Meanwhile, at Warmoth....Nickel vs Stainless Steel frets video!!

[aarontunes]

I found this to be a very interesting exercise. What do you think?


[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eLstfUO9OZ8[/youtube]

 

[Logrinn]

Very cool.
Excellent work! :icon_thumright:

 

[kimbass]

Before your reveal, I picked neck #2 as having a better sound -- more full range. Glad it was the SS version, because they are indeed so much more robust.

 

[rgand]

I did pick out neck #2 as having more high response. Like you said, though, It probably doesn't make a whole lot of difference in the practical world. Of course, combine that with the type of construction and you can dial in a neck to sound more to your playing style. It's another option at our disposal. Thanks for the interesting video.

 

[TBurst Std]

I listened to it on my phone, so no difference.  What was obvious was bends and vibrato were even and more fluid

 

[Cagey]

I heard a subtle difference, but it seemed to move from one neck to the other, which led me to believe it was a change in playing.

I remember when I got my first set of stainless, I was worried what they were going to do. I was pleasantly surprised to hear no tonal difference, although at the time I was doing a lotta stuff with hammer-ons and pull-offs and it seemed to me the hammer-ons were a smidge brighter. Might have been my imagination, but even if it wasn't, the perceived difference was an improvement anyway.

All things considered, to me stainless frets are a no-brainer. Don't even think about it, just do it.

 

[swarfrat]

I did NOT expect to hear a difference. And on the neck pickup chording on the first comparison - I didn't. But once you started single note stuff I did pick out neck #2 as stainless. But it is tiny (and I like the stainless sound too).  My take - it's worth a $20 one time charge.

 

[Re-Pete]

I think I heard a difference but it was so subtle I'm wondering whether I imagined it...

 

[Verne Bunsen]

I listened in headphones and, when I did hear a difference, it was that #2 was a bit brighter. I concur with your assessment that, outside of this direct comparison, the difference is negligible. Cool experiment and great video as always, thanks for putting it together!

 

[stratamania]

I could hear a difference. I picked neck #2 as the one I preferred the sound of. To me, it had more clarity and presence.

When it was revealed that neck #2 was SS, it echoes a little what I have noticed on my own guitars.

If anything it just goes to show what some folks apparently don't like about stainless for others it either makes no difference or they prefer the tone.

My conclusion I prefer SS as they play better, are durable and have if the difference can be heard a timbre I prefer.

Edit: The above I typed after the reveal but before listening to the summing up at the end of the video. I often play with a lot of clean tones and I like clarity and presence.

 

[musicispeace]

Have both kinds represented in my tiny collection. Prefer stainless but also love the sound of the two I have with nickel as well on account of the pickups. I generally order stainless frets unless I am pulling pennies from under couch cushions. I can live with either.

 

[Steve_Karl]

The difference I heard on the clean sounds was that #1 was more full / robust sounding.
#2 sounded slightly thinner in comparison.
Listening on vintage Auratones with a sub driven by a Marantz 1060.

I did prefer the sound of #1 ...

Even so ...
I have 1 neck with SS
and any others from this point on will be SS because of the feel.

 

[amigarobbo]

First time I watched, I guessed wrong.  :doh:

On good quality headphones, and after I knew the result,  :headbanging:  it was obvious,  :headbanging:  there is a slightly harder edge, a zingyness, to the Stainless steel, like the tone had gone from 9 to 10. Or thereabouts.

I prefer the Stainless, and I definitely prefer the feel of Stainless.

But just to put into some sort of context,
http://www.edroman.com/techarticles/stainlessfrets.htm

 

[swarfrat]

Yeah, well that's Ed Roman. An opinion running around in search of an object to opine on.

 

[Cagey]

Well, not since 2011, anyway.

He was quite a character, though. Some of his opinions were so outlandish and/or firmly presented it was difficult to tell sometimes if he was writing parody for entertainment value or if he actually believed what he was saying.

 

[Steve_Karl]

A few questions for Aron (Aron ... is that the correct spelling?) about the test.

Was the action set up done by measurements and done exactly the same on both necks?
Same for neck relief? Exactly the same by measurement?

Are you absolutely sure the mic position was never changed or even touched by a human since initial setup and was exactly in the same position for both recordings?
Same for the amp settings ... never changed for both recordings?

I assume it was a tube amp?
So... was the room temperature the same for both recordings and the warm up time for the amp the same for both?

Also, nothing new added to the physical environment near the mic in front of the amp like a chair or stool or brief case
set down close to that area?

Thanks!

 

[aarontunes]

A few questions for Aron (Aron ... is that the correct spelling?) about the test.

Was the action set up done by measurements and done exactly the same on both necks?
Same for neck relief? Exactly the same by measurement?

Are you absolutely sure the mic position was never changed or even touched by a human since initial setup and was exactly in the same position for both recordings?
Same for the amp settings ... never changed for both recordings?

I assume it was a tube amp?
So... was the room temperature the same for both recordings and the warm up time for the amp the same for both?

Also, nothing new added to the physical environment near the mic in front of the amp like a chair or stool or brief case
set down close to that area?

Thanks!

I'll answer all these questions as accurately, and with as much humor, as I can.


The correct spelling of my name is "Aaron". Thanks for asking! I need a reminder sometimes too. I chose the username Double A for just such emergencies.


I don't know if the action was adjusted by measurement. I didn't do it, and wasn't there when it was done. The guitars were given to me ready to go, and I played them. I can tell you that they were set up very similarly....it's not like they were wildly different. One variable that I should have measured was the distance between the strings and the pole pieces on the pickups. That may have varied slightly, or it may have been exactly the same. At this point I have no way of knowing. But, that ship has sailed. Again....the action and setup on both necks was very similar, and given the fact that the necks were identical in all respects, I would guess that any difference in the distance between strings and pole pieces was insignificantly small.


As far as amp settings and mic placement, this part I did have control of, and yes: I am absolutely certain that neither the amp setting nor the mic placement were changed between recordings by human hands. Or the hands of any other species with hands. Or the hoofs (cloven or otherwise) of any other animal. Or paws. Or flippers. Nothing was bumped by a badger, changed by a chameleon, or turned by a tortoise. Also, no rocks or other minerals tumbled into the mic stand.


The amp was a Fender Hot Rod Deluxe....a tube amp, and one of the most common backline amps around.


I did not take a temperature reading on each day, prior to shooting. I also did not bother to record the humidity lever, barometric pressure, or wind speed and direction. The room was approximately the same temperature both days, a comfortable 70-ish degrees. We use forced air heating in the office here at Warmoth, and we shot the video in November, so the humidity level was probably a bit low. Sunrise would have been slightly earlier on the first day, and sunset slightly later. There was a waxing gibbous moon on the first day of shooting. Full moon on the second. Waning gibbous on the third, but no part of the test was shot that day....just my summation. A quick check of the Pacific Northwest Seismic Network website shows there were five minor earthquakes in the area on the first day, the largest/closest of which was a 1.1 magnitude, centered in Morton, WA, about 53 miles away. However, on the day of the second test there were fifteen, the closest of which was a 2.4 centered about North Bend, about 40 miles away.


The amp was fully warmed up for both recording sessions. It sat at idle for a similar amount of time on both days - at least a half-hour before recording. Actual recording time was a little longer the first day, as I had to "write" the parts for each test, and then notate their tempos and pickup positions as I went along, so I could duplicate them for neck #2. Shooting the second day went quicker. I refreshed my memory of what I had played by watching the first day's clips, and then just went in and played straight through them.


The environment around the amp and mic did not change at all between days. To my knowledge, nobody at Warmoth even owns a briefcase. Or a business suit, for that matter. A fern did not grow in front of the speaker. Some plants in the office would be nice though....it would make it a lot more homey.

 

[Cagey]

Ok. But, what about raccoons? You mention no human hands, cloven hooves, or flippers, which I'm not sure you can really control for, but you don't mention raccoons. Or, zomby woofs, for that matter. Being on the left coast, I gotta think you're on constant patrol for zomby woofs, yet you neglect to mention their exclusion from your recording session.

Could it be you am the zombie woof? Is your right foot bigger than the other one is, like a regular zomby hoof?

 

[aarontunes]

WAIT!!!




Wait.




It just hit me.....




































SASQUATCH!!!!!!!!

 

[bagman67]

Ok. But, what about raccoons? You mention no human hands, cloven hooves, or flippers, which I'm not sure you can really control for, but you don't mention raccoons. Or, zomby woofs, for that matter. Being on the left coast, I gotta think you're on constant patrol for zomby woofs, yet you neglect to mention their exclusion from your recording session.

Could it be you am the zombie woof? Is your right foot bigger than the other one is, like a regular zomby hoof?

Tellin'  you all the zombie troof!  Here I'm is, the zombie woof!

Zappa's band puts the pedal to the metal live in 1982, way faster than on "Apostrophe":

[youtube]m-HXtmQM4E0[/youtube]