Not your father's tele

[Cagey]

Switch positions are not always as obvious as we'd like, especially in peripheral view. Depends on the switch, but usually it goes from difficult to impossible to know at a glance where it's at. Humans are much better at pattern matching than observation, so a light can tell you things almost instantly while a switch's position requires you to look at it and make a determination. I know it sounds silly, but it's true and sometimes important.

A light on a switch itself or in concert with it generally only indicates the switch's position, which is supposedly your control intention. You turn something on or off, the light says you turned it on or off. Doesn't tell you if the thing the switch controls is actually on or off, you can only assume. Sometimes, that's ok. If it's not something dangerous/expensive to run, you don't need the controlled device to bark its status. You'll probably find out soon enough.

If you need to know that your intentions have been carried out, you need some sort of feedback from the device you're controlling to light the light. That's a better control system, because the only way you get an indication something is on or off is if it is on or off.

 

[Sovereign_13]

Ah, okay.  I understood right the first time.  Switch in position 1 = light on, switch in position 2 = light off.  The light doesn't tell you anything about what's going on at the other end of the switch, just that the contacts are open or closed.

I don't think I've ever used a discrete lighted switch that gave me more information than that, so I lost you when you started talking about intentions.  In my mind, the "intention" of turning the switch on would be to provide power, which is affirmed by the light.  You're talking about the intention of having something on the other side of the switch turn on.  Same coin, different sides, I think.

 

[bagman67]

Switch positions are not always as obvious as we'd like, especially in peripheral view.

Some folks used to solve that problem with a Dymo label maker (now superseded by digitally thermoprinted tape labels, but Dymo has more mojo, OBVIOUSLY):

If it's good enough for Randall Smith, it's good enough for me:

 

[mayfly]

can you still get dymo stuff?  my 'modern' thermal label maker is starting to give up the ghost.

 

[Logrinn]

Oh, yes

 

[Cagey]

Thermal label makers appear to follow the "Gillette" business model, same way inkjet printers do. They give away the printers, and rape you on the blank label tape. For instance, this unit...

...is only $24.99, and comes with a label tape cartridge. When it comes time to replenish the tape, you can buy this two-pack...

...for $36.99, in the box, out the door. Stock up and save!

Might be why your labeler is giving up the ghost. They're not designed to last very long because they don't have to. Unless you're daft, when you run out of label tape, you just buy a new printer. Give the old one to the neighborhood hoarder for Christmas.

 

[Sovereign_13]

The "Gillette" business model is why I switched to a safety razor.  Spend the money on the part you keep and blades are $5 for 10 at the drugstore.  If you can't get along with a single blade, Dollar Shave Club wasn't bad for the money.

 

[Rich]

What did you use for wire on the secondary of that transformer?

Just stranded 10 i think

I would have thought it would be something special, unless you're wearing gloves or something. Not the wire, but the insulation. Most building wire and machine tool wire insulation is only rated from 250 to 600 vac. You may want to check that before you get surprised. Failure is usually pretty abrupt - you won't get a warning. Goes off like a firecracker.

We used to blow up 'scope probes from time to time working 480, because the peak-to-peak was well over 600v, which is what the probes were rated for. You'd be standing there shooting the breeze, smokin' cigarettes and drinkin' coffee, and suddenly KAPOW! Probe would blow up for no apparent reason. Scare the hell out of you, and total a $350 probe. Tektronix made higher voltage probes, but they cost about 78 bajillion dollars apiece, so we took our chances. Didn't happen often, so it seemed fair. Of course, those were less litigious times. Kids today would probably sue the company into insolvency so they could get back to their video games instead of working for a living :laughing7:

Noted! I pretty much fear the worse and prepare for catastrophe from the moment I plug the unit in, until it’s unlugged. I stand way clear of everything when flipping the switch, only getting close to the leads or wires for repositioning after switching off. The reason I used the wire I did is simply my thinking that if it was good enough for the manufacturer to use then I “should be good”. Their wire has a braided type insulation, mine more plastic-y. I’ll definitely watch out for that.

 

[BigSteve22]

Not being one to help with a thread hijacking, but is it too late to share?

Now that's a labeler, Dymo-Mite!

 

[Cagey]

Noted! I pretty much fear the worse and prepare for catastrophe from the moment I plug the unit in, until it’s unlugged. I stand way clear of everything when flipping the switch, only getting close to the leads or wires for repositioning after switching off. The reason I used the wire I did is simply my thinking that if it was good enough for the manufacturer to use then I “should be good”. Their wire has a braided type insulation, mine more plastic-y. I’ll definitely watch out for that. 

Ok. Well, a final word to the wise, and we'll let this thread get back to its regularly scheduled programming.

One of the things I learned before I got killed is that when you start getting up in the kilovolt ranges, you don't necessarily have to have to touch anything that's under that kind of tension. It will come and get you. Even air stops being much of an insulator at some point - witness lightning. Or, for a smaller example, the ignition systems of most internal combustion engines. When we'd power up large distribution transformers and things of that nature, you didn't tell people not to touch anything - you told them to get the hell away. High voltage has a much larger personal space that it doesn't want violated, so best practice is to not be anywhere near it. If those pesky electrons get too much of a wanderlust, let 'em find ground and eat dirt rather than barbecued human  :laughing7:

 

[rgand]

Not being one to help with a thread hijacking, but is it too late to share?

Never too late to necro a hijack. :icon_biggrin:
I've used one of these for years. I see new ones still on ebay for $99-185 [gasp!] but one of the newer models was listed for $18 with a case and all.

 

[TBurst Std]

Noted! I pretty much fear the worse and prepare for catastrophe from the moment I plug the unit in, until it’s unlugged. I stand way clear of everything when flipping the switch, only getting close to the leads or wires for repositioning after switching off. The reason I used the wire I did is simply my thinking that if it was good enough for the manufacturer to use then I “should be good”. Their wire has a braided type insulation, mine more plastic-y. I’ll definitely watch out for that. 

Ok. Well, a final word to the wise, and we'll let this thread get back to its regularly scheduled programming.

One of the things I learned before I got killed is that when you start getting up in the kilovolt ranges, you don't necessarily have to have to touch anything that's under that kind of tension. It will come and get you. Even air stops being much of an insulator at some point - witness lightning. Or, for a smaller example, the ignition systems of most internal combustion engines. When we'd power up large distribution transformers and things of that nature, you didn't tell people not to touch anything - you told them to get the hell away. High voltage has a much larger personal space that it doesn't want violated, so best practice is to not be anywhere near it. If those pesky electrons get too much of a wanderlust, let 'em find ground and eat dirt rather than barbecued human  :laughing7:

Amen
Having had a blown transformer wire fall on a room I was in (while reaching for the light switch), and the subsequent RF burns and convulsions, I understand. 80kvolt in a 40kvolt transformer doesn't work well. (Some forgot to call ahead during power sharing).

That's the only time in my life with a physical problem that my dad didn't say 'suck it up buttercup'. He got home, saw me, then yelled at my mom heading me out the door, 'why the hell isnt he (me) at the hospital. '

That's TMI, but now you understand why I am the why I am.

 

[swarfrat]

Can't believe I didn't recall this video from my childhood when this was being discussed a few weeks ago.  While I wouldn't try and duplicate Dr Moon's stunt myself, he actually does some fractal burning WHILE BEING PART OF THE CIRCUIT himself in this 1956 video. BUT.... for the purposes of fractal burning, one might be able to add a margin of safety to the circuit by bumping the operating frequency a bit. Not sure if/how it would affect spark travel.

The "url at time stamp" isn't surviving the tag here, but the fractal burning starts at 22:47.
[youtube]https://youtu.be/I8M6JCm6IG0?t=1367[/youtube]