Burzum

[hannaugh]

I'm not a fan of Burzum or his music but the church (christians, islamists, hindu and various other religious groups) are responsible for millions of deaths (burning, hanging, decapitation etc). I'm not sorry at all for the churches.

I might also point out here that you are saying you don't like it when religious people burn and pillage, but if someone is burning down something religous, that's okay.  That kind of doesn't make sense.  It's still a violent act done out of hate, so why would it be okay based on what the perpetrator believes?

We probably shouldn't neglect to mention here that although there has been a lot of violence in the name of religion, religious organizations are also behind an enormous amount of charity over the centuries.  There is a reason people always used to leave unwanted children on the steps of a church, because for a very long time the church was just about the only place that would take care of orphans.  Still to this day, religious organizations raise massive amounts of money to help starving people and all kinds of other stuff.  Religion is like any weapon.  In the hands of someone responsible, it can be used for good, but in the hands of the wrong person it can be used for evil. 

 

[Kostas]

I always have a healthy laugh at people who try to act like the evils that human beings do to one another is somehow only tied to religion....

You may laugh but you can't rewrite history. Religious people have killed millions because they thought they had the right to do in the name of god. Crime is not only tied to religion, but there is a part of it tied to religion.

If we are going to start bitching about religon (against forum rules btw)
Stalin killed 30 million people, he was an atheist. Crusaders weren't true christians, suicide bombers are defintely not true muslims, and hinduism is a religon based on peace soooo...

I never said atheists are good and they do not kill. They can kill like any other person, they can be murderers like Stalin or Hitler. Crusaders were christians and suicide bombers are definitely muslims. Just because they are murderers it doesn't mean they don't believe in god. Check the history of India to see how many people have died in the name of hinduism.

I might also point out here that you are saying you don't like it when religious people burn and pillage, but if someone is burning down something religous, that's okay.  That kind of doesn't make sense.  It's still a violent act done out of hate, so why would it be okay based on what the perpetrator believes?
Yes that's what I say. I don't like it but in every war/riot there are victims.

We probably shouldn't neglect to mention here that although there has been a lot of violence in the name of religion, religious organizations are also behind an enormous amount of charity over the centuries.  There is a reason people always used to leave unwanted children on the steps of a church, because for a very long time the church was just about the only place that would take care of orphans.  Still to this day, religious organizations raise massive amounts of money to help starving people and all kinds of other stuff.  Religion is like any weapon.  In the hands of someone responsible, it can be used for good, but in the hands of the wrong person it can be used for evil.  

You are right, church has done and still does charity. But they have way too much money and power, they could end hunger if they wanted. They don't want that. They don't want free thinking people, they want servants. Look at the pope and his crew, instead of living a humble life they live like kings. Let's not forget also how many kids have been beaten, raped and died from monks and priests. Those who openly condemn homosexuality still rape young boys in 2010.

We obviously disagree when it comes to religion. Better talk about metal, I like it way more... :headbang1:

 

[Mor Paul]

:icon_thumright:My church has never killed people.

And I'm not one who would agree with this guy's actions, or you opinion, Kostas. I'll just keep it at that.  :icon_thumright:

 

[AprioriMark]

Again, I laugh at pretending that this is not simply and absolutely human nature.

-Mark

 

[big bob]

I always have a healthy laugh at people who try to act like the evils that human beings do to one another is somehow only tied to religion....

You may laugh but you can't rewrite history. Religious people have killed millions because they thought they had the right to do in the name of god. Crime is not only tied to religion, but there is a part of it tied to religion.

If we are going to start bitching about religon (against forum rules btw)
Stalin killed 30 million people, he was an atheist. Crusaders weren't true christians, suicide bombers are defintely not true muslims, and hinduism is a religon based on peace soooo...

I never said atheists are good and they do not kill. They can kill like any other person, they can be murderers like Stalin or Hitler. Crusaders were christians and suicide bombers are definitely muslims. Just because they are murderers it doesn't mean they don't believe in god. Check the history of India to see how many people have died in the name of hinduism.

I might also point out here that you are saying you don't like it when religious people burn and pillage, but if someone is burning down something religous, that's okay.  That kind of doesn't make sense.  It's still a violent act done out of hate, so why would it be okay based on what the perpetrator believes?
Yes that's what I say. I don't like it but in every war/riot there are victims.

We probably shouldn't neglect to mention here that although there has been a lot of violence in the name of religion, religious organizations are also behind an enormous amount of charity over the centuries.  There is a reason people always used to leave unwanted children on the steps of a church, because for a very long time the church was just about the only place that would take care of orphans.  Still to this day, religious organizations raise massive amounts of money to help starving people and all kinds of other stuff.  Religion is like any weapon.  In the hands of someone responsible, it can be used for good, but in the hands of the wrong person it can be used for evil.  

You are right, church has done and still does charity. But they have way too much money and power, they could end hunger if they wanted. They don't want that. They don't want free thinking people, they want servants. Look at the pope and his crew, instead of living a humble life they live like kings. Let's not forget also how many kids have been beaten, raped and died from monks and priests. Those who openly condemn homosexuality still rape young boys in 2010.

We obviously disagree when it comes to religion. Better talk about metal, I like it way more... :headbang1:

please remember that rape is not a sexual act. It is an act of domination and power. Thus the priests are simply dominating the children, not engaging in a homosexual act with them!  ???

 

[GratefullyRedd]

I always have a healthy laugh at people who try to act like the evils that human beings do to one another is somehow only tied to religion....

You may laugh but you can't rewrite history. Religious people have killed millions because they thought they had the right to do in the name of god. Crime is not only tied to religion, but there is a part of it tied to religion.

If we are going to start bitching about religon (against forum rules btw)
Stalin killed 30 million people, he was an atheist. Crusaders weren't true christians, suicide bombers are defintely not true muslims, and hinduism is a religon based on peace soooo...

I never said atheists are good and they do not kill. They can kill like any other person, they can be murderers like Stalin or Hitler. Crusaders were christians and suicide bombers are definitely muslims. Just because they are murderers it doesn't mean they don't believe in god. Check the history of India to see how many people have died in the name of hinduism.

I might also point out here that you are saying you don't like it when religious people burn and pillage, but if someone is burning down something religous, that's okay.  That kind of doesn't make sense.  It's still a violent act done out of hate, so why would it be okay based on what the perpetrator believes?
Yes that's what I say. I don't like it but in every war/riot there are victims.

We probably shouldn't neglect to mention here that although there has been a lot of violence in the name of religion, religious organizations are also behind an enormous amount of charity over the centuries.  There is a reason people always used to leave unwanted children on the steps of a church, because for a very long time the church was just about the only place that would take care of orphans.  Still to this day, religious organizations raise massive amounts of money to help starving people and all kinds of other stuff.  Religion is like any weapon.  In the hands of someone responsible, it can be used for good, but in the hands of the wrong person it can be used for evil.  

You are right, church has done and still does charity. But they have way too much money and power, they could end hunger if they wanted. They don't want that. They don't want free thinking people, they want servants. Look at the pope and his crew, instead of living a humble life they live like kings. Let's not forget also how many kids have been beaten, raped and died from monks and priests. Those who openly condemn homosexuality still rape young boys in 2010.

We obviously disagree when it comes to religion. Better talk about metal, I like it way more... :headbang1:

Where does it say in any religous writings to kill anybody?

 

[Kublai]

Religion is fine until it is intermingled with politics.

 

[zogoibi]

[/quote]

No, there are probably exceptions to the rule. But when they become powerful, they become evil. It's what people usually do. They want more power and more money. This only brings deaths. Look at the crusades and the holy wars. The burning of the witches, the burning of books. The censorship of free speech, music and books. Their rage against sexuality. The list goes on and on. They want to rule our lives and they want our money.
[/quote]


Panagia voytha  :laughing7: 

 

[MUYFUE]

BURZUM rules, He ate that guys brain! He sucks at guitar and pretty much everything else, but he HAS done pretty well for a guy recording in prison...not as a vistior playing a special concert, but as an inmate.

I for one, have a HUGE problem with aggro music in general...it creates so many lies. The worst of which is that these 'tough guys' scream and holler about all this evil mess, but when push comes to punch, they are usually a pack of skinny weaklings. "Metal" makes me like "Hardcore" more and more every day...

I say, Walk the Walk.

To quote Anthrax:
Take your packaged rebellion
Move on,
Revolution on your sleeve
If you say, mean it
If you mean it, do it
You can't live your
life through me
Gone,
Take your packaged Rebellion
With the air you breathe

 

[hannaugh]

I am not a big fan of organized religions, but that doesn't mean that I think all religious people (now or in the past) are evil..

No, there are probably exceptions to the rule. But when they become powerful, they become evil. It's what people usually do. They want more power and more money. This only brings deaths. Look at the crusades and the holy wars. The burning of the witches, the burning of books. The censorship of free speech, music and books. Their rage against sexuality. The list goes on and on. They want to rule our lives and they want our money.

Honestly, I think the government is doing a much better job at almost all of this stuff you mentioned than religious organizations. 

 

[Kostas]

Honestly, I think the government is doing a much better job at almost all of this stuff you mentioned than religious organizations. 

I don't know any government with no corrupted members. This means religious organizations are innocent and they are not doing what I mentioned for 2000 years?

 

[zogoibi]

psemata--Kosta, that really didn't make any sense; what with the double negative and all.  Try again please :laughing11:

 

[hannaugh]

Honestly, I think the government is doing a much better job at almost all of this stuff you mentioned than religious organizations. 

I don't know any government with no corrupted members. This means religious organizations are innocent and they are not doing what I mentioned for 2000 years?

No, but I don't see you saying we should burn down government buildings.  All I'm trying to point out is that it's not a good idea to condone arson just because you don't like who it was done to. 

 

[Lucky #7]

Kostas,

Wrong is wrong.  An "ends justifies the means" stance is an extremely dangerous one.  I also agree with Apriori Mark in that religion is quite simply a cover for what people would do anyway.  Groups are singled out and exterminated based on religion.  They are also exterminated based on family, geographic location, race, sex, age, and everything else in the book.  To say that religion is anything other than an excuse for evil men to do what they would do anyway is absurd.  Believe me, I share your disillusionment with organized religion.  I consider myself Christian, but don't attend services in large part because it seems ridiculous to get in a giant group to be told how God wants us to live and then watch the majority not follow what they say; paritioners and preachers alike.

Long story short, there will always be bad people and they will always find some reason why their evil is justified and commanded by someone else.

P.S. What the hell happened to my thread?  I started it about a nut job murderer that Guitar World decided to give a pedestal and now we have a verbal Holy War.

 

[AprioriMark]

[youtube=425,350]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ANhMhaupfgI[/youtube]

<3 Matthew Sweet

-Mark

 

[Kostas]

P.S. What the hell happened to my thread?  I started it about a nut job murderer that Guitar World decided to give a pedestal and now we have a verbal Holy War.

Sorry, my mistake. Religion is a big subject to solve it in a guitar forum. No more from me.

 

[Dan025]

i avoided this thread cuz the first few post were uninteresting, now im glad i avoided it cuz id just be angry had i got involvolved. sin is human nature, anyone familiar with the gospel knows that it cant be totally avoided, it is a physical act as well as in the heart.

sin weather it be murder or hypocracy or lust or whatever is a part of being human but what is important is the hate of sin. anyone who takes retribution or wishes harm on another for there sins is guilty of pride. pride in believing they can decide the fate of others. unforunately without some pride little will ever get changed. pridefull people have ambition, it's one of those nessesary evils. i'm guilty. guilty of that and other sins. defending and justifying sin gains nothing hating sin(our own sins mostly) helps us to make self change and sin less.

i agree with hannaugh and the south park example, i like that show, a great mix of social satire and low brow humour. people will always find flaw in other group and pridefully think that they themselves are not flawed. weather it be people that burn churches, people that condone church burning as they believe it was deserved or churches that anger people to the point that they want to burn down churches.

a little off topic but i once knew a guy who was brought up as an "athiest," in class we were learning about religion and people were sharing there own practices. he said im an athies and "we prey to the devil cuz he doesn't exist" one year his sister dressed as the devil for holloween and my friend asked her why she chose that costume and her reply "i worship the devil because he doesn't exist" these poor kids parents hated religions so much they made a daily mochery of it preying to the devil and wishing harm and disater on the world in there prayers just to demonstrate how silly prayer was. they made an actual practicing religion out of hating religion which in and of it's self is a total hypocracy. taking time out of each and every day to teach there kids pride and supiriority over us stupid church goers as if they had everything figured out. all as if it were somehow logical to take offense to the point of hatred and mochery to the trust and faith of others that there is something more out there that can affect our lives.