Talk me out of this Swimming pool route nonsense (?)

GT1-Reach

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49
So,

i have an order for a custom Strat body going on. HSH Route. Roasted alder one piece, sorted for light weight. Because i know that the guitar will get "heavy" parts installed (floyd rose, rather heavy stacked singlecoils, battery for boost etc. - it adds up!) i am thinking about changing the order to a swimming pool route for extra weight saving. I also think about letting my luthier route away more wood beneath the pickguard for even more weight saving. I find light strats attractive. I generally like lighter guitar sonically more. But i dont want to mess this nice body up and end up with weird noises or a semi hollow quality to it. And i still have this thinking in me that a swimming pool route is "cheap". Utter nonsense, got to get rid of that thinking quickly. but is still there. but that is the least of my Problems with this topic. (and i thought i had put aside all the clichés of the guitar  :tard: )

If i read what i wrote it sounds like bs in my head, but i have no experience with taking away a lot of wood underneath the pickguard.

does anyone have any advice on this subject?
 

The Aaron

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Agreed. Nothing wrong with a swimming pool rout.


Some of the most respected Fender-type builders in the world use them as standard. Don Grosh, e.g.
 

stratamania

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9,220
If you think about it and have an HSH rout and then have more routed away, then you pretty much have a swimming pool rout. So in this case a swimming pool rout makes perfect sense.
 

TBurst Std

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2,591
Take a dive into the pool!
My latest Strat I ordered the LW option, a double battery box(though there is no need) and the pool.

You can not end up with a semi-hollow tone as the construction method is radically different. We are talking routings here.

A semi hollow is built from 4 separate veneers: 2 sides, 1 top, 1 back. Then a solid plank of wood is glued in the middle.  Radically different construction method.
 

mayfly

Senior member
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8,233
Well the old swimming pool route has got nothing on the old B-Bender route.  With a B-Bender, you remove a *serious* amount of body wood.  Like maybe 2x the swimming pool route.

Does it change the tone?  Not that I can tell...

 

TBurst Std

Senior member
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2,591
So correct.  Chambering has little impact on tone.  Construction methods? Yes they do.  I seem to address chambered vs semi- hollow vs hollow issue monthly. 

I’ll see about a definitive post with examples that can be stickied.  Many items advertised as semi hollow or hollow by name brands are not that. 

Rule of thumb, if it’s not built like an acoustic guitar ( separate sides, top and bottom), then it’s not a semi hollow or hollow. 
 

JohnnyHardtail

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319
I don't mind the idea of the swimming pool route that you find on Fender.  However Warmoth's pool route adds deep slots on either side of the trem cavity, which allow you to use full length screws for all pickups.  If you look at the cross section of the body there is really a lot of material removed on the lateral axis across the grain.  HSH route seems much preferable to me, just for the structural aspect.  Ok, now lets hear someone say that its not so bad and there is nothing to worry about.
 

The Aaron

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JohnnyHardtail said:
I don't mind the idea of the swimming pool route that you find on Fender.  However Warmoth's pool route adds deep slots on either side of the trem cavity, which allow you to use full length screws for all pickups.  If you look at the cross section of the body there is really a lot of material removed on the lateral axis across the grain.  HSH route seems much preferable to me, just for the structural aspect.  Ok, now lets hear someone say that its not so bad and there is nothing to worry about.


How many such bodies sold without issues would it take to convince you?


I'm looking for an exact number.  :icon_jokercolor:
 

JohnnyHardtail

Senior member
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319
Sorry to say, there is no number that will convince me.  My view is that a standard stratocaster top route is already "semi-hollow", which is not a bad thing - It is often a good thing.  However the guitar *in my opinion* will resonate differently from a hardtail or telecaster body.
 

TonyFlyingSquirrel

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4,245
I’ve opened up plenty of Fender and Schecter Strats for customers to find that many of them are default swimming pool routes simply because it allows diversity in fulfilling spec’d end product.  Nobody would have known if they weren’t opened up, and it hasn’t impacted their tone or playability up to that point.
 

TBurst Std

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2,591
TonyFlyingSquirrel said:
I’ve opened up plenty of Fender and Schecter Strats for customers to find that many of them are default swimming pool routes simply because it allows diversity in fulfilling spec’s end product.  Nobody would have known if they weren’t opened up, and it hasn’t impacted their tone or playability up to that point.
Perzactly

I find most don’t know true hollow or semi hollow bodies vs chambered.  And then start connecting dots based upon a false premise. 

IE:  most people think a Ric 360 is semi hollow
That PRSs hollow and semi hollow are that
A Gibby Midtown is a semi hollow
A Fender Tele thin line is a semi hollow
Etc et al

All of them are chambered and are neither hollow or semi hollow
 

teleme01

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368
TBurst Std said:
TonyFlyingSquirrel said:
I’ve opened up plenty of Fender and Schecter Strats for customers to find that many of them are default swimming pool routes simply because it allows diversity in fulfilling spec’s end product.  Nobody would have known if they weren’t opened up, and it hasn’t impacted their tone or playability up to that point.
Perzactly

I find most don’t know true hollow or semi hollow bodies vs chambered.  And then start connecting dots based upon a false premise. 

IE:  most people think a Ric 360 is semi hollow
That PRSs hollow and semi hollow are that
A Gibby Midtown is a semi hollow
A Fender Tele thin line is a semi hollow
Etc et al

All of them are chambered and are neither hollow or semi hollow

what do you classify a 336?
 

TBurst Std

Senior member
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2,591
teleme01 said:
TBurst Std said:
TonyFlyingSquirrel said:
I’ve opened up plenty of Fender and Schecter Strats for customers to find that many of them are default swimming pool routes simply because it allows diversity in fulfilling spec’s end product.  Nobody would have known if they weren’t opened up, and it hasn’t impacted their tone or playability up to that point.
Perzactly

I find most don’t know true hollow or semi hollow bodies vs chambered.  And then start connecting dots based upon a false premise. 

IE:  most people think a Ric 360 is semi hollow
That PRSs hollow and semi hollow are that
A Gibby Midtown is a semi hollow
A Fender Tele thin line is a semi hollow
Etc et al

All of them are chambered and are neither hollow or semi hollow

what do you classify a 336?
I haven’t researched how it’s built. Is it built like a 330, 335, 347, 355?

Separate sides, top and bottom?
If so, then it’s a hollow or semi hollow depending on if a center block is glued in between the top and bottom.

PS a Midtown is a solid piece of wood routed out then a top placed on it. 

Same basic question, is it built like an acoustic or only lots of routing.
 

TBurst Std

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2,591
Here’s a quick question,
Is the back/bottom arched or flat.  That’s a pretty good indicator

 

TBurst Std

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2,591
Took 2 minutes to research

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gibson_CS-336

The 336 is not a true semi hollow.
 

TBurst Std

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2,591
That’s the same way a Midtown is made.

My Godin Flat 5 X is built the same way. My Ric 360 is the reverse of the same as they glue the back on vs the top.

My true semis are Doozy Starplayer TV and White Falcon center block. Normally Falcons are hollow but I have a center block model.  Oddly with Falcons, for the hollows, there are transitions in how they link the top and back together

My hollow is a Heritage 530 (their take on a Gibby 330).
 

Rick

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4,328
In terms of sound I haven’t found a difference between a solid body and a  chambered or semi hollow body. Weight, yes there’s a difference which adds up when your standing.
 
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