How can the 4 letter guitar company justify their prices?

Fullerton, Ca smells of nitro, as did Warmoth on Friday's back in the old days when they only shot nitro/satin on Friday's.
Not sure what it is like now, been over a decade since I've worked there.
 
  DuckBaloo an earlier line of there guitars were manufactured in Asia and I believe they were then assembled in the U.S. I believe it says that on their website.

I'm not an environmental expert but I though nitro spraying has been illegal in CA for decades. Fender used to say they sent those bodies and necks to Mexico plant to be sprayed when they started to reintroduce Nitro back into their high end guitars. Maybe they found a loop hole since then. I don't know.
 
JohnnyHardtail said:
TBurst Std said:
Just went out and priced a S**r Reb Beach, ask of 4000, I could get for 3450 incl shipping.
Just priced out the nearest thing I could on the W (could not do a FULL Koa body), Price with my time and labor (10 hrs at $50) and $200 for Cagey's neck work - 2814 before shipping. so lets tack on another $50 for that and a case at $100. So we are at 2964 and I don't even have a full Koa body.
Less than $500 difference.

You should also add in the cost of PLEK fret level and nut cutting.  Also factor in the potential risk of something goes wrong, guitar getting damaged, or if the fret job gets messed up.

And factor in the Warmoth assembled guitar as a whole instrument has no warranty though some of the parts used may. And also the Suhr will have a good resale value whereas the Warmoth will not.
 
eyyy, suhr makes a good guitar, no doubt 'bout it. while some companies be making straight basic-butt guitars  (like so basic if you put them in an acid all theyd do is balance out the pH), they're focusing on really well crafted stuff. and they have a cool 'stock (headstock shape). sure there be plenty of goodly made boutique stuff, but most of it is overly esoteric and over engineered or are zero-personality-vintage-rehash-wannabes, but suhr rides that in between line real good.
 
WindsurfMaui said:
  DuckBaloo an earlier line of there guitars were manufactured in Asia and I believe they were then assembled in the U.S. I believe it says that on their website.

Which was NOT the high end line.
 
WindsurfMaui said:
I have a long time ago held and strummed a '65 Strat and was wholly unimpressed. I appreciated  that it was one of the first so it was very valuable but I doubt the wood had any secret sauce …

It easily could have been a poor setup.

That said, a '65 is not one of the first. They started making them in '54.

Unless you are talking about CBS era, which most will attest to it being the start of the decline of the company's quality control.

It should be noted that MOST of the "improvements" you are talking about (SS frets, roasted maple)are upgrades--NOT things you find on the basic production models.
 
WindsurfMaui said:
There is a guitar company whose name is 4 letters that is asking over $3,000 for their guitars. These are basswood Strat or Soloist bodies with roasted maple necks and stainless steel frets. They look to me like Warmoth parts, except for the head stock, that we buy here for under $1,000 finished and the electronics are not that much so how can they ask for so much money for them and why the heck are people paying that much? I'm confused. I could understand people paying a few hundred dollars more for the name because they want to be associated with an exclusive company but $2000 more for a basswood body guitar?

I'm confused you're confused ;-)

You are assuming anyone wants to go through the process of slapping parts together hoping for a good outcome, that's hardly ever the case on the first few builds.
If it's one of your first builds chances are you'll either end up with a terrible nut, skip the fret work, and/or do a poor job setting it up.
You may be happy with the results because you got exactly what you wanted in terms of woods/colors combination.
You'll feel so happy owning a 'custom' guitar for a fraction of the price of Fender CS/Suhr/Anderson/etc... but if you look at it objectively it'll be a worse playing and feeling guitar than a MIM Strat (incredible value by the way).

Sure, you can certainly have a pro tech take care of the fretwork/nut/setup.
I assume that probably runs a good $400-800 in some places.
Now you have a well setup and good playing guitar that won't choke/buzz.
... but you still have those sharp fingerboard edges and sharp fret ends that are such a beautiful feature of budget Squier/MIM guitars.
Damn, you now have $1.5-2k invested in this and still have MIM-like fingerboard edges/frets ends.

If you want the same level of rolled fingerboard edges you find on Fender Custom Shop Masterbuilt instruments that's going to cost you a lot as that's a long process, whether that's something you care about is subjective.
Let's say another $200-300, and that's cheap given the amount of work involved for something higher rolled, assuming you even find someone who wants to bother with that.
Note: taking a quick look at Suhr the edges and frets ends seem very mildly rolled/smoothed (so are Fender basic USA model) so that's simple/inexpensive to get just that.

After all that is done you still end up cheaper than a Suhr and other boutique builders, but the price gap will have closed considerably.

Whether the guitar ends up being better sounding, properly weight-balanced, etc... is unknown as well.
I assume that when you buy a Suhr from a shop you get to return it if there's anything you don't like.
If you've built your own and spent all that money on a tech for setup/fretwork and still don't like the outcome:congrats, you've just lost 30-50% of the value on parts, and all of the tech's labor cost.
At that point you'd have been way better off going for that Suhr that seemed (but wasn't) so much more expensive.

Don't get me wrong, I don't expect to buy a bolt-on guitar from any guitar manufacturer ever again.
But it took me 10-15 years to get to a point where I like the playability and feel as much as a Fender CS Masterbuilt guitar for a fraction of the price. Most of that comes down to the neck by the way.

As such I don't think it's remotely fair to question why anyone would buy a Suhr/Fender/Tom Anderson/etc...
There are plenty of good reasons to do so if you have the money, and more often than not end up with an impeccable playing/feeling guitar.
There's a reason they sell, and I doubt it's just 'brand aura'.
 
Seamas said:
It should be noted that MOST of the "improvements" you are talking about (SS frets, roasted maple)are upgrades--NOT things you find on the basic production models.
Not so much anymore. More and more these things are becoming standard fit, and some of them on much cheaper guitars.
 
pwrmac7600 said:
Seamas said:
It should be noted that MOST of the "improvements" you are talking about (SS frets, roasted maple)are upgrades--NOT things you find on the basic production models.
Not so much anymore. More and more these things are becoming standard fit, and some of them on much cheaper guitars.

yo ambrosia, are there under $1k production guitars with stainless frets these days? Thats how youd get them to go mainstream.
 
BroccoliRob said:
yo ambrosia, are there under $1k production guitars with stainless frets these days? Thats how youd get them to go mainstream.
Solar guitar are actually making guitars right at 1000.00 that have SS frets and roasted necks
 
BroccoliRob said:
pwrmac7600 said:
Seamas said:
It should be noted that MOST of the "improvements" you are talking about (SS frets, roasted maple)are upgrades--NOT things you find on the basic production models.
Not so much anymore. More and more these things are becoming standard fit, and some of them on much cheaper guitars.

yo ambrosia, are there under $1k production guitars with stainless frets these days? Thats how youd get them to go mainstream.

I read fantastic reviews, and watched some great demos, of Shijie guitars. They offer roasted maple necks (with a flame maple skunk stripe), stainless frets and lots of other high-end appointments. One nice little touch is the bodies come fully shielded too. It looks like they go for $800-1,000 depending on options.
 
  Again people can buy whatever they want. I guess I put a different value on some features and don't see the value of the features that others find worth 3,000.

Docteurseb I think you are right. My Warmoth neck probably wouldn't impress anyone who owns a $3,000, But it satisfies me and I think that is all that counts. Maybe I got lucky I didn't feel I had to change the nut at all, I didn't have any high frets and the frets didn't need any finishing. I did reshaped the shaft to make the boatneck a little sharper, I rolled one side of my fret board enough that I am happy with it, it feels great to me. If I did get a neck from Warmoth that needed major adjustments I would Plek it just because so many people are happy with their Plek'd necks and I am curious as what it would do. As for my builds I am very lucky. I'm pretty much a disaster when it comes to working with tools but since I'm not buying necks or bodies that have high end features like great paint jobs or super flamey wood If I do goof up it is easy to take off all the parts and get another body or neck. That is one of the reasons I only want bolt on neck guitars I can pmix, match and customize as much as I want.

I admit when I bought my first guitar I wanted them all. They were all so beautiful, even th eugly ones with their paint jobs and shiny metal the same way I want to buy all the cars on a car lot. Those shiny paint jobs get me every time.  But I eventually came to the realization I'm not buying a car or a piece of furniture so like EVH I'm only interested in how it make me feel while playing it not what it looks like. But I admit I'm an oddball. And again the reason I asked the question in the first place is I thought maybe there was a new feature like roasted neck etc that helped justify the price. Something that I wasn't catching when I read the specs on the website.

Cactus Jack I saw a youtube video of the Shijie people cutting and sanding the woods for the body and the neck. The machinery seemed very primitive to me. Seemed like 18 different types of sanding machines but the workers knew exactly how to use them and it was like magic watching them do such a good job using these very old sanders. I was very impressed. Not enough to want to buy one, but instead inspired me so I'm about to buy a Warmoth unfinished Strat body and do some of my own hand sanding to customize the body and then attach my roasted maple neck to it and then sell all these painted Fender guitars.  :>)
 
OK...Warmoth has officially made me an OCD SOB :) . I was checking out Suhr stuff and was stopped dead in my tracks by the neck joint below. Look at that slop :). Ugh...how could they let that slide! Seriously, you know you've crossed over to the darkside when mm maters.

x1vK4sMl.png
 
Looking at Mr Cactus' picture, I think Suhr make them like that to avoid cracking the finish.  You can see the Top-surface of the Flame maple veneer is flush with the neck, it is only the front edge of the neck pocket that has a bevel that looks like a stress-relief.
 
I posted the previous picture as a bit of a light-hearted joke. However, looking at a few other guitars on the website, some definitely have tighter tolerances so I don't think the gap in the previous pic is a design feature. I have no idea, just thought it was funny my Warmoth's appear to have tighter neck pockets than the pic shown. 

x1vK4sMl.png
gZrj36Il.jpg
 
In viewing the pic, I don't see that as a gap, I see a shadow of a beveled edge of the neck pocket wall to prevent that thin piece of material from chipping off.
 
My heart is racing. I just received an email from UPS that my Warmoth package is being prepared to ship and an estimated delivery date of early next week, This is my Stratocaster gibson conversion neck of unfinished quarter sawn Mahogany with a dark Indian Rosewood fret board and 6100 stainless steel frets.  I placed the order at the end of July and thought with the back log I wouldn't receive the neck until October. But I guess because it is unfinished it went through the process faster.
 
pwrmac7600 said:
BroccoliRob said:
yo ambrosia, are there under $1k production guitars with stainless frets these days? Thats how youd get them to go mainstream.
Solar guitar are actually making guitars right at 1000.00 that have SS frets and roasted necks

YO those look pretty fly for a white guy (or any race or gender or creed). As longs as you like the Hvy Mtl attitude then they seem like a bargain, thx for the headsup
 
BroccoliRob said:
pwrmac7600 said:
Seamas said:
It should be noted that MOST of the "improvements" you are talking about (SS frets, roasted maple)are upgrades--NOT things you find on the basic production models.
Not so much anymore. More and more these things are becoming standard fit, and some of them on much cheaper guitars.

yo ambrosia, are there under $1k production guitars with stainless frets these days? Thats how youd get them to go mainstream.

FYI- Agile just released a new HH Soloist style guitar. Bound Alder body, roasted maple neck (no dot inlays) 24 stainless steel frets, Grover tuners, AND one of the nicest contoured bolt on neck joints I’ve seen.

Total price = $440.

rqY2x18l.jpg
 
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