Cagey
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For all the lovers of exquisite naked exotic woods here
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Patrick from Davis
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Didn't Gibson suffer from poor sales in the late 80's, and their solution was to increase the price of their line? This actually worked. Although I think Guns and Roses also gave them a shot of much needed publicity. Even if those statements are a bit loaded with irony, and the time line might not be entirely correct, they did do it.
Patrick
Patrick
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Gibson suffered from poor sales (and was within 3 months of bankruptcy) in the mid '80s due to the exceedingly poor management and ownership by Norlin, Inc. It was bought out by a group of guys who still don't seem to know how to run a musical instruments company, but they're at least keeping the place solvent. For now. I suspect they're doing a bit of income redistribution via the myriad instrument and electronics companies they've purchased since then to punish the successes and reward the failures still on the books. Some of them include Baldwin, Epiphone, Kalamazoo, Kramer, Maestro, Slingerland, Steinberger, Tobias, Valley Arts, Wurlitzer and Garrison Guitars.
elgravos
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I very much doubt the government is going out of its way to target Gibson. As many people have mentioned before, a number of polls appear to show that their employees are pretty much the unhappiest bunch of people in the country. Not surprising as a result of their business practices and predatory approach to competition. My guess is that there are plenty of former insiders lining up to dish the dirt on illegal practices at the company. That's usually how these things start. There is absolutely no need to bring on political paranoia or see any form of (left wing) agenda behind this. When the relevant authorities get substantive reports of wrongdoing from people in the known, then it's their duty to investigate. It also explains why other companies are not getting targeted.
As for the laws that these people are tasked to enforce, it's undeniable that those are a complete mess but they don't make the laws, they just enforce them. If the US had a functional political system maybe something could be done about that second issue but that looks to be further out of reach than ever!
As for the laws that these people are tasked to enforce, it's undeniable that those are a complete mess but they don't make the laws, they just enforce them. If the US had a functional political system maybe something could be done about that second issue but that looks to be further out of reach than ever!
AprioriMark
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Don't forget that employees were rounded up and questioned while surrounded by heavily armed men without any lawyers present, and that no violations or charges were ever mentioned. Forget BS politics, that's not only un-American, it's against basic human rights.
-Mark
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I remember being down in Central America years ago and being pulled over for some sort of "roadside check" by a buncha heavily armed soldiers. That is pants-pissingly frightening. Most of those guys can't even read, let alone reason or think for themselves, so you don't dare even move to swat a mosquito for fear of being misunderstood and shot.
So, yeah. Pretty spooky that it could happen here, especially over something so benign.
But, The One has been having a tough time getting overbearing laws passed after the 2010 elections, so they've let the leash way out on regulatory agencies. Now the EPA, FCC, FDA, OSHA, et al are essentially running their own little fiefdoms and getting away with all sorts of unreasonable behavior.
So, yeah. Pretty spooky that it could happen here, especially over something so benign.
But, The One has been having a tough time getting overbearing laws passed after the 2010 elections, so they've let the leash way out on regulatory agencies. Now the EPA, FCC, FDA, OSHA, et al are essentially running their own little fiefdoms and getting away with all sorts of unreasonable behavior.
Strat Avenger
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Wyliee said:
'Sorry, but this is a guitar forum, and when "politics" affects the very thing that this forum is about, it needs to (and should be allowed to) be discussed. They could pull this same B.S. on Warmoth, or any other guitar manufacturer...
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Gregg said:
I didn't see any posts that were "heated and hostile". Were they removed?
Unless Warmoth are illegally importing protected endangered species, it seems unlikely. Gibson bought the wood illegally and now they're seeing the consequences of that. As a result, they're trying to fearmonger us into thinking we should be afraid as well. They're getting their come-uppance and are now behaving like spoiled children.Street Avenger said:
If anyone EVER has their guitar confiscated at a border because of CITES or the Lacey act, I will eat my hat.
DangerousR6
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Even if said wood was gotten illegally, there's still no reason for a Historic American company to be treated like drug lords... And raided by a SWAT team... :dontknow:Kadmium said:
Well, I think the issue of "agencies run amuck" certainly transcends any party, President and even country - Romans knew about this stuff. An agency gets funded as a result of their measurable "accomplishments" and their ability to appear to need more funding, so the "best" bureaucrats are not the ones that do the most good - gee, that's innocent - but the ones who make the most measurable noise about saving civilization from the brink. They're clear cutting and simply burning up South American forests way faster than the wood can even be harvested ahead, everyone knows that parking lots are better than trees. The wood from the previous bust was Madagascar ebony and the concern was it's being smuggled, and governments always take a dim view of things they're not taxing.
This time around the Fish & Wildlife Service is apparently looking for an exact paper trail for some wood that Gibson bought from "a Forest Stewardship Council certified supplier", according to Henry Juszkiewicz. The burden is apparently supposed to be on Gibson to prove that their suppliers aren't lying? It seems like high-profile, "Look at US!" kind of posturing... Customs can't really go after the people smugglers, because we like the cheap workers (the rich folk do, at least) and the DEA has done a botch-up on the drug smugglers;
But the brave agents of the Fish & Wildlife Service are there to protect us in times of peril!
From... dangerous, savage unregistered... fingerboards... hmmm. Maybe they're angling for a big Hollywood blockbuster movie and their own comic book? Gee, I wonder when their budget come up for review. :icon_scratch:
This time around the Fish & Wildlife Service is apparently looking for an exact paper trail for some wood that Gibson bought from "a Forest Stewardship Council certified supplier", according to Henry Juszkiewicz. The burden is apparently supposed to be on Gibson to prove that their suppliers aren't lying? It seems like high-profile, "Look at US!" kind of posturing... Customs can't really go after the people smugglers, because we like the cheap workers (the rich folk do, at least) and the DEA has done a botch-up on the drug smugglers;
But the brave agents of the Fish & Wildlife Service are there to protect us in times of peril!
From... dangerous, savage unregistered... fingerboards... hmmm. Maybe they're angling for a big Hollywood blockbuster movie and their own comic book? Gee, I wonder when their budget come up for review. :icon_scratch:
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