Advice on 25/64 tuner holes and planet wave tuners.

[Rick]

I recently bought a beautiful warmoth wenge neck from the showcase to replace one on a Fender Chris Shiflett Tele Deluxe.  I ordered it with 25/64 tuner holes since Fender told me that this was the size of the holes and I had planned to use the old F-Style 70's replica tuners that came with the guitar.  Well ... the tuners fit the holes but the holes on the warmoth neck are ever so slightly closer together than the fender MIM neck, as such the tuners bump up against each other and the tuning pegs won't line up right.  :dontknow:

I've used planet wave tuners on two other warmoth necks (of course, when I bought them, I had them reamed out for the 13/32 size.) and I like them.

I was wondering if anyone here had advice on whether it made sense to gently sand the holes to make them a little larger to accomodate the planet wave tuners, or am I stuck in the 25/64 tuner world.  And if I'm stuck there does anyone have any recommendations.

Thanks in advance.

 

[Cagey]

Opening the holes up won't change the center-to-center spacing, so you're probably going to have to pass on your existing tuner set. If you want a set that will fit those holes, Sperzels will work. They're very nice parts, too - no compromise.

 

[Rick]

Indeed, the existing tuners won't work,  but I was wondering if reaming out the holes ever so slightly (it's 1/64 of inch) to fit the planet wave tuners makes sense.  Or should I just forget and go with something like the sperzels, or maybe a kluson?

In terms of reaming, I was thinking of wrapping sand paper around a pencil and having a go at it.  The spacing between the holes shouldn't change.  I was wondering if anyone had any experience with this.

Thanks,
Rick

 

[Cagey]

You can get away with that, but it's a lotta work. It's tough to get the hole to stay round without a proper reamer, so you have to fight for a while to get the things to fit. The only way I'd go that route is if I already had the replacement tuners and didn't have a choice. Otherwise, I'd buy the Sperzels.

 

[Rick]

If you got the Sperzels, which one would you get?
These?
http://www.stewmac.com/Hardware_and_Parts/Tuning_Machines/Guitar_and_Solid_Peghead/Sperzel_Trim-Lok_6-In-Line_Guitar_Machines.html

or these:

http://www.guitarcenter.com/Sperzel-6-In-Line-Non-Graduated-Tuners-361010-i1129886.gc?country=us&currency=usd&source=4WWRWXGP&gclid=COX_tPbUvsICFUQV7AodyB8A7A&kwid=productads-plaid^87668837322-sku^361010.375@ADL4GC-adType^PLA-device^c-adid^44639487282

or maybe go with hipshots (they say they are 10mm):

http://store.hipshotproducts.com/cart.php?m=product_detail&p=392

or klusons

Or something else.  I'm not really thrilled with the Sperzels, but if they are the only game in town, then that's it.

Thanks

I'll tell you my heart sunk when I found out fender did a non-fender-standard string spacing. :tard:

 

[Rick]

I know I'm replying to myself, but I called Hipshot (who are in upstate New York State, and who make their products here, and who are only  200 miles from me) and asked them about this:

http://store.hipshotproducts.com/cart.php?m=product_detail&p=392

they said no problem with the 25/64 sperzel tuner holes, the hipshot will fit perfectly, and if warmoth uses a standard fender post spacing (as opposed to fender  :tard the backing plate should work, therefore no holes in my neck!

I haven't pulled the trigger yet, but if you guys have any other suggetions let me know.  I agree it doesn't make sense to do extra reaming.

Thank you

 

[Cagey]

If you did decide on the Sperzels, you definitely don't want to buy them from StewMac. They're insanely overpriced. But, the Trim-Loks are the ones to have. Lotsa vendors sell them - look around. They work well, and are pretty much the standard by which all others are judged.

I have no experience with the Hipshot tuners, but their products in general are very high quality, so I wouldn't worry about them. I'm sure they'd work out well. Probably better than the Planet Waves units. The PW parts usually work, but I'm afraid I have little faith in their long-term viability. I've had them misbehave even when new, and the whole concept, while attractive, makes little sense. Buy a set of dykes and cut your string leavings with those.

You could install Schaller Mini-Lockers (my preference), but if you have issues with anti-rotation holes already being drilled you'll have to resolve that somehow.

 

[Rick]

I noticed those stew Mac prices!
Sorry to hear you had bad luck with the PW's.  I've had the most excellent luck with them (I've used them on four guitars, two of them warmoth builds) and the one time one of them failed PW replaced it no questions asked.  They are a New York company, that's always treated me well.  Not that I ever would, but it's nice to know that I could get in a car and visit them.  (I wish warmoth was closer, but what can you do? you guys in the Northwest are lucky!)  I suppose if I lived in Florida I'd be buying Klusons.

Anyway ... I'm leaning towards those Hipshots ... they are almost local, the the tuning ratio is 18:1 vs 12:1 for the Sperzels and ... no holes!  Whether they work or not, I'll post a review here.    Keeping my fingers crossed.

 

[stratamania]

Hipshots are very good tuners. I think you will like them.

Here is a set I used using the UMP http://unofficialwarmoth.com/index.php?topic=23725.msg347877#msg347877

 

[Rick]

The guitar looks great.  I'm definitely going with the hipshots now.

 

[stratamania]

Thanks. I order the Schaller holes usually for the Hipshots. But the hole size you have should work out OK.

I've used them now on two guitars, except the first i didn't use the UMP plate.

Get the staggered set in three different post heights also if you prefer not to use string trees.

 

[Alfang]

I haven't pulled the trigger yet, but if you guys have any other suggetions let me know.  I agree it doesn't make sense to do extra reaming.

So pull the trigger. If they don't work, build a new guitar around them, many of us here have done just that.

 

[Rick]

LOL build a guitar around them!

I pulled the trigger last night
http://store.hipshotproducts.com/cart.php?m=product_detail&p=392

Got them for cheaper off ebay ... got black grip lock open back 6 inline staggered with UMP!  (Sounds military!) Should look good on a wenge / wenge neck, black tusq nut.  Definitely sexier than the stock 70's F vintage tuners (though there was nothing wrong with them, they just didn't fit).

They should arrive by next friday.

Thanks for the encouragement.
Rick

 

[stubhead]

I was thinking of wrapping sand paper around a pencil and having a go at it.  The spacing between the holes shouldn't change.  I was wondering if anyone had any experience with this.

This is almost like S.O.Peeing, I figure. As is using a few layers of varnish or superglue or... stuff, to make holes a little bit smaller. Bass necks, especially... or is it the bass tuners? :dontknow: Somebody's got muffin crumbs for brains there, the big doofus "elephant ears" ones don't fit more often than they do fit! And I like them better... a bit of sanding or reshaping is part of the deal. Metal files work quite well on very hard woods too, just brush them when singing their lullaby for each evening's toil, rust on files is largely cause by sawdust and other leavings that attract the moisture.

And the way to keep holes very very round is to NOT make them elliptical, oval, or.... SOMETHING EVEN WORSE!!!

I mean, the thing that's supposed to go IN the hole is sitting right there.... Why, it's completely foolproof!* If you think of your force vectors and such it's pretty clear the threaded doohickey deals with forces working upon yon tuner, quite well in fact. I usually slurp a bit 'o varnish or superglue or nail polish or some other sort of somewhat waterproofing stuff over the now-raw wood inside the holes.


*(urp)

 

[Rick]

OK ... S.O.P. ... if need be I'll sand the holes a little bit.  Certainly will be less sanding than with the PW tuners, and I was S.O.Luck on the stock F 70's style tuners, so the hipshot should do nicely, especially after  seeing stratamania's.  I'll post a review with pics, probably next week.  Happy Holidays.  Urp! ccasion14: