New strat and re-wiring, both HSH.

[EvanWCF]

Hi, guys.

I just got a strat body and neck from warmoth few months before. Also, I’m planning to fix a old mooncaster.

All parts on my desk after long waiting time, ready fight for it. Anyone can help me to check my wiring diagram? I’m worry it is incorrect. Thanks.

Strat


Mooncaster

 

[stratamania]

Welcome to the forum.

Per the diagrams what is the wiring supposed to be doing exactly in each switch position?

 

[EvanWCF]

Yea, thanks.

Strat:
1. Bridge
2. Bridge + Mid
3. Middle
4. Neck + Mid
5. Neck
PP down=split coil, PP up=series

Mooncaster:
LP swtich control humbucker
Master volume, humbucker volume and tone
Independent single coil volume and tone
PP down=split coil, PP up=parallel

 

[stratamania]

Both of them are not how you would normally go about wiring these schemes. I have not reverse engineered them fully but they don't look correct to me.

For example the HSH Strat diagram has the hot wires instead of going to the selector switch directly going to the push pull. The series link to the push pull when activated will split the pickup by shunting to hot, but normally splits are shunted to ground so would give you a different coil than usual.

 

[kdas3]

I checked your first HSH diagram. It looks good. But a few tidbits:

[list type=decimal]
[*]I think you are doing 50s wiring here, because the common from the top pole of your selector switch is going to the output of your volume. Do you want that?
[*]Your split is splitting to the outer coil (i.e., the north CCW of the humbuckers). So you won't get humcancelling in pos 2 and 4. But if you replace your mid single coil with a South CW, you will.
[/list]

I haven't checked your mooncaster wiring.

 

[EvanWCF]

Both of them are not how you would normally go about wiring these schemes. I have not reverse engineered them fully but they don't look correct to me.

For example the HSH Strat diagram has the hot wires instead of going to the selector switch directly going to the push pull. The series link to the push pull when activated will split the pickup by shunting to hot, but normally splits are shunted to ground so would give you a different coil than usual.

“Shunted to hot” and “shunted to ground” have any different and effect?

I just want to cut off the circuit to split a humbucker, when I design this diagram.

 

[stratamania]

Both of them are not how you would normally go about wiring these schemes. I have not reverse engineered them fully but they don't look correct to me.

For example the HSH Strat diagram has the hot wires instead of going to the selector switch directly going to the push pull. The series link to the push pull when activated will split the pickup by shunting to hot, but normally splits are shunted to ground so would give you a different coil than usual.

“Shunted to hot” and “shunted to ground” have any different and effect?

I just want to cut off the circuit to split a humbucker, when I design this diagram.

I did explain that already, but to clarify further.

When splitting a humbucker one coil is cut out of the circuit and the other left in circuit.

By shunting the series link between the two coils to hot you will end up with a different coil than when it is split to ground.  The usual approach is to split to ground.


You will end up with the effect of the split coil being brighter or warmer depending on whether it is a bridge or neck pickup.  That may not be what you want.

With Dimarzio the black and white wires form the series link and they are what you use to shunt usually to ground. For an HSH scheme you would usually go for a RWRP middle pickup.

Perhaps check some of DiMarzios wiring diagrams.

https://www.dimarzio.com/support/wiring-diagrams

 

[EvanWCF]

I checked your first HSH diagram. It looks good. But a few tidbits:

[list type=decimal]
[*]I think you are doing 50s wiring here, because the common from the top pole of your selector switch is going to the output of your volume. Do you want that?
[*]Your split is splitting to the outer coil (i.e., the north CCW of the humbuckers). So you won't get humcancelling in pos 2 and 4. But if you replace your mid single coil with a South CW, you will.
[/list]

I haven't checked your mooncaster wiring.

Just checked again, but not sure.
It should be split inner coil, I guess.

Colour code is standard by Dimarzio:
Red-    North, start.  Black-  North, finish.
White- South, finish. Green- South, start

Diagram just show up-side down bridge pickup, it’s not match colour code.

 

[kdas3]

Oh okay, the coils of your humbucker have a polarity which is opposite to what I'd expect (usually the inner coil is a north, whereas your inner coil is south). So, whatever coil your green and white wire correspond to, that's the coil you're splitting to. Seems like it should be the inner coil, since that is south and your green and white wire are the south start and finish. But...some manufacturers won't reverse the colours of the wires when they reverse the magnet polarity. For example, if you order a reverse magnet humbucker from bare knuckle, they don't reverse the pickup lead colours, so the north wires correspond to the south coil...confusing! So in short, your push/pull switch will split to the coil corresponding to the green and white wire, but I can't tell you what coil that is!

However, I can tell you that your diagram will work, and that the push/pull will split to either the inner or outer coil (again, not sure which one). I'm pretty sure you've got 50s wiring going on too. If you don't want that, wire the top left wire from the selector switch to the left lug of the volume pot, not the middle one.

As Stratamania stated, the wiring for the split is quite non-standard. It will work; you are sending the link to hot rather than ground, which sort of gives you the `other' coil when you split. But a more standard (and efficient) way would be to simply exchange the hot and ground (so the red and green wires) and then wire the split normally (by sending the link to ground when engaging the push/pull switch). The non-standard way as in your diagram is only necessary when one wants the ability to split to either the inner or outer coil (like on a 3 way mini toggle).

So I suggest, instead of modifying the diagram and potentially creating issues, just wire it up as it is and see what coil is being split to. If it's the outer one, you can modify it to split to the inner by splitting the standard way.

As for your Mooncaster, I don't really know what's going on. Maybe I could figure it out if I looked at it for long enough, but it's probably better if someone more experienced looked at it.

 

[kdas3]

Scratch that, I figured out your Mooncaster diagram. Looks good! But again, I don't know what coil will be chosen when the split is engaged.

 

[stratamania]

The Mooncaster diagram is not clear at all what it is trying to do. It doesn't look to me like it will work at all.

https://www.dimarzio.com/support/wiring-diagrams

 

[kdas3]

The Mooncaster diagram is not clear at all what it is trying to do. It doesn't look to me like it will work at all.

https://www.dimarzio.com/support/wiring-diagrams

The Mooncaster does the following:

3 way switch to change between humbuckers: neck, neck and bridge together in parallel, bridge. The individual humbuckers will be wired in parallel or split if the push/pull is up or down respectively. So, the humbuckers are never wired in series.

The middle pickup is blended into the signal via the mid vol pot, and it also has its own dedicated mid tone. The humbuckers (both simultaneously) have their own dedicated volume and tone. Lastly there's a master volume too.


I digested it the following order:

[list type=decimal]
[*]The middle hot goes to mid vol input. The mid vol output goes to master vol input. The mid tone is wired in the usual way.
[*]The hots of the neck and bridge humbuckers go to the commons on the push/pull, which goes to the selector switch. So, electrically the hots could go to the selector switch first and then go to the commons on the push/pull, it does not matter. In the down position, both humbuckers are split, since the green and black wire of the humbuckers are grounded (this also means no series link exists). Again, I am not sure which coil will be selected. In the up position, the hot of the other coil for each humbucker is fed into the signal, so this means the humbucker is in parallel.

[*]The selector switch looks a bit strange and I had to assume how it works. I believe that the bottom middle lug is the ground for the switch. The two terminals on the top are the common, really it should be one terminal (it's the two angled terminals on a switchcraft switch which angle in towards each other and touch). Then the selector switch in position 1 chooses the bottom left terminal, in position 2 chooses both the bottom left and right terminal, and position 3 chooses the bottom right terminal. The common goes to the humbucker volume input, which then has its own tone wired in the standard way. The humbucker volume output goes to the master volume input.
[/list]

Is there something you have found which leads you to believe it won't work?

 

[stratamania]

The Mooncaster diagram is not clear at all what it is trying to do. It doesn't look to me like it will work at all.

https://www.dimarzio.com/support/wiring-diagrams

The Mooncaster does the following:

3 way switch to change between humbuckers: neck, neck and bridge together in parallel, bridge. The individual humbuckers will be wired in parallel or split if the push/pull is up or down respectively. So, the humbuckers are never wired in series.

The middle pickup is blended into the signal via the mid vol pot, and it also has its own dedicated mid tone. The humbuckers (both simultaneously) have their own dedicated volume and tone. Lastly there's a master volume too.


I digested it the following order:

[list type=decimal]
[*]The middle hot goes to mid vol input. The mid vol output goes to master vol input. The mid tone is wired in the usual way.
[*]The hots of the neck and bridge humbuckers go to the commons on the push/pull, which goes to the selector switch. So, electrically the hots could go to the selector switch first and then go to the commons on the push/pull, it does not matter. In the down position, both humbuckers are split, since the green and black wire of the humbuckers are grounded (this also means no series link exists). Again, I am not sure which coil will be selected. In the up position, the hot of the other coil for each humbucker is fed into the signal, so this means the humbucker is in parallel.

[*]The selector switch looks a bit strange and I had to assume how it works. I believe that the bottom middle lug is the ground for the switch. The two terminals on the top are the common, really it should be one terminal (it's the two angled terminals on a switchcraft switch which angle in towards each other and touch). Then the selector switch in position 1 chooses the bottom left terminal, in position 2 chooses both the bottom left and right terminal, and position 3 chooses the bottom right terminal. The common goes to the humbucker volume input, which then has its own tone wired in the standard way. The humbucker volume output goes to the master volume input.
[/list]

Is there something you have found which leads you to believe it won't work?

This is why I asked earlier "Per the diagrams what is the wiring supposed to be doing exactly in each switch position?"

If someone wants something checking it would be helpful to state what the intended wiring is meant to do.

Re the Mooncaster wiring I can see what the different pots are in terms of the humbuckers and middle with blend etc. But is he intending to do parallel humbucker wiring or series wiring?  If parallel it probably will work though neither of us know if that is what is intended as it has not been said.

 

[kdas3]

Yea, thanks.

Strat:
1. Bridge
2. Bridge + Mid
3. Middle
4. Neck + Mid
5. Neck
PP down=split coil, PP up=series

Mooncaster:
LP swtich control humbucker
Master volume, humbucker volume and tone
Independent single coil volume and tone
PP down=split coil, PP up=parallel

They have explained (albeit briefly) what is intended. 'PP down = split coil and PP up = parallel'. So series was not intended. I guess what isn't clear in their description is that the single coil is blended in, and that the 3 way switch only switches the humbuckers (like a usual Les Paul).

So if OP wants that, then I'm pretty sure you're all good! If they don't, then chime in and state what you want your Mooncaster wiring to do.

 

[stratamania]

They have explained (albeit briefly) what is intended. 'PP down = split coil and PP up = parallel'. So series was not intended.

Yes in a later post. I see that now.

I guess what isn't clear in their description is that the single coil is blended in, and that the 3 way switch only switches the humbuckers (like a usual Les Paul).

That part actually was clear from looking at it.

 

[EvanWCF]

Thanks at all!

My stratocaster almost finish (I’ll install bar retainer and fully setup FR tonight), it’s same as my design and kdas3 said.

About strat, 5-way switch as standard wiring but “HSH”. When I got my switch and look at  how it work, it’s not match my diagram, so i swap “neck” n “bridge” and got a right position. “Hot” direct to “tone side”, when you span volume, it’s no effect on tone.

Neck tone and middle tone as standard “SSS” strat, PP down is split humbucker coil for similar single coil tone and balance output.
Humbucker will split “south up” coil, because my middle pickup is “north up”, position 2/4 is hum-cannelling.
PP up is standard series humbucker, position 1/5 is hum-cannelling.

Starcaster? Mooncaster? No matter, I’ll re-wiring at next weekend.
Attached my diagram with clear explanation, it’s working on my stratocaster now. Starcaster diagram not sure it’s correct but look good.

Keep .

 

[kdas3]

I'm a bit confused about your HSH diagram OP.

[list type=decimal]
[*]Did you rotate the bridge humbucker physically? And if you did, why? It doesn't change anything electrically (everything should work and you should get humcancelling in either case), but it does change the position of the north and south coils. Now you'll be splitting to the outer coil in position 2, and inner coil in position 4. But I'm not sure why you wanted or needed to do that. Is it a tonal thing? Note when using humbuckers, it is standard that the pickup leads come out from the bottom of the bridge pickup, and the top of the neck pickup. If your pickup has slugs and screws, then your inner coils will be the slugs. And the slugs are usually north. So I was confused in your original diagram as to why the inner coils were south...did you originally install them rotated? If you did, that's totally fine, but it is non-standard.
[*]'“Hot” direct to “tone side”, when you span volume, it’s no effect on tone.' As per your wiring diagram, you have 50s wiring going on due to the top left selector switch common 0 going to the middle lug of the volume pot (output) rather than left (input). So I think what you're saying here is that turning the volume won't affect the high frequencies, which yes is true.
[*]How do you make your diagrams? They look very clean!
[/list]