Wiring help for HH 5way switch Strat

[ghostrider]

I'm building an HH strat with 1 vol & 2 tone controls and a 5 way switch. What I'd really like to do is wire it to be able to split the humbuckers in positions 2 & 4, but I'm not sure how to go about doing that. There are a ton of diagrams out there that match my hardware config but they rarely tell you what you're wiring it to do.

I've got two Duncan Pearly Gates (if that makes a diff). I followed the below diagram last night and plugged it in (no neck) and went through the positions and tapped the pickups. Position 1 and 5 are as I would expect (the respective humbucker) but 2-4 all seem the same with both being active. Without it being fully assembled and strung up, I'm not sure if they actually are different or if I'll like it, but my original thinking was to have them split which is definitely not the current config.

Any feedback would be greatly appreciated! Thanks!

 

[stratamania]

If the red and white are joined together as per the diagram they will not split in any position. That's joining the North and South coils together so they are humbucking regardless of what the selector switch is doing.

The pickups are only making a difference in terms of the wiring colours, so these comments are based on Seymour Duncan's colours.

To split the coils you need a wiring scheme where the red and white join together in the positions where you want a full humbucker. In the positions where you don't one of the coils needs to be sent to ground. In other words in positions 2 and 4 the red and white are grounded.

http://www.seymourduncan.com/wiring-diagrams?meta_params=guitar-options,2-pickups,neck-h,bridge-h,1-volume,2-tone,5-way-blade

Also here's a useful link for understanding guitar wiring written by one of the forum members.

http://www.seymourduncan.com/blog/the-tone-garage/guitar-wiring-diploma-course

 

[ghostrider]

Cool. Thanks for the explanation and the link! I actually tried this diagram first but was getting some strange results (I must have screwed it up somewhere). I'll rewire to this and see what happens.

 

[stratamania]

OK good luck...

 

[Verne Bunsen]

To split the coils you need a wiring scheme where the red and white join together in the positions where you want a full humbucker. In the positions where you don't one of the coils needs to be sent to ground.

Or sent directly to hot. For a humbucker assembled in typical fashion, shorting the link wires to ground gives you the inner/slug coil while shorting the link wires to hot gives you the outer/screw coil. Both approaches are used in that Seymour Duncan diagram you linked to. In position 4, you get bridge pickup outer coil (link wires are hot) and neck pickup inner coil (link wires are grounded). The advantage of that is that, assuming the pickups are wound the same, using opposite coils will give you hum canceling. That diagram doesn't do quite what the OP is after though, as the selector options as I read it are:

Position 1: Bridge (full)
Position 2: Bridge (full) + Neck (full)
Position 3: Neck (full)
Position 4: Bridge (split - outer) + Neck (split - inner)
Position 5: Bridge (split - outer)

Unless I'm missing something there, I don't see where the split neck is available by itself. I have a couple of diagrams that provide the right switching options using a single wafer "half" super-switch, but are configured for Tele style master volume / master tone. Still not exactly what you're after, but I'll get them posted here a bit later.

 

[ghostrider]

To split the coils you need a wiring scheme where the red and white join together in the positions where you want a full humbucker. In the positions where you don't one of the coils needs to be sent to ground.

Or sent directly to hot. For a humbucker assembled in typical fashion, shorting the link wires to ground gives you the inner/slug coil while shorting the link wires to hot gives you the outer/screw coil. Both approaches are used in that Seymour Duncan diagram you linked to. In position 4, you get bridge pickup outer coil (link wires are hot) and neck pickup inner coil (link wires are grounded). The advantage of that is that, assuming the pickups are wound the same, using opposite coils will give you hum canceling. That diagram doesn't do quite what the OP is after though, as the selector options as I read it are:

Position 1: Bridge (full)
Position 2: Bridge (full) + Neck (full)
Position 3: Neck (full)
Position 4: Bridge (split - outer) + Neck (split - inner)
Position 5: Bridge (split - outer)

Unless I'm missing something there, I don't see where the split neck is available by itself. I have a couple of diagrams that provide the right switching options using a single wafer "half" super-switch, but are configured for Tele style master volume / master tone. Still not exactly what you're after, but I'll get them posted here a bit later.

This sounds like what I was experiencing which I thought was a really strange configuration.

 

[Verne Bunsen]

I agree, not an intuitive set of selections. These diagrams are how I do H/H with master volume and master tone, using the single wafer "half" super switch ('cause it fits in Tele cavities...) One gives both full humbuckers in the middle position, the other gives both humbuckers split (outer coil) in the middle position. I'm inclined to say that wiring the tone controls as in the Seymour Duncan diagram (pickup "hot" direct to the tone control) would give you pretty standard Strat-style control operation, but I'm really not sure how it would behave when the coils are split as the unused inner coil would be between the link wires (as hot) and the tone control. Might be just fine, might be weird. But whatever it does, it's exactly what the Seymour Duncan diagram has going on when the bridge is split, so I'd imagine it must be functional to some degree...probably? I'm intrigued about it, so normally I'd be marching straight off to the shop to tinker, but my shop is presently about 4000 miles away...

 

[stratamania]

@verne, agreed the diagram I linked doesn't show the exact wiring but it was intended to illustrate the idea and explanation of how coils are split and a link to other explanations of wiring in general.

 

[Verne Bunsen]

Of course! I wan't trying to imply otherwise. Apologies if I did! I was intrigued by that diagram because I've never had success splitting two pickups using a standard Strat switch. At least not with a final result that I could get on with. It took me a few minutes to figure out exactly what that switch had going on, why SD doesn't state what their wiring diagrams do is beyond me! The OP had said he tried that wiring and got strange results, I just wanted to point out exactly what the switch was doing because, to me, those results are strange indeed! And the fact that they split the coils differently in that diagram just warranted mentioning that there's two ways to do it. My diagrams aren't a perfect fit either, although I think that the switch wiring from mine and the control wiring from yours could produce something functional. I really do wish I could go tinker with it now, haha!

 

[stratamania]

@verne, it's cool not a problem.

Anyway here's a diagram that's close with a superswitch

https://bareknucklepickups.co.uk/main/downloads/schematics/general/humbuckers/2_hum__1vol__1tone__4_con__5_way_super_switch.pdf

Only one volume and tone though.

HSS with auto split 1 volume & 2 tones.

https://bareknucklepickups.co.uk/main/downloads/schematics/general/hsh_hss/hss__1_vol__2_tone__5_way_with_auto_coilsplit.pdf

Colors code conversion chart.

https://bareknucklepickups.co.uk/main/downloads/schematics/general/humbuckers/humbucker_colour_code_conversion_chart.pdf

The answer should be amongst those 

 

[ghostrider]

@verne, it's cool not a problem.

Anyway here's a diagram that's close with a superswitch

https://bareknucklepickups.co.uk/main/downloads/schematics/general/humbuckers/2_hum__1vol__1tone__4_con__5_way_super_switch.pdf

Only one volume and tone though.

HSS with auto split 1 volume & 2 tones.

https://bareknucklepickups.co.uk/main/downloads/schematics/general/hsh_hss/hss__1_vol__2_tone__5_way_with_auto_coilsplit.pdf

Colors code conversion chart.

https://bareknucklepickups.co.uk/main/downloads/schematics/general/humbuckers/humbucker_colour_code_conversion_chart.pdf

The answer should be amongst those 

Thanks guys. I ordered a super switch earlier today after doing some reading. I think with this diagram and the tutorial you gave me, hopefully I'll be able to add a bridge tone control to the mix without too much trouble.

 

[Verne Bunsen]

Cool, I hope you get her doing what you want!

 

[ghostrider]

Cool, I hope you get her doing what you want!

Thanks man.  ccasion14:

I've been reading around and instead of a split, having them go to parallel sounds intriguing. I was looking at this diagram, but the intersecting points are kind of confusing. Does everywhere two lines intersect indicate that those two wires need to be soldered together at any one of their end points?

 

[stratamania]

The intersections of two lines are just two lines in the drawing crossing each other so no connection.

Where the two lines intersect with a circle over it, that looks like a join.

 

[ghostrider]

UPDATE:

I got the super switch and wired it up yesterday. In tapping the humbuckers with a screwdriver while going through the switch positions and knobs, everything works as expected with one problem...

Any position with one or both HBs in series ( pos 1,3, & 5), I'm getting quite a bit of hum which gets louder as I roll off the respective tone. In parallel (pos 2 & 4), there's no hum at all.

I've been over the wiring a ton of times and it looks like it matches the above diagram to me. I don't see any loose or cold joints or any shorts but that doesn't mean that there aren't any. I really feel like there has to be a cold joint in there somewhere.

Can you guys give me some advice on what could cause that kind of hum in those positions and where in the circuit I should be looking?

Thanks!

 

[stratamania]

Does the hum go in those positions if you put your hands on the strings ?

 

[ghostrider]

Does the hum go in those positions if you put your hands on the strings ?

That's another thing I forgot to mention. I don't have the guitar strung yet, but there is definitely a grounding issue because if I touch the controls or bridge (or anything metal) the hum changes. It doesn't go away, though.

 

[stratamania]

I think the first thing to look at will be the connections in the positions where it is humming. And go from there. I know that sounds sort of obvious.

Also check the correct wiring is as you think. It's an easy enough thing for something to be swapped inadvertently.

Also the bare wires must be grounded.

 

[ghostrider]

I think the first thing to look at will be the connections in the positions where it is humming. And go from there. I know that sounds sort of obvious.

Also check the correct wiring is as you think. It's an easy enough thing for something to be swapped inadvertently.

Also the bare wires must be grounded.

Can you tell me which connections on the switch are supposed to be active in those positions? I was using a multimeter to verify which ones are actually connected but I'm not 100% sure which ones are supposed to be and which aren't.

The bare wires are definitely connected to ground but I will verify the joints on those two tonight.

Thanks, man!

...also, using the multimeter, I was looking for lugs that were active in positions 1, 3, 5 that weren't active in 2 & 4. I figured one of those would be the culprit, but I couldn't find any lugs that were active in 1, 3, & 5 only and not in either 2 or 4. Maybe that is a problem?

 

[stratamania]

You'd have to post some photos and ideally a diagram of your intended wiring to help any one on here troubleshoot it.

It sounds like you need to investigate your question at the end to prove or rule that out too.