10 String Project

[badhorse]

I would like to build a 10 string electric guitar. The low E and A strings would be the same as on a standard 6 string electric guitar and the D, G, B and high E strings would be doubled as on a 12 string. Having never built a guitar of any type before I have some questions I hope someone can answer. How do I determine where to place the holes for the tuners? Does anyone know where I can find a tuneomatic type bridge for a 12 string guitar?  I would like to use a Warmouth MoonCaster Hollow Body but the body isn't flat, so I would need to raise the bridge, I though a tuneomatic would allow me to do that. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
thanks
  ray

 

[mayfly]

Regarding the headstock, the best place to start would be a 12 string design and then eliminate two strings.  Don't have the holes drilled, or start with a paddle then go from there.  I would recommend a modern construction neck or equivalent.

Regarding a 12 string TOM, I've seen them altered to work with 12 strings (cutting two slots for every saddle), but the intonation is always off as there are still only 6 saddles.

I've built a 12 string, and I used the Gotoh 12 string bridge, which like all things Gotoh is inexpensive and high quality.  Maybe they have something in their catalogue in a TOM format...

Keep us posted with questions please!

 

[bagman67]

Turns out you can get your hands on a 12-string Tune-o-matic job at Allparts (there may be others; try searching for the part number), but my gosh, it's pricey - $200 USD.

You gotta REALLY want it.  If it's a dream guitar, sure - but if it's just an experiment, meh.  Go for one of the six-saddle jobs Mayfly referred to that have two slots per saddle.

https://www.allparts.com/GB-2580-010-ABM-2412-C-12-String-Unslotted-Tunematic_p_1643.html

 

[bagman67]

There's also this Duesenberg model that's a lot less spendy at 59 Euro:

http://www.rockinger.com/index.php?cat=WG082&product=3643N-3643C-3643GC

 

[Cagey]

Sounds like an interesting project.

Why look at it as a 10 string? I think if it was me, I'd build it as if it were a typical 12 string and just not put the low E and A octave strings on. Overall, you won't need anything unusual. You'll have two tuners that never get used, but at least it would look right. If anybody asks, call 'em "spares". Plus, if you ever get the urge, you can add those two strings.

Incidentally, have you ever played a "Nashville" tuned guitar? Basically, it's a standard 6 string tuned to an open E, but it's strung up with the E, A, D and G strings gauged to allow them to be tuned up an octave. On their own, they're almost useless (no bass at all), albeit interesting because all your standard fingerings will work, but they make great accent instruments. In concert with a standard guitar, you can do some unusual and interesting things. You can hear one in use in Joe Satriani's "Always With Me, Always With You" starting at about the 1:05 mark with a single reversed chord strike about every 5 seconds, then immediately following with a picked backing sequence, then following that doing a backing chordal melody during one of his take-offs...

[youtube]VI57QHL6ge0[/youtube]

 

[DangerousR6]

Sounds like an interesting project.

Why look at it as a 10 string? I think if it was me, I'd build it as if it were a typical 12 string and just not put the low E and A octave strings on. Overall, you won't need anything unusual. You'll have two tuners that never get used, but at least it would look right. If anybody asks, call 'em "spares". Plus, if you ever get the urge, you can add those two strings.

Incidentally, have you ever played a "Nashville" tuned guitar? Basically, it's a standard 6 string tuned to an open E, but it's strung up with the E, A, D and G strings gauged to allow them to be tuned up an octave. On their own, they're almost useless (no bass at all), albeit interesting because all your standard fingerings will work, but they make great accent instruments. In concert with a standard guitar, you can do some unusual and interesting things. You can hear one in use in Joe Satriani's "Always With Me, Always With You" starting at about the 1:05 mark with a single reversed chord strike about every 5 seconds, then immediately following with a picked backing sequence, then following that doing a backing chordal melody during one of his take-offs...

[youtube]VI57QHL6ge0[/youtube]

One of the most awesome instrumentals ever recorded, first time I heard it, it was full of such emotion it made me cry... :sad: Because I knew I'd never be a great guitar player.... :toothy12: But never the less, I had to try and learn to play it...Honestly, that whole CD is just amazing... :headbang1:

 

[Cagey]

I know exactly what you mean, and have always thought the same thing.

 

[wildbill]

I had forgotten that Joe once had hair. That is a beautiful piece of music.

 

[AirCap]

Is OP talking about something like the BC Rich Bich with 10 strings?

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/--B_yJ5D2C_8/T7SvgluO5aI/AAAAAAAAFaE/DwwA2pM_1Kc/s1600/rich+bich+1.jpg

 

[DangerousR6]

Is OP talking about something like the BC Rich Bich with 10 strings?

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/--B_yJ5D2C_8/T7SvgluO5aI/AAAAAAAAFaE/DwwA2pM_1Kc/s1600/rich+bich+1.jpg

I would tend to think so, that's the only one that comes to mind from his description. I've always been intrigued with the 10 Bitch myself. Wouldn't be too difficult to achieve such from a Warmoth if one so desires... :guitarplayer2:

 

[DangerousR6]

I had forgotten that Joe once had hair. That is a beautiful piece of music.

yes he did...And he's a super nice guy, had the privilege of meeting him some time ago, almost 20yrs ago to be exact.

 

[Cagey]

I remember when I first saw him without hair I was concerned, wondering "Does he have cancer? Is he getting radiation? Is this some kind of statement?
Where's his hair?"

Turned out he just didn't want to be half-bald, so he shaved it all off.

I did it once back when it first became glaringly obvious I wasn't going to have a full head of hair, but as it works out, not having any hair is a lot more work than only having some. Plus, I was still young enough that having a German last name and a completely bald head got a surprising number of people wondering if I was one of those "Skinhead" über-racists, which wasn't funny at all. Of course, now I'm an old white guy, so of course I'm a racist! And a misogynist, and sexist, and everything-phobic, not to mention totally deplorable :laughing7:

 

[swarfrat]

A cheaper alternative to the 12 saddle bridge - since this is already a 10-string. The E and B strings are already unisons. Do you really want two unisons, two singles and two octaves? That could sound strange.  I could actually see running only unisons or only octaves.

So my recommendation is 1) use a 6-saddle TOM, and 2) string it as either an 8 or 9 string.  Running the third course as a unision instead of an octave is not the norm, but it's certainly more common on electric 12's and is the norm if the G is plain and not wound.

 

[swarfrat]

Personally though, i find the octaves make for rich distortion and the unisons get in the way of bends. 

 

[bagman67]

And he's a super nice guy, had the privilege of meeting him some time ago, almost 20yrs ago to be exact.

I kinda had the privilege of NOT meeting him about 23 years ago.  I was in Gary Brawer's shop in San Francisco and JS had come in to check on some work Gary was doing for him.  He was behatted and sunglassed, and looked for all the world as if he didn't want to be recognized.  So I let him be.  I reckon famous folks could use a break from being famous from time to time.

 

[bagman67]

I did it once back when it first became glaringly obvious I wasn't going to have a full head of hair, but as it works out, not having any hair is a lot more work than only having some.

I saw the writing on the wall in my mid-twenties.  Mrs. Bagman (v. 1.0) insisted that I maintain longer hair, and I, being conflict-averse, went with that directive.  But when she showed me the door I bought a set of shears and have not paid for a haircut in 15 years or so.  Like you, Cagey, I see maintaining a shiny bald head as too much work. But I can get the job done with my Wahl clippers in five minutes every 3 or 4 weeks, and that's about as much thought or work as I ever see needing to put into my hair.  I'd have made a lousy hair-metal band member.

 

[ghotiphry]

I did it once back when it first became glaringly obvious I wasn't going to have a full head of hair, but as it works out, not having any hair is a lot more work than only having some.

I saw the writing on the wall in my mid-twenties.  Mrs. Bagman (v. 1.0) insisted that I maintain longer hair, and I, being conflict-averse, went with that directive.  But when she showed me the door I bought a set of shears and have not paid for a haircut in 15 years or so.  Like you, Cagey, I see maintaining a shiny bald head as too much work. But I can get the job done with my Wahl clippers in five minutes every 3 or 4 weeks, and that's about as much thought or work as I ever see needing to put into my hair.  I'd have made a lousy hair-metal band member.

There are alternatives to long hair.

 

[swarfrat]

Lots of people who used to rock long hair running around with none or buzzed these days.

I always sorta wondered just how many of the shaggy headed rockers were sporting wigs though. It takes YEARS to grow a mane out to those proportions, and not everyone can do it. Mine just got bushy when I tried around age 21. I'm like a sheep. It doesn't even get huge,it just grows out to about motorcycle helmet size and then starts getting denser.

 

[Logrinn]

I'd have made a lousy hair-metal band member.

I don't know. One of the most (hair-) Metal bands known have a a singer without any hair:

[youtube]https://youtu.be/BEfOGyvyfFY[/youtube]

 

[ghotiphry]