ok how about Planet Waves or other tuners
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bagman67
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I've done okay with the PW's, but others, including Cagey, have found them frustrating. Conventional wisdom around here (which is not to say there's consensus) seems to be that the Schallers are the top choice. I have not used them, but I have used Sperzels successfully.
Bagman
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Patrick from Davis
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+1. Love'em.Gregg said:
Patrick
SustainerPlayer
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I have had Planet Waves on all my guitars since 2006. Both 3+3 and 6 in line. Never had any issues with them. And I'm a frequent string changer - So they have see some action and made some cuts.
I do know they have had a bad production batch witch had "slip" issues. But that is several years ago and people got their bad tuners replaced from Planet Waves.
I do know they have had a bad production batch witch had "slip" issues. But that is several years ago and people got their bad tuners replaced from Planet Waves.
Cagey
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The Schaller Mini-Lockers, Sperzel Trim-Loks, and Planet Waves Auto-Trims all work the same way. There's a post that runs up inside the center of the tuner post and bears against the string after it's been pulled through the side holes in the post. Tightening a knurled nut on the back of the tuner locks the string in place. It's very effective, and doesn't require nearly the tension some folks seem to think it does. They all look good, are well-designed, have high turning ratios and are well-built high-quality machine heads. You really can't go wrong with any of them.
But, you do have to tighten the locks, so there's where the first differences show up. The knurled nut on the back of the Sperzels is thinner than it is on the Schallers or Planet Waves, so it needs a slightly tighter grip that some folks find uncomfortable. Plus, they only come in satin finishes. So, we kick out the Sperzels.
The difference between the Schallers and the Planet Waves is the Planet Waves units have a bit of a die formed by a flange and the the tuner post that the post turns in, so as you wind the string up, it cuts off the excess string within 180 degrees or less. If you like a neat presentation and don't own a pair of side-cutters or don't want to carry them, this would seem to be a pretty cool feature. The less tools you have to carry around, the better off you are, right?
It's a Good Thing!
Problem is, as anyone who's ever owned a pair of side cutters or a knife can tell you, cutting edges eventually dull. Especially if you're cutting a lot of coated spring steel with them, as you are when you're chewing on guitar strings. So, I wouldn't expect that "feature" to last long on those tuners, and the cutting die isn't a renewal part. You'll be buying new tuners when they stop cutting. I would expect the problem to show up on the thinner strings first, and as it happens, the first time I ever used Planet Waves' Auto-Trim tuners, that was the problem I had right out of the box. The high E and B didn't want to cut. I ended up needing side cutters anyway. These were new parts, not some cast-offs or 2nds or pulls from eBay.
So, I'm firmly in the Schaller Mini-Locker camp.
But, you do have to tighten the locks, so there's where the first differences show up. The knurled nut on the back of the Sperzels is thinner than it is on the Schallers or Planet Waves, so it needs a slightly tighter grip that some folks find uncomfortable. Plus, they only come in satin finishes. So, we kick out the Sperzels.
The difference between the Schallers and the Planet Waves is the Planet Waves units have a bit of a die formed by a flange and the the tuner post that the post turns in, so as you wind the string up, it cuts off the excess string within 180 degrees or less. If you like a neat presentation and don't own a pair of side-cutters or don't want to carry them, this would seem to be a pretty cool feature. The less tools you have to carry around, the better off you are, right?
It's a Good Thing!
Problem is, as anyone who's ever owned a pair of side cutters or a knife can tell you, cutting edges eventually dull. Especially if you're cutting a lot of coated spring steel with them, as you are when you're chewing on guitar strings. So, I wouldn't expect that "feature" to last long on those tuners, and the cutting die isn't a renewal part. You'll be buying new tuners when they stop cutting. I would expect the problem to show up on the thinner strings first, and as it happens, the first time I ever used Planet Waves' Auto-Trim tuners, that was the problem I had right out of the box. The high E and B didn't want to cut. I ended up needing side cutters anyway. These were new parts, not some cast-offs or 2nds or pulls from eBay.
So, I'm firmly in the Schaller Mini-Locker camp.
thebutcher85
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Cagey said:
LOL!
Strat Avenger
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I have Fender locking tuners (made by Schaller) on my Strat, and Sperzels on my Warmoth, Both work well. The Sperzels have shorter posts.
OK. so did I. Hey, she's been watching the string changing operation going on from across the room for 25 years. She thought it was as cool as I did. lol.Alfang said:
Oh, about the cutter going dull on the Planet Wave tuners...It's made more like a blunt shearing device rather than a sharp edge that cuts into the string so getting dull doesn't really seem to be relevant looking at the tuner and how it actually works. I've put the PW tuners through hell gigging with 3 bands for a few years now and they've held up without a single issue. PW did have some manufacturer quality control issues early on though, but I never experienced any of that with my sets.
SustainerPlayer
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Gregg said:
Yeah. I find it quite odd to rule them out on that possibility. As stated before I have used them without any issues for a long time. And lets say they "go dull" in 10 or 20 years. You either replace them (consider them parts that needs to be changed like strings, frets, pots, coils and so on) or just keep them on - they will still serve like any other locking tuner without the cutting ability.
No need to invent problems out of nothing.
jackthehack
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I use PW tuners on all builds that don't need vintage style for look, love them, never had any issues.
bagman67
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FWIW, Cagey's not just doing the engineer thing he sometimes does where he projects failure for a particular system that's been poorly optimized in his view - he had some trouble with an actual set of PW's I installed on Quty Pie. I haven't had the same problem yet myself since i haven't restrung her since I got the guitar back from him, but it's a concrete issue he's describing and one I aim to verify myself soon.
Engineer joke:
A clergyman, a doctor, and an engineer are captured by a crazy-@ss totalitarian regime for political crimes. They are sentenced to death by guillotine. When the time comes, they are led out onto the platform where execution is to be performed.
The priest goes first to the guillotine, and when asked if he has a preference to be executed facing up at the blade, or facing down to the floor,he chooses to face the floor. He replies: "I will kneel in prayer to my Creator, and face the earth in humility." And so he does. The executioner releases the blade, and it descends, presumably to separate the clergyman's head from his body - but the blade halts, mere millimeters from the condemned man's neck. Taking this as a sign, his accusers release the clergyman, who hotfoots it on out of there.
Next up is the doctor, who also opts to face the floor, reasoning, "If I face the floor, I will not experience the fear of watching the blade drop toward me, and will this die more peacefully." He assumes the position, the blade drops toward his neck... and again stops, a hair's breadth from ending the doctor's life. He, too, is released, and flees the jurisdiction with all due haste.
Finally, the engineer must face his doom. The choice is given: Face up, or face down? Well, it's a beautiful day, and apart from the imminence of his demise, the engineer is determined to enjoy what little of the day he can. "I will face the beautiful blue sky, and let that be the last thing I know." So he lies down, looking up at the cruelly glistening blade, and as the executioner prepares to drop the guillotine, the engineer says,
"Oh, I can see what the problem is with your blade here..."
Engineer joke:
A clergyman, a doctor, and an engineer are captured by a crazy-@ss totalitarian regime for political crimes. They are sentenced to death by guillotine. When the time comes, they are led out onto the platform where execution is to be performed.
The priest goes first to the guillotine, and when asked if he has a preference to be executed facing up at the blade, or facing down to the floor,he chooses to face the floor. He replies: "I will kneel in prayer to my Creator, and face the earth in humility." And so he does. The executioner releases the blade, and it descends, presumably to separate the clergyman's head from his body - but the blade halts, mere millimeters from the condemned man's neck. Taking this as a sign, his accusers release the clergyman, who hotfoots it on out of there.
Next up is the doctor, who also opts to face the floor, reasoning, "If I face the floor, I will not experience the fear of watching the blade drop toward me, and will this die more peacefully." He assumes the position, the blade drops toward his neck... and again stops, a hair's breadth from ending the doctor's life. He, too, is released, and flees the jurisdiction with all due haste.
Finally, the engineer must face his doom. The choice is given: Face up, or face down? Well, it's a beautiful day, and apart from the imminence of his demise, the engineer is determined to enjoy what little of the day he can. "I will face the beautiful blue sky, and let that be the last thing I know." So he lies down, looking up at the cruelly glistening blade, and as the executioner prepares to drop the guillotine, the engineer says,
"Oh, I can see what the problem is with your blade here..."
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