my 37 years of playing, but after hearing "Nadia" one too many times I had to put a non-locking bar on my latest seven string - no, they don't come that way. Playing pedal steel for a decade now has made me greedy for more interesting vibratos, I guess, and my recent short-scale fretless bass even more so - Cello Suites, anyone? I'd have to say, the best way to learn the various schools of vibrato is first to learn how to listen CAREFULLY - no background, "driving music" here - then to THINK about what people are doing to get what you hear. Classical violinists and Indian musicians, both instrumental and vocal, are the way to go. The Indians have a whole set of terminology and exercises to approach this. NO opera singers, plz....Yoko?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bYqN-3JEe1Y

Listen carefully to what he's doing between 0:34 and 0:50, then do that... you don't need a bar, if you think about it. MOST of my favorite guitarists can imitate slide guitar with their fingers - Beck, Johnson, Morse, Poland, Noy, Timmons etc. - it just goes with the territory.

 

[blue313]

I thought Vai used more of a circular vibrato, but I could be wrong.

I admit I'm not a huge tremolo user nowadays.  I do love the effects that it can create (as well as things like divebombs or screaming pull ups that are nigh impossible without one), it just doesn't seem to do all of the effects I'm looking to produce with it alone.  I'm just more of a hardtail guy at the moment.  I do intend to build a soloist with a floating trem soon enough (I never should have sold that Ibanez S470).  All that I have now is a hacked up Squire fat strat with a cheap, craptastic, dull edged Floyd Rose II

I think stubhead is spot on in saying it's probably just the approach that's throwing people. I also agree in regards to Yoko's warbling.  It's worse than Donna's wailing in GD shows where she cant hear herself sing :laughing7:

Don't let that stop you though Krieg, I'm still interested in what your approach is.

 

[stratplayer1]

I'm quite curious also i love to compare my technique to other people, you can learn alot just by watching people play

 

[guitlouie]

I should probably stay out of this.  But, nah.  Kreig, my man, I think that what is happening here is that you are trying to tell a group of guys that are enthusiastic about building guitars, and hence probably have at least a little experience with the instrument, " Here, this is how to hold a guitar".  It just seems to me, and I could very well be wrong, that if someone is serious enough about playing guitar that they would go so far as to build their own custom guitar just to get everything they have ever wanted in an instrument, well, they just might be a little past the point of "Use this part of the finger to press on the string."  Like I say, I'm not trying to irk you, and I will not post any more in this thread, I just thought I might be able to shed some light on what was going on here. 

 

[DocNrock]

Kreig, what I pick up from your vibe here is that you are very outgoing and have definite opinions on things.  That's OK.  The flip side is, don't be pissed if people question this, particularly those of other opinions.  People who build guitars likely are not beginners at playing.  That said, they all probably have their own version of vibrato, which gives each and every one of us our "unique sound."  I love my vibrato, but I'm not going to try to sell it to everyone here.  If I posted a sound clip and someone said, "whoa, how did you do that vibrato?," then I might post it.  I doubt they would say that, anyway.  If you were Joe Satriani, Steve Vai, or any other professional guitarist, people might respond differently.  I know you meant well, but I think the way you intended to come across is different than the way you came across.  Is that fair?

In deference to your 30+ years of playing, I've only been playing for 25 years.  In response to your statement about doctors who have less experience, I've only been a "full-fledged" surgeon for 8 years, but was in training to be one for 10 years prior (college, med school, and grad school).  Which do we count, 8 or 18?  Or, should I count K-12 education?  I can tell you that I AM a professional surgeon; I am no where near a professional guitarist.  Yet people put their lives in my hands everyday.  My vibrato may not be as robust as BB King's, but I can do a Whipple resection.  In fact, I have one coming up next week.  For what it is worth, a Whipple is much more technically difficult than a vibrato.

 

[Mor Paul]

People who build guitars likely are not beginners at playing.

:toothy11: I just got my first amp today. I should probably practice more.

 

[stratplayer1]

sweet whatd ya get max?