design your own fender

[Ace Flibble]

Is pre-levelling the frets that hard that a human shouldn't touch it?

(Psst... there are three other US parts companies and two UK ones which level and crown the frets and will roll or semi-roll the fretboard edges for no additional cost, or not do any of that work if you don't want them to, but don't let the Warmoth die-hards know :icon_thumright

Warmoth needs better PR and more energy.

I can understand where they're coming from. As a replacement parts company—at least, as long as Fender is watching—it must be hard to build a lot of hype for your products. Ultimately there's no way to progress on your own; you'll always be compared to other brands. People will let a Gibson or an ESP or a Schecter or a Fender stand on its own and take it on its own merits. With Warmoth parts (or any parts build), you're always going to have the "well, this other company don't make a guitar with this feature..." conversation with anybody who asks. You can promote Ibanez without talking about any other companies. You can't really promote Warmoth without at least mentioning Fender.

Warmoth have at least made online ordering much easier and more complete than all the other parts companies (though I find the new design to be less functional). Musikraft's site is functional, but it's lacking in detail and it's literally brown. Brown. USACG haven't updated their site in several years and to place an order with them you have to phone or fax. Fax! Then there's SimS, who are A) stupidly overpriced for what is, like all these other companies, just a to-order CNC service, and B) can't even give you a price quote online. So, in that department, Warmoth are doing a helluva better job than anybody else. Still rather soulless, but it's a step up.

 

[stubhead]

I'm pretty sure Warmoth doesn't need us to tell them what to do, especially if "what to do" consists of acting more like a normal guitar company. I mean, how many places can you go to buy a quite credible, professionally-usable "Telecaster" or some riff on it.. even if you start with Schecter's and Fender's own as the low-end of a pro "Tele" and go up from there, there's probably over fifty people building just about the exact same thing - in fact, over a hundred including people using other's parts. Maybe a thousand?!? While Warmoth does attract a few people who are hoping for a world-class instrument for a sub-$1000 price, I think we do a pretty good job of driving those people away, or at least making the point that it takes good work and accurate knowledge to really drill a "parts guitar."

The "DIY" aspect of life with Warmoth, and the endless agonizing over just the right parts and just the right process is part of the pleasure here, masochistic as that may be. Any bozo with a pile of cash can pay somebody to put together a "dream guitar", but their level of input isn't too far beyond "make it red, 12" radius, Duncans..." And in the end, they only get to open one box.... :evil4: :evil4: :evil4:

The Thrill of the Fretwork! :laughing7:
The Agony of de Wood Fillah.... :hello2:

And you meet such interesting people... the only other forum I can spend any time on is the Steel Guitar Forum. And I believe it's largely because of the inherent filters. I mean, to hang here, with any degree of authority, you've got to be able to put together a good guitar. You can't fake the knowledge, and as anyone here can tell you, a goodly portion of that comes from learning what NOT TO DO... ouch, oops - and onward. And steel guitars are hard to play, really hard to play well, and you can still count the number of actual full-blown geniuses without taking off your shoes (IMO). Here, learn how to do this:
http://www.mediafire.com/listen/bbusiak3s7f7oua/Chaconne+Bach+14string+lap+steel.mp3

Whether you like the piece or the sound or not, there are three or four people in the world who can do that. Surely several thousand ordinary six-string guitarists,  Bach's Sonatas & Partitas for Solo Violin are by now standard reading practice in all the schools. Chris Thile kill's 'em on mandolin, many many thousands of violinists of course. Steel guitar, forget it. 15 years ago, that would've been thought impossible. And you can dial up Mr. Hatcher on the steel forum and ask him about the octave jump in bar 237, and he'll answer. Yikes.

 

[mark1178]

Well, the software is nice.

 

[Day-mun]

I'm pretty sure Warmoth doesn't need us to tell them what to do, especially if "what to do" consists of acting more like a normal guitar company.

Yeah, that... and most of whatever else he said.

 

[jackthehack]

If I set up a reasonable facsimile of a '57 Strat in their builder, costs out at $1849.

Were I to buy a finished neck/body and other parts from Warmoth (Fender Fat 50's PUs from another vendor), total cost would be $987 + a couple hours of my time.

I'll always tend to go the 2nd route...

 

[Ace Flibble]

That's 'cause when you order parts and bolt it together yourself, you're not paying the wages of all the people who would otherwise be putting that guitar together at a factory, levelling and crowning the frets, rolling the fretboard edges, etc.

You really can't price up a company making a guitar and you bolting some parts together as if they're directly comparable, or any kind of revelation. No shit you can do it yourself for less money, you're not paying any workers.

 

[croquet hoop]

If I set up a reasonable facsimile of a '57 Strat in their builder, costs out at $1849.

Were I to buy a finished neck/body and other parts from Warmoth (Fender Fat 50's PUs from another vendor), total cost would be $987 + a couple hours of my time.

I'll always tend to go the 2nd route...

The Warmoth facsimile won't have a Fender logo on the headstock and (more importantly) will have a different forearm contour on the body. If you're making your own partscaster it's fine, but if you're aiming at a fairly faithful reproduction...

(By the way, I'm wondering why the forearm contour on Warmoth bodies is so different that on Fender bodies...)

 

[Ace Flibble]

Warmoth's headstocks are also very slightly different and the body perimeters are different, too. Weird, since they're one of the few companies which actually is licensed by Fender to make parts like this.

 

[bagman67]

Warmoth's headstocks are also very slightly different and the body perimeters are different, too. Weird, since they're one of the few companies which actually is licensed by Fender to make parts like this.

My guess is the license agreement specifies what the measurements need to be for Fender-replacement parts.  Fender itself is far less compliant with its own "standards" than Warmoth or Mighty Mite.

 

[jackthehack]

If I set up a reasonable facsimile of a '57 Strat in their builder, costs out at $1849.

Were I to buy a finished neck/body and other parts from Warmoth (Fender Fat 50's PUs from another vendor), total cost would be $987 + a couple hours of my time.

I'll always tend to go the 2nd route...

The Warmoth facsimile won't have a Fender logo on the headstock and (more importantly) will have a different forearm contour on the body. If you're making your own partscaster it's fine, but if you're aiming at a fairly faithful reproduction...

(By the way, I'm wondering why the forearm contour on Warmoth bodies is so different that on Fender bodies...)

Actually, were I to do the build I'd finish it myself shooting nitro, which would be significantly cheaper and closer to the original, but was trying to do a more apples to apples comparison.

If you ordered this from Fender and needed to resell it, you'd be lucky to get $900-1000...

 

[Strat Avenger]

If I set up a reasonable facsimile of a '57 Strat in their builder, costs out at $1849.

Were I to buy a finished neck/body and other parts from Warmoth (Fender Fat 50's PUs from another vendor), total cost would be $987 + a couple hours of my time.

I'll always tend to go the 2nd route...

The Warmoth facsimile won't have a Fender logo on the headstock and (more importantly) will have a different forearm contour on the body. If you're making your own partscaster it's fine, but if you're aiming at a fairly faithful reproduction...

(By the way, I'm wondering why the forearm contour on Warmoth bodies is so different that on Fender bodies...)

I was not aware of this. I thought the bodies were the exact dimensions of the Fender body.
:dontknow:

 

[mayfly]

I actually don't think that Fender has a standard forearm contour.  The (many - probably 40 or so) strats that I played were all different.  If you look at that old film of the Fender factory tour in the 1950's you'll see a guy sanding the forearm contour using a gigantic sanding belt.  Don't think he was going for accuracy there.

 

[bagman67]

I actually don't think that Fender has a standard forearm contour.  The (many - probably 40 or so) strats that I played were all different.  If you look at that old film of the Fender factory tour in the 1950's you'll see a guy sanding the forearm contour using a gigantic sanding belt.  Don't think he was going for accuracy there.

This right here.


The manual labor involved in making the vintage guitars is responsible for tremendous variation in shape among specimens, and also the tremendous variation in consistency of quality among old units. 


I don't generally care for vintage guitars, in part because what are the odds a schmo like me can get his hands on a real good player?  Between slim and none, and Slim just left town. 


The Fender Road-Worn guitars I have sampled, for all the cynicism I have about the marketing schwanz who came up with them, have been uniformly good-sounding and playing guitars.  Why?  Get Floyd the Giant Belt Sander Operator (or more importantly, your non-union pickup winder and soldering iron manipulator and neck shaper) out of the equation, and you can control quality a lot better.  All hail CNC and other modern manufacturing techniques, from which much goodness flows.

 

[Jumble Jumble]

But but... the mojo! * throws handfuls of money into a fire *

 

[croquet hoop]

Well, there is certainly some variation among series/years of production, but if you take a look at Fender's current product pages, I'm sure you will notice that the forearm contour is quite different (deeper and sleeker) from what Warmoth does (which is closer to the forearm contour we see on many superstrats, for instance). The subject has been discussed here for instance: http://unofficialwarmoth.com/index.php?topic=9570.0

From a functional point of view, I prefer the contour on Warmoth bodies, though.

 

[Cederick]

I wasn't expecting a lot of options, but not even having a hardtail version of the strat is laughable

 

[bagman67]

Meet the new boss, same as the old boss:

 

[stubhead]

Fender has had at least four different "standard" Strat shapes. I believe they're usually categorized as the -
50's
early, pre-CBS 60's
Late 60's
70's

However, with all the "re-issues" Fender themselves has done*, the hand labor that was quite prevalent until Fender died the first time in the mid-80's and they covered it with Japanese Strats, made to who-know what specs (metric ones, too... foreign specs!)

*(Many time blurb'd as "exact vintage specs! eee eee eee... but, which vintage specs? :icon_scratch: ??? :icon_scratch: )

Get about halfway down here for Strats:

http://www.gitarrebassbau.de/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=6&start=0

Far greater minds than mine have felt the cold, icy Fingers of Reality creeping up their spinal cord... closer... closer...

Michael DeTemple is happy to tell you that his re-interpreted shape for his Strat copy guitar sounds better... for 6 grand I hope so!  :cool01:

 

[musicispeace]

I just got my first Warmoth build project back from the tech who assembled and set up for me (including fret leveling) and I chose very carefully to find a good professional to do the work. It is, by far, head and shoulders above anything I have pulled off the rack at a guitar retailer in the same price category of my total investment and it is tailored to exactly what I wanted and is comprised of better components that I researched and selected personally. That I can do that has tremendous value to me as a consumer and a tangible constructive impact on my music. The only complaint I have about Warmoth is that I think you should be able to order any of their finish options on any guitar body or neck builder order you place, but if that is my only gripe that isn't so bad. Warmoth has evolved a niche for itself that is practical, of tangible value to customers, and allows Warmoth to do their thing in the legal landscape. None of this existed when many of us began playing guitar. I'm going to start a second project this fall and look very forward to it.

 

[Cagey]

The only complaint I have about Warmoth is that I think you should be able to order any of their finish options on any guitar body or neck builder order you place, but if that is my only gripe that isn't so bad.

The website doesn't offer all Warmoth's capabilities, at least not always in an obvious way. But, you might want to know that you can get any finish you want on anything they make. It's just that in some cases, you have to call them rather than order off the website. Also, they don't have receptionists or computers answering the phone - the calls are all picked up directly by the sales staff, who are very knowledgeable and professional about their business and capabilities. You won't spend a lot of time making small talk or waiting for answers. So, if you're overseas or something, it's not going to be an expensive call.

Plus, there's always email. They do respond to that.