Electric XII string tree/retainer Required?

[Day-mun]

As indicated in the thread title, I am wondering how necessary (if at all) is the string tree/retainer for Warmoth's XII neck; absolutely required, or are the tuner reams in line with the nut slots well enough to omit the guide?

 

[Rick]

What’s about staggered tuners?

 

[swarfrat]

A lot of string retainer bars are just straight with no slots:

 

[PhilHill]

Ideally, you want the strings to run straight through the nut slots , leave the nut with a slight downward angle and have a straight run to the tuner post without touching anything else. If that is possible without the guide, then you don't need it, but if they run up against the other posts then you need the guide to relocate them.
  It's hard to tell in the photo if they would hit anything or not. The only way to really tell would be to remove the guide and restring and see if they hit anything other than their intended target.

 

[Day-mun]

:doh:the photo was snagged off Google. I don't know what W's design is like because I just placed my order (don't have the neck yet). Plan on putting on two sets of Fender/Kluson style tuners (one righty set and one lefty set), which are ordered, so the staggered post ship has already sailed. I am not concerned about the downward break angle as much as I am the side-to-side angle. -Yeah, want to know if anyone has had experience with the 12-string Warmoth necks and can report on tuner posts lining up with string slots so strings pass through the nut with minimal/zero kink for lack of a better word.

 

[Fat Pete]

Here's the relevant end of the 12 I put together. Played very well without a retainer, though it did go to a pro for set up.

 

[Rick]

Pete your taste is top notch.

 

[mayfly]

Hi hate to go against what the esteemed member Pete as posted...


... but on my warmoth 12 I needed the retainer even with staggered tuners.  In my case, the small octave strings would jump out of the slots without too much effort.  The string tree solved it, and it looks authentic.  BTW, the tuners that I used were Sperzel sound-lok.

 

[Day-mun]

Here's the relevant end of the 12 I put together. Played very well without a retainer, though it did go to a pro for set up.

Thanks, Pete! I think I will try without first. If it goes south and the octave strings get jumpy it can always be added later, right?

 

[Day-mun]

...In my case, the small octave strings would jump out of the slots without too much effort.  The string tree solved it, and it looks authentic...

Mayfly, where did you get your "authentic" style retainer? So far, I haven't found one similar to the one in the OP's screen shot FS online.

 

[Fat Pete]

...In my case, the small octave strings would jump out of the slots without too much effort.  The string tree solved it, and it looks authentic...

Mayfly, where did you get your "authentic" style retainer? So far, I haven't found one similar to the one in the OP's screen shot FS online.

Clearly I can't speak for Mayfly, but angela.com used to have some NOS, but sold out some time ago. Fender are, or have been, making an Electric XII in their 'Alternate Reality' series, so a Fender dealer might be able to source you one as a spare part.

Someone is selling spare retainers for Fender's Villager acoustic 12 on Reverb - they're the same style, but only have 6 string holes.

 

[Day-mun]

Yeah, Pete, I saw that six holer for the acoustic and figured that wasn't what I was looking for based on the images I was getting on Google when searching "electric XII headstock".

 

[Day-mun]

I am hoping to get away without it (-as a rule, I usually find string trees/guides to be completely unnecessary, and so they're typically omitted on my builds), but if I have an experience like Mayfly's, then I'd like to know where to find one that's authentic for the headstock shape.

 

[mayfly]

...In my case, the small octave strings would jump out of the slots without too much effort.  The string tree solved it, and it looks authentic...

Mayfly, where did you get your "authentic" style retainer? So far, I haven't found one similar to the one in the OP's screen shot FS online.

I'm sorry to say that I can't remember!  This guitar was made some time ago.  I remember that it was a real fender part, and was not cheap (although it's high quality).

 

[stratamania]

As far as I know there was a member on an Offset guitar forum who was making small numbers of those retainers. I happened across something a while ago mentioning that while I was looking for some information on something else.

 

[bgalizio]

I have Sperzel staggered locking tuners on my Warmoth XII neck and did not need any string retainer or string trees.

 

[Day-mun]

Thanks, guys! I will try without. And if that isn't going to work on this particular instrument, I will start poking around in the offset community to source one. -Much appreciated!