Can anyone recommend a good person or shop to do my wiring?

[fu22ba55]

I'd love to ship my body and PUs in a box to someone like stewmac.com or bestbassgear.com and have them do my wiring, but I don't know that they provide that service, or I imagine they'd be crazy expensive.

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I need to wire two jazz bass 5-wire humbuckers (EMG-HZs) in the following config, so it's a little tricky:

--Three knobs so it looks "vintage"
--Each volume knob is a push-pull for one singe coil sound in each position.
--Push-pull on TONE knob for series / parallel (whole guitar), so the two single coils wired in series would mimic a P-bass sound.

All kinds of questions come up like... if I'm using 500k pots, what happens when I split the coil? Isn't it better to use 250k pots for singe coils? (Does anyone manufacture a 500 / 250k push-pull pot?)

I wouldn't be doing much switching live, it would be mostly for recording, so I'd rather keep the vintage look and not put switches everywhere.

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Can anyone recommend a shop that does decent, reliable work, that's not going to charge an arm and a leg? Someplace like Stewmac would be great since I could just send the body and PUs, and they could supply all the wire, pots, etc...

It would be great if they're easy to work with and have a sense of humor. I have another (warmoth) bass with no knobs whatsoever (just an output jack) and I could use some secret under the pickgaurd wiring there as well.

Location isn't really important... I could ship anywhere, I'd have to ship to Stewmac and I'm only 2.5 hours away. (I'm in Cincinnati OH).

Thanks.

 

[line6man]

I really think you could do this yourself if you learned to solder and bought yourself the necessary tools to do so.
I can draw you a schematic if you are having trouble with it.
I usually help out on TalkBass with wiring needs, though i rarely help out on this forum.
(http://www.flickr.com/photos/jrkdesimone/sets/72157616015420655/)

I am not aware of anyone who will let you send them your gear to wire it up for you.
Usually people would order pre-wired pickguards/control plates and install them on their own.
Your best bet is a local luthier who does wiring work.
Hell, if your willing to pay the shipping, send it to me and i will do it for you.

 

[line6man]

As far as the 500K versus 250K thing, this thread may help you:
http://www.talkbass.com/forum/showthread.php?t=494664

There is no right or wrong choice, it's up to you whether you want a brighter or darker sound from your pots.

It is common practice that humbuckers be used with 500K pots because they are darker pickups, and it helps to have brighter pots.
Single coils are used with 250K pots to tame some of the extra brightness.

 

[fu22ba55]

Thanks line6. That flickr set is awesome.

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Part of the problem is getting advice, or troubleshooting the wiring ideas. Maybe there's a better way to acheive the same effect wth less controls, etc... or a "have you tried this" suggestion. I guess the forum helps out in that regard.

And my soldering skills are awful. I'm 38 and I've soldered enough to know that I don't want to do my own guitar. I don't have the patience to solder anymore.

That's kind of what I'm looking for... a good local wiring guy (or gal), but location doesn't matter. I'm shipping no matter what unless someone knows a guy in Cincinnati.

---

And regarding the 250 vs 500k thing... I _think_ I understand the difference between 250 and 500k, I'm curious what happens when you split a HB with a 500K pot. You're basically using a single coil through a 500k pot. Does a push pull pot exist where one position is a 500k pot, and the other position is 250k? (assuming I prefer running the single coil through a 250k)

These are the kinds of things I'd need to troubleshoot with a good wiring guy.

---

 

[line6man]

Running a single coil with a 500K will just make it brighter. There will be no ill affects to the pickup or anything of the sort.
I personally am in favor of extremely bright controls, as you can always roll them off if they are too bright, unless you do weird volume swell stuff.

On a 500K audio taper pot, 8/10 is the equivalent of a 250K on 10.

As far as i am aware, there is no such thing as a pot that changes from 250K to 500K.

The closest solution i would have is to use a 250K/500K stacked pot, and a DPDT switch to toggle the input and output (it has to be both the input and the output, otherwise you are loading the circuit) from the 250K to the 500K pot. This would require you to have a 6PDT toggle switch (2 poles for each control) plus three additional DPDT toggles to make up for the push pulls.

 

[disaster]

I'm sure they're are shops who will do it, but it won't be cheap.  I'm willing to accept your guitar and parts & wire them as you instruct if you like.  I've been working in this area for years & my work is quite good.  By day I work in the electronics industry manufacturing very overpriced hi-tech embedded processing equipment.  But I'm not cheap either.

Since one of your concerns is wiring options & impacts of choices on tone you would be well advised to find a local "tech".  I recommend that you visit a local guitar shop that deals in high end products (PRS Select, Suhr Guitars, Martin, etc - sorry I don't know elite bass manufacturers) and ask if they can recommend a "guitar technician" for your particular upgrade.  A good shop will have several techs they work with regularly.  Let them know you want someone who will work with you to assure the right tone.  This will probably require some experimentation.  A good tech will also make suggestions.  Again it won't be cheap.  But it will help you achive the tone & setup you want.

Here is where the value becomes more important than the expense.  Someone once said that quality is remembered long after the price is forgotten.

Good Luck

 

[line6man]

I'm sure they're are shops who will do it, but it won't be cheap.  I'm willing to accept your guitar and parts & wire them as you instruct if you like.  I've been working in this area for years & my work is quite good.  By day I work in the electronics industry manufacturing very overpriced hi-tech embedded processing equipment.  But I'm not cheap either.

Since one of your concerns is wiring options & impacts of choices on tone you would be well advised to find a local "tech".  I recommend that you visit a local guitar shop that deals in high end products (PRS Select, Suhr Guitars, Martin, etc - sorry I don't know elite bass manufacturers) and ask if they can recommend a "guitar technician" for your particular upgrade.  A good shop will have several techs they work with regularly.  Let them know you want someone who will work with you to assure the right tone.  This will probably require some experimentation.  A good tech will also make suggestions.  Again it won't be cheap.  But it will help you achive the tone & setup you want.

Here is where the value becomes more important than the expense.  Someone once said that quality is remembered long after the price is forgotten.

Good Luck

+1

 

[fu22ba55]

Thanks for the info guys. I'll poke around Mike's Music (mikesmusicohio.com) and see if they have a local tech they can recommend.

And I plugged in and AB-ed all my basses last night... I think I'm going to ditch the coil tap (split) option, and just wire this one as a standard Jazz Bass. I can probably do that.

---

Line6,

I just realized your avatar is the same J-Bass in the Warmoth Gallery. I lauged out loud when I saw that setup. Two knobs (with one conspicuously missing), and just the treble PU.

Brilliant.

I played my '72 Jazz that way for YEARS, just with the treble PU turned up.

Good gag and a nice look.

I should post pics of my Franken-bass. 1 pickup wired straight to the output jack. No knobs, no switches. (no options). Plug in and go.

 

[line6man]

I think I'm going to ditch the coil tap (split) option, and just wire this one as a standard Jazz Bass. I can probably do that.

Why? If the switches are on push/pulls, the option is very unobtrusive, and even if you don't quite like the sound, the option is there if you want it.
Like i said, i can draw you a full diagram if you need it. It isnt really that much work for the series/split switches.

 

[fu22ba55]

OK. How about this configuraion... less knobs.

--Two EMG-HZs in traditional Jazz Bass placement
--Blend knob to mix neck and bridge, pull for series (whole guitar)
--Tone Knob, pull to split both PUs.

If I'm correct, that should give me the following options, with just two knobs, no switches:

neck PU as single coil or HB
bridge PU as single coil or HB
Default parallel config for traditional Jazz Bass sound (with blend knob)
Series config (for more of a faux P-bass sound) with blend knob

I guess there are two weird things with this setup

1) In Series config: I hear it's possible to choose "opposite" coils in the two pickups for the tap, so when running single coils in series, it acts sort of like a whole body humbucker? (P-Bass sound from a J?)

2) No volume control. That's fine with me. My last bass had no knobs whatsoever. Does running PUs without a volume pot affect the sound, or is it the same as running with volume pots wide open? (It's my understanding that even wide open, a volume pot offers some resistance to the PU). Or does the blend pot provide the necessary resitance?

Thanks.

 

[line6man]

OK. How about this configuraion... less knobs.

--Two EMG-HZs in traditional Jazz Bass placement
--Blend knob to mix neck and bridge, pull for series (whole guitar)
--Tone Knob, pull to split both PUs.

If I'm correct, that should give me the following options, with just two knobs, no switches:

neck PU as single coil or HB
bridge PU as single coil or HB
Default parallel config for traditional Jazz Bass sound (with blend knob)
Series config (for more of a faux P-bass sound) with blend knob

I guess there are two weird things with this setup

1) In Series config: I hear it's possible to choose "opposite" coils in the two pickups for the tap, so when running single coils in series, it acts sort of like a whole body humbucker? (P-Bass sound from a J?)

2) No volume control. That's fine with me. My last bass had no knobs whatsoever. Does running PUs without a volume pot affect the sound, or is it the same as running with volume pots wide open? (It's my understanding that even wide open, a volume pot offers some resistance to the PU). Or does the blend pot provide the necessary resitance?

Thanks.

That's do able, but there is one potential issue.
If you have a blend pot, you need to have it set fully to the neck pickup side or in the center when you are in series mode in order for things to work properly.
If you use a 3PDT switch, there is a way you can easily bypass the blend pot when you go into series mode. The problem is that require you to use a mini toggle switch, because a push/pull pot is only DPDT.
Having only a blend and a tone does free up a hole for a switch though.

You can setup either coil to be active in single coil mode. That is easy.

These are regular humbuckers correct? If they are standard Jazz style pickups, you may run into issues with splitting the coils.
In a "stacked" design where the 2 coils are on top of each other, you can only use the top coil unless you want a really weak output.
If it is a linear humbucking design (i.e. a P bass pickup in a Jazz housing) you can only do series/parallel switching otherwise only 2 strings will have output.

The lack of a volume control is very different from a volume turned all the way up.
I explained it here: http://www.talkbass.com/forum/showthread.php?t=494664

If you want to retain the tone of the volume pot "on 10" without an actual volume pot, you can put a fixed resistor in the circuit of whatever value you choose.
If you have an electronics store nearby, you could probably get the resistor for like 25 cents.

As far as the blend pot providing your resistance, a blend pot is the equivalent of 2 pots, so *in theory* it should be the same sound as with having 2 volumes.

 

[fu22ba55]

line6man,

Your help and insight is invaluable. You're saving me a lot of time and trouble.

1) If I went back to the original setup (three knobs, vol, vol, tone, pull each vol for single coil, pull tone for series) would I still have an "issue" with running in series?

2) Is the series option even that big a deal? Will it give me a sound different enough to matter? Because if not, then I could stick to just a blend knob and a tone knob (pull for coil tap).

3) The pickups have two parallel bars or blades beneath the plastic cover, so they should behave normally during a coil split.

http://www.emginc.com/products/category/31

I only chose these pickups since warmoth only has a few pre-routing options for pickups. In the past, I've ordered the body, routed it locally, then sent it back to be finished or had it finished locally.

So I only chose the 35s since warmoth has a template cut for them and I could have them do the finishing.

4) My other bass has no volume control, and I went nuts trying to find the right value resistor. What value resistor would you recommend for two jazz bass humbuckers in parallel?

Thanks line6man.

I probably will wind up sending you my bass to wire. You are an super genius.

 

[line6man]

line6man,

Your help and insight is invaluable. You're saving me a lot of time and trouble.

1) If I went back to the original setup (three knobs, vol, vol, tone, pull each vol for single coil, pull tone for series) would I still have an "issue" with running in series?

2) Is the series option even that big a deal? Will it give me a sound different enough to matter? Because if not, then I could stick to just a blend knob and a tone knob (pull for coil tap).

3) The pickups have two parallel bars or blades beneath the plastic cover, so they should behave normally during a coil split.

http://www.emginc.com/products/category/31

I only chose these pickups since warmoth only has a few pre-routing options for pickups. In the past, I've ordered the body, routed it locally, then sent it back to be finished or had it finished locally.

So I only chose the 35s since warmoth has a template cut for them and I could have them do the finishing.

4) My other bass has no volume control, and I went nuts trying to find the right value resistor. What value resistor would you recommend for two jazz bass humbuckers in parallel?

Thanks line6man.

I probably will wind up sending you my bass to wire. You are an super genius.

Thanks for the kind words!

1. It's only an issue with blend pots. 2 volumes will work just fine.
A blend pot works by cross-fading 2 sources to one output. When one goes up, the other goes down and vice versa. When you wire the pickups in series, they become one big pickup that feeds the same output as the neck pickup,so with a blend pot you would only get a signal on one side, so you would be attenuating the volume unless you kept the blend pot fully to the neck side. With 2 volumes, the neck pickups volume becomes the master volume, while the bridge pickups volume has no effect.

2. I can't really say how useful it is going to be. Some people love it, some hate it. It is all about your tonal preferences.

3. Ok, the 35HZ's should be fine for coil splitting.

4. If you want to replace a volume pot with a fixed resistor, the resistance should be the same value as the pot.

For example, here is how you would wire a P bass if you wanted no pots, but still wanted their tonal effect.

 

[fu22ba55]

4. If you want to replace a volume pot with a fixed resistor, the resistance should be the same value as the pot.

For example, here is how you would wire a P bass if you wanted no pots, but still wanted their tonal effect.

This is very interesting. So correct me if I'm wrong:

1) When a 250K volume pot is turned all the way up, it's still providing the full 250K of resistance?

2) Does your P-bass schematic mimic the sound of the tone pot all the way up (bright) or rolled all the way off?

 

[line6man]

4. If you want to replace a volume pot with a fixed resistor, the resistance should be the same value as the pot.

For example, here is how you would wire a P bass if you wanted no pots, but still wanted their tonal effect.

This is very interesting. So correct me if I'm wrong:

1) When a 250K volume pot is turned all the way up, it's still providing the full 250K of resistance?

2) Does your P-bass schematic mimic the sound of the tone pot all the way up (bright) or rolled all the way off?

1. Yes. When you turn the knob all the way up, there is 0 ohms resistance from the pickup to wherever it is going, but the full value of the pot is being applied from the signal to ground. This is why 500K pots are brighter than 250K's, because a greater load means that less of the signal passes thru.

2. The diagram simulates the tone pot on full.
FWIW, a tone pot rolled all the way off is the equivalent of placing a capacitor directly across from the signal to ground.

 

[fu22ba55]

1. Yes. When you turn the knob all the way up, there is 0 ohms resistance from the pickup to wherever it is going, but the full value of the pot is being applied from the signal to ground. This is why 500K pots are brighter than 250K's, because a greater load means that less of the signal passes thru.

2. The diagram simulates the tone pot on full.
FWIW, a tone pot rolled all the way off is the equivalent of placing a capacitor directly across from the signal to ground.

Line6man, you are awesome.

I remember trying to do this "no knobs" simulation before, and could never get it to work right.

What wattage would the 500K resistors have to be if I wanted to use them instead of pots? I remember trying to do it before, and the only resistors I could get from the "local electronics shop" were 250K at 2 watts, or 470K at 2 watts. They were HUGE (size of a vitamin) and cut the signal out almost completely.

What wattage are pots?

 

[line6man]

1. Yes. When you turn the knob all the way up, there is 0 ohms resistance from the pickup to wherever it is going, but the full value of the pot is being applied from the signal to ground. This is why 500K pots are brighter than 250K's, because a greater load means that less of the signal passes thru.

2. The diagram simulates the tone pot on full.
FWIW, a tone pot rolled all the way off is the equivalent of placing a capacitor directly across from the signal to ground.

Line6man, you are awesome.

I remember trying to do this "no knobs" simulation before, and could never get it to work right.

What wattage would the 500K resistors have to be if I wanted to use them instead of pots? I remember trying to do it before, and the only resistors I could get from the "local electronics shop" were 250K at 2 watts, or 470K at 2 watts. They were HUGE (size of a vitamin) and cut the signal out almost completely.

What wattage are pots?

To be honest with you, i really have no idea what wattage standard guitar pots are, but i am certain that 1/4 watt resistors will be plenty.
Your pickups are putting out a very low voltage and a very small current. A quarter watt of power would mean one volt at a quarter amp... Nothing like that exists in guitars and basses.

 

[line6man]

the only resistors I could get from the "local electronics shop" were 250K at 2 watts, or 470K at 2 watts. They were HUGE (size of a vitamin)

These babies?

 

[fu22ba55]

MMMmmmmmm. Vitamins.

 

[line6man]

But what you really need is a 100W ceramic tube resistor. You may need to do a little extra routing though :blob7: :toothy12: