Stringhight on a soloist

[AgentPotato]

I need advice regarding a soloist with a non recessed wilkinson and the 620mod. I am done assambling it now and besides some minor issues with electronics (tone does work as a volume) and the pickups are not mounted that well, but I guess I can fiy that myself - it is working pretty great.

But - and there has to be a but - I can't lower stringhight any lower than it is right now, because everything is at it's lowest point. As of now the string hightnis okay, but I think I might be able to get it even lower once the wood has settled under string tension.

Anyone of you did the same / or similar build and confronted with the same issues? How did you solve it?

I guess I could put a wedge under the neck (maybe a really small one) but I don't want to if not absolutels necessary. (My neck has the 24 fret extension which would fly over the body if I put a wedge beneath)

Any suggestions?

I hope you understood what I meant, I am struggling with english.

 

[stratamania]

Have you tried slackening the smaller internal part of the stud mounts so that you can adjust those lower ?  Once you have the height you want you re tighten the internal parts with the small hex key.

http://unofficialwarmoth.com/index.php?topic=17575.0

 

[john_p_wi]

If you lower the two pivot stud posts as suggested above make sure you loosen the strings first to avoid damaging the knife edge.

 

[stratamania]

If you lower the two pivot stud posts as suggested above make sure you loosen the strings first to avoid damaging the knife edge.

Good point...

 

[AgentPotato]

Thanks for the replies, but the baseplate of the trem is already hitting the body, so even if i get the studs lower, the baseplate would still be the problem.

 

[Cagey]

You don't say what kind of bridge it is, but if it's of the Tune-O-Matic sort, you can always cut the saddles to gain a few thousandths. If that's all you need, you're golden, but there's a limit. Dig those slots too deep and you''re liable to cause other problems.

I'm not a big fan of shimming the neck, but it works. Stick a slice of pick at the two screws closer to the neck pickup, and it'll tilt the neck back bit and lower the strings. Maybe even enough that you'll have to raise the strings.

 

[croquet hoop]

+1 for shimming. You can use a flat shim if you want your fretboard extension to remain parallel to the body, otherwise do as Cagey said.

Another solution would be to route the tremolo area to have it recessed, but it's far more drastic. You would have to be sure that you are able to do this without damaging the finish. Personally, I'd try shimming the neck first.

 

[Wolfie351]

If you have to use shims, then there is something wrong with the routing of the neck pocket.  Everything should line up perfectly. I believe the 720 mod incorporates a slight neck angle, if it doesn't have that angle, you'd experience the exact problems you are having.  I'd check and double check your neck to make sure it's set up correctly before trying anything else.

 

[Cagey]

According to their description, the 720 mod doesn't add any angle. It just lowers the floor of the neck pocket. It's normally .625", (5/8") so the fretboard extension clears the pickguard.

But, I think you're right - they add a couple degrees of tilt to it. I've re-cut some pockets, but it's scary business. For those less maniacal, a shim is the thing to use. You run the risk of deadening the thing, but at least it will work.

 

[Strat Avenger]

I don't think you're supposed to have the .720 mod with a non-recessed bridge. I could be wrong though.

 

[AgentPotato]

The hight if the studs is the same recessed or not - at least it looks like that on the drawings on the warmoth homepage. The recessed part starts behind the studs.
I think that the recession (wrong word?) doesnt work with a 720mod because of the angle between the body and the baseplate if you bend it inside.

Oh, it is a wilkinson vs 100. I dont think you can mod it as cagey suggested.

 

[Cagey]

I've got a number of guitars equipped with a VS100 - it's my bridge of choice - and none of them are recessed, nor are they sitting high. You're right - it would probably be a mistake to try cutting the slots in the saddles. In fact, the VS100 sits rather low, relative to some bridges I could mention. That .720 mod is probably what's hurting you, so you're either going to have to shim it or recut the neck pocket floor to put some angle on it.

Please don't think that I think you're stupid, but you do know you can lower the saddles on that bridge, right?

 

[AgentPotato]

The saddles are all the way down already, as a matter of fact I had to tighten the screws for the saddles. Little bit because I loosened them too much and they do sit in a groove.

Well, the thing is, by shimming the neck, the 24 fretboard extension would fly over the body, and thats not how it should look.

Do you have any 720 mods with a wilkinson? It would be kinda bad if it was a design flaw all along - because as you said, the vs100 is rather flat. And if it doesn't fit, what would?

 

[Cagey]

Whether you cut the neck floor or shim the neck, you're going to have the same problem with that fretboard extension. But, you're only talking about a few degrees of angle - in the 3/4" or so that thing sticks out, I seriously doubt you'd notice it. Even if it's an inch, a three degree angle is going to be pretty hard to see.

I don't have a .720 mod on any of my guitars, but I did have a Strat a few years ago where I had the opposite problem. Strings wanted to lay on the neck, no matter how high I set the saddles. It was a hardtail with a Hipshot bridge. Had to cut the neck pocket floor on that one to sink the neck a bit or I couldn't have assembled it. Wouldn't have been playable at all. I've had to cut angles on a couple other fiddles that the owners wanted taller bridges on, which sounds more like what your problem is.

It's scary work because if you screw it up, the body is basically firewood. But, it's not as difficult as you might imagine, assuming you have a router. You just need a platform for the router to ride on. I used a neck pocket template from StewMac...

I wouldn't use it to route a neck pocket - the cutouts are oversized for some stupid reason - but it works fine as a platform.

Then, you need a short pattern bit, such as a Whiteside #3001...

It's short enough that it doesn't need the template to guide it. The top bearing rides on the sides of the existing pocket, so all you hit is the floor. Drive it around down there until you've cleared the entire thing, and you're good to go.

Just attach the template in such a way as to get the angle you need (3° is good), then you have something for the router to ride on. Set the depth to a BCH at the exit end of the pocket, and clears it at the entry end, and you're good to go.

 

[SustainerPlayer]

I wouldn't use it to route a neck pocket - the cutouts are oversized for some stupid reason.

No - there is a perfectly good reason for that. Learn to use the tool here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B5cfzml-nDc

 

[Cagey]

I disagree. It's like setting clocks forward some arbitrary amount to try and trick yourself into being on time, which you never are because you know the clock is wrong. A measuring device should be accurate, no goofing around. If someone is buying necks that don't meet spec, then they're buying them from the wrong supplier. It's no reason to use a template that's off-spec.

 

[Wolfie351]

It would be kinda bad if it was a design flaw all along - because as you said, the vs100 is rather flat. And if it doesn't fit, what would?

The design is fine but it's very possible Warmoth cut the neck pocket incorrectly without the angle...or, tilt.  But, as I said earlier, double check your neck doesn't have too much upbow before you do anything drastic. 

 

[AgentPotato]

I think its rather unlikely that warmoth cut it incorrectly. However, I had to restring it in order to set the woodmount pickups higher (i shimmed them) and once I restrung the guitar it was pretty much okay.
I don't know what changed, if at all the neck is bowed more because I had to flat it without stringtension to smooth out the marks from the fretjob I did.
Anyways, I find it kinda weird how little room there is for bad alignment of the body and neck, especially with the 720 mod. You either get it right or the pain starts

Thank you all for your help, I wish I could tell you why and how I lost 1mm (3/64) of stringheight...

Now I have to find the last flaw in the wiring and then I am finaly done

 

[stratamania]

Good it's slipped into shape. I wonder if the neck screws were slightly loose and with moving the strings and so on its shifted in the neck pocket just enough to make a difference, anyway you might want to check the screws are snug, without overtightening.