Help With Grain Filler

ZackPomerleau

Active member
Messages
84
So I am confused, do I put it on a rag, and pretty much wipe it all on, or do I one by one go into each grain streak, etc, and rub it in?
 

-CB-

Senior member
Messages
5,427
This is only my way.... there's more ways than this....

What I do is "scrape" it into the grain. 

I take one of those sample credit cards and literally wipe it with a thick coat of filler all over the body, trying to wipe "cross grain", and not leaving thick spots of filler or streaks of filler - less heavy sanding.

If you're doing a solid color or opaque - the super glue filler (over colored filler if you like) works GREAT.  I mean its the tits.
 

Tonar8352

Senior member
Messages
2,195
I brush it on across the grain.  Let it flash off i.e., loose its shine and then squeegee it off with a plastic squeegee.  The last step is to wipe any excess off with burlap.  Here is a Tele ready to get the squeegee.  You can see the burlap at the back of the guitar.

IMG_1269.jpg


Here it is wiped off and ready for sealer coats.

IMG_1273.jpg

 

ZackPomerleau

Active member
Messages
84
So I rub it on the WHOLE Body, and working it into the grain, then letting it sit for awhile, then using a cloth or something and take it all off, correct?
 

ZackPomerleau

Active member
Messages
84
Also how long should I wait to remove, sand, etc? .


  Am I right to assume you do not apply going the direction of the grain?
 

-CB-

Senior member
Messages
5,427
1.  Do a section at a time, till you gain experience.

2.  Depending on the filler, you may need to re-fill.  I like to let it sit days...
 

ZackPomerleau

Active member
Messages
84
So do I put it on a cloth and really rub it in for awhile and spread it, then do the same, and keep doing it til the Guitar is covered, then let it sit for an hour (I was told) then remove excess, do it again the next day, then sand it out? that all?
 

-CB-

Senior member
Messages
5,427
depending on the filler... not an hour.. more like 3 minutes

Hey and... Zach... you related to the Mad Snooker, Capt Dave?
 

ZackPomerleau

Active member
Messages
84
So put it on, three minutes, burlap or something, then maybe some sanding, then ready for sealer, unless another coat is needed (which I preceed to follow the steps). And I dont think I am :-D
 

Patrick from Davis

Senior member
Messages
2,197
I have been using the Stew mac water based clear grain filler on some deep grain.  I paint it on thick with a brush, wait five minutes, scrape it off in the direction of the grain.  Wait a day for it to dry, and look at the damage.  I will warn you, it looks filled right after the scraping, first try.  I am a God!  Next day, it looks like you have not done anything, Crap!  After about five or so fills, if the grain is deep that is, it starts to really show some progress.  After the five minute wait, when you scrap it off, the filler starts to become snotty.  You should have something to clean the edge of the scraper with.  I use an old cream cheese container filled with water.  After one day it sands well.  After three day it is like taking a whack at granite.  It continues to shrink as it dries.  So keep filling til you think you are done, take a break for a couple of days and then look at it.  If the depressions are minor, or if you are friggin' tired of grain filler, move on to the sanding sealer step.
Patrick

 

-CB-

Senior member
Messages
5,427
Zack....

The important part of what is being said is flying right by you.

YOU have to know your materials. 

The basic procedure is apply, let firm, scrape, wipe, dry, sand - REPEAT IF NEEDED - then seal if you prefer, then finish.  If there's dye, you can dye first and spot fix later after sanding, before sealing.

How to apply, how long to wait, how to scrape, sand, etc... if you need to reapply (you probably do)... this is all up to you, because nobody knows what you're using, how you're using it, the wood you're applying it to.. and even if we did, its you, not us who's doing it.

TEST

TEST

TEST

and

TEST

Capisce?
 

ZackPomerleau

Active member
Messages
84
Well guys, guess what, I did it! It was SOOO hard taking that excess off, thanks to steel wool it was better, and, now, eight hours later, it is nice and smooth, except for one spot where a half inch of grain is felt, I think it is time for sealer, so yes! :hello2:
 

Mr Real Nice

Senior member
Messages
208
dumb question time....is it necessary to seal even for an opaque finish?  Seems like after the grain is filled, I should be able to go right onto the primer, no?  I'm using poly paint with SprayMax 2k Rapid Primer Filler as the primer coat.  Would the primer act as a sealer, too?
 

Soloshchenko

Senior member
Messages
430
Tonar, how on earth are you "wiping off" all that filler on the tele? In my experience filler dries into something resembling rock in a matter of minutes. Have you just applied all of the filler for picture one extremely quickly and then quickly removed for pic 2?  :icon_scratch:

 

Tonar8352

Senior member
Messages
2,195
Insert Quote
Tonar, how on earth are you "wiping off" all that filler on the tele? In my experience filler dries into something resembling rock in a matter of minutes. Have you just applied all of the filler for picture one extremely quickly and then quickly removed for pic 2?  



First let me say I am going after early vintage style finishes.   There are much more effective ways to seal grain on a piece of wood.  Remember, Fender switched from ash to alder just to save on the labor involved in preparing ash to finish.  Then they started using Fullerplast to lock the wood up real tight for finishing in around 63.

When I first brush it on its shiny, once the sheen dulls it is ready to remove as seen in the picture.  It is usually about 15 minutes after it is applied depending on weather.  It is very labor intensive and does take some muscle to get it all off.  I do a second application after the first one shrinks for a week and has one wash coat of sealer on the body.  

The best stuff I ever used was the old Dunn-Edwards 8-9 Paste Wood Filler but thanks to EPA it no longer available so I make due with the Jasco. I use the Jasco because I like the color I get on the ash after it is applied. I can also tint it with color in oil so if I’m doing some crazy color like blue I can make blue filler.


 

Soloshchenko

Senior member
Messages
430
Tonar8353 said:
Insert Quote
Tonar, how on earth are you "wiping off" all that filler on the tele? In my experience filler dries into something resembling rock in a matter of minutes. Have you just applied all of the filler for picture one extremely quickly and then quickly removed for pic 2? 



First let me say I am going after early vintage style finishes.  There are much more effective ways to seal grain on a piece of wood.  Remember, Fender switched from ash to alder just to save on the labor involved in preparing ash to finish.  Then they started using Fullerplast to lock the wood up real tight for finishing in around 63.

When I first brush it on its shiny, once the sheen dulls it is ready to remove as seen in the picture.  It is usually about 15 minutes after it is applied depending on weather.  It is very labor intensive and does take some muscle to get it all off.  I do a second application after the first one shrinks for a week and has one wash coat of sealer on the body. 

The best stuff I ever used was the old Dunn-Edwards 8-9 Paste Wood Filler but thanks to EPA it no longer available so I make due with the Jasco. I use the Jasco because I like the color I get on the ash after it is applied. I can also tint it with color in oil so if I’m doing some crazy color like blue I can make blue filler.

Cool, yeah I'm a big fan of your tele finishes. Seems I am leaving far too much filler on there and letting it harden. Then having to sand off loads (hence why I detest filling!!). On my new swamp ash bass I'll get scraping first and get the filler down to a minimum, thanks. 
 

Mr Real Nice

Senior member
Messages
208
So is the goal of sanding the filler to remove ALL the filler from the surface or to just sand it down smooth?  I have a clear thin layer of hardened sealer on my body and I'm not sure if I should somehow try to painstakingly remove it or just sand the whole thing smooth.  It feels really really smooth, but like I said, I'm not sure if I can/should leave that thin layer of clear filler before sealing.  Hell, it practically seems to be a sealer itself.  I'm using the Lawrence McFadden grain filler from stewmac, by the way.
 

-CB-

Senior member
Messages
5,427
Tough to answer...  depends on the wood, the desired finish.  If you use a really flat sanding block, you may notice that some places are "dipped" and you can let those have a thin layer of filler.  By thin I mean just a very thin see though layer.  If the dip is deeper you need to sand it flat to get rid of it - especially if you have a clear or translucent finish.
 

Mr Real Nice

Senior member
Messages
208
nah, it's not really dipped at all.  It's a pretty uniform layer, actually.  It's solid mahogany and it's going to get an opaque finish.
 

dmraco

Senior member
Messages
4,651
this thread is very helpful...one question:

Can you use a dye after the filler is applied??
 
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