Easiest FB Wood to refret?

[s1player]

Hello everyone - I am considering a new neck using Nickel Silver frets. I usually use SS frets, but for this project I am interested in a size that only comes in Nickel Silver AND I tend to wear frets pretty fast. So, this will likely require a refret at some point and I wanted to choose a FB wood that's easier to refret.

So, what fretboard wood is easiest (or at least easier) to refret? Assume Nickel Silver frets, if it makes a difference.

Also, how is Purpleheart specifically in terms of refretting difficulty? Assuming Nickel Silver frets.

For aesthetic reasons, I am considering purpleheart, ebony, and roasted maple - but willing to go a different direction if something else is easier.

Thanks in advance.

 

[Cagey]

None of them are particularly easy, unless whoever owned the neck liked to oil the thing all the time. That tends to soften up the wood over time, which is NFG. Means you might only get one refret before the slots are just shot.

Many modern necks have the frets glued in, which makes things slightly more difficult but also tends to exacerbate tear-out, which is the worst problem you'll find. Some of the very hard woods like Ebony tend to chip more during fret extraction, but it's a crap-shoot. You may get none or a ton out of any wood. Thing is, the fret tangs have little barbs on them to hold them in place, and pulling them is like petting a cat backwards - it just makes a mess.

That's one of the reasons stainless is getting more popular. You can put them in and they'll last a helluva lot longer than nickel-silver, so there's less opportunity to wreck the 'board doing refrets. Since there's no difference in sound/tone/character and they're easier to play, they're a no-brainer.

But, it is a little tougher to find some of the more obscure wire sizes in that metal, unless you're willing to buy big reels of it. Jescar is a manufacturer of fretwire - if you dig through their offerings, you may find the size you want in stainless. You probably won't be able to buy a small quantity of it, but you'll get the part number and might be able to find a dealer who will sell you a realistic length.

For instance, I have a job coming up where the guy wants SS6150 wire, but I didn't have it in stock and couldn't get it from the usual suspects. Turns out that's a Jescar FW47104-S product, and is available from Philadelphia Luthier Tools & Supply. You might be able to do a similar backward search and find what you're looking for.

 

[dmraco]

Agree with Cagey.  SS frets all the way.  They last nearly forever.  I think I read someplace that Eddie van Halen switched to SS frets because he was wearing thru nickel ones in weeks.  His SS frets lasted all tour.

Btw....the gold frets are a harder alloy too....almost as hard as SS.

 

[Cagey]

I've got "gold" frets on several of my guitars, and have installed them for myself and others. Lovely things. Feel and perform very much like stainless, just a different color.

Incidentally, for those who aren't familiar, it's not a plating - the fretwire is that color all the way through. So, you don't have to worry about losing finish or changing color.

 

[s1player]

Thanks Cagey and DMRCO - I have SS on all my builds.

However, my plan is to use these huge frets in lieu of scalloping: http://www.allparts.com/LT-0877-000-Jumbo-Fret-Wire_p_2080.html. These are only available in nickel silver.

I even contacted allparts to see if they could custom order this size in SS. They could not and Jescar still seems to be the biggest SS fret - which is half this size.

So, if I go with this nickel silver fret, I want the fretboard to be as easy to refret as possible, cause I would only want to crown and polish so much before I'd want the full fret height restored.

Sounds like it really depends more on the specific piece of wood than the species?

No type of fretboard wood has an edge? If not, I'll just go with what I like aesthetically.

 

[Cagey]

Damn! Huge? No, those are brobdingnagian!

(Yes, Sister Mary Elephant, I finally got to use it in a sentence  :icon_biggrin

You're correct in your conclusion: it depends on the specific piece of wood and none of them has an edge, although as I mentioned earlier the hardest stuff tends to chip more easily. Still, If you must pursue this course, I would just use whatever you like. Refretting is always somewhat destructive, but with wire that wide, it would probably cover any chipping that might occur. Still, the best bet is to reduce the need for that as much as possible. With frets that size, you could probably re-crown them a dozen times and most people wouldn't notice, but if your fingers really want/need that height you probably would notice. So, I understand your desire.

I love a tall/wide fret too, so I put 6100s on everything. If it was me and I wanted even more tactile feedback and control than what those provide, I'd be doing the scallop thing so I could still use stainless - the object of the exercise being to NOT have to re-crown or re-fret frequently but still have the feel you're looking for. The frets will feel super-tall, but will last a long time.

Try it on a relatively inexpensive neck to start with. Get a Rosewood over Maple part 100% scalloped and put some stainless on there. If it feels too weird, there's always eBay. Get 50% to 75% of your money back, and use that to follow your original plan.

 

[s1player]

Damn! Huge? No, those are brobdingnagian!

(Yes, Sister Mary Elephant, I finally got to use it in a sentence  :icon_biggrin

You're correct in your conclusion: it depends on the specific piece of wood and none of them has an edge, although as I mentioned earlier the hardest stuff tends to chip more easily. Still, If you must pursue this course, I would just use whatever you like. Refretting is always somewhat destructive, but with wire that wide, it would probably cover any chipping that might occur. Still, the best bet is to reduce the need for that as much as possible. With frets that size, you could probably re-crown them a dozen times and most people wouldn't notice, but if your fingers really want/need that height you probably would notice. So, I understand your desire.

I love a tall/wide fret too, so I put 6100s on everything. If it was me and I wanted even more tactile feedback and control than what those provide, I'd be doing the scallop thing so I could still use stainless - the object of the exercise being to NOT have to re-crown or re-fret frequently but still have the feel you're looking for. The frets will feel super-tall, but will last a long time.

Try it on a relatively inexpensive neck to start with. Get a Rosewood over Maple part 100% scalloped and put some stainless on there. If it feels too weird, there's always eBay. Get 50% to 75% of your money back, and use that to follow your original plan.

There are a couple reasons I am intrigued by the HUGE fret option (vs scalloped):

1. I bought a custom Musikraft neck - that is 1.125" (not a typo) Deep U shape the entire length. 1.75" nut width. They do not scallop from the factory - so had to have that custom done as well. And, had to have Jescar's "6000" equivalent SS frets put on separately (they would only install up to 6100 stainless). I am thinking of having another of these necks done, and would like to not have to ship the neck literally across country to get the scalloping done. The last neck went across country 3 times - it's better traveled than I am!

2. Also, I am intrigued by the option of preserving the full mass of the neck. Not that I really noticed the impact of the scalloping on the sound before/after the scallop job.

3. Finally, using the HUGE fret wire - the effective thickness of the neck would be increased by another 1/16 inch. So, it would make a crazy thick neck - that much thicker. I'd like to give that a try as well.

Don't get me wrong - I love scalloped necks as I have 3 Warmoth and one custom scalloped. Just think this HUGE fret approach might have some merit.

To be precise on the re-crowning - I'd be OK with recrowning up to the point the frets move from feeling scalloped to Not-scalloped. Having never tried something like this - I am not sure how many that would be. I suppose that would be part of the experiment.

Really appreciate the help thinking through this unorthodox option.

 

[Cagey]

Well, chips and tearouts from removing frets start from the tang, so as I mentioned earlier, with a fret that wide you'd probably cover up most damage done during a refret. The tangs are generally the same width regardless of the fret width or crown height. Plus, it depends somewhat on the guy doing the work. If you get a hack who just rips the frets out like bad teeth thinking he'll adjust or compensate later, then a lot more damage will be done and the repairs will be obvious. The slower you go, the easier it is to either prevent or reset tear-outs so they don't show up. Of course, time is money, so...

 

[s1player]

Well, chips and tearouts from removing frets start from the tang, so as I mentioned earlier, with a fret that wide you'd probably cover up most damage done during a refret. The tangs are generally the same width regardless of the fret width or crown height. Plus, it depends somewhat on the guy doing the work. If you get a hack who just rips the frets out like bad teeth thinking he'll adjust or compensate later, then a lot more damage will be done and the repairs will be obvious. The slower you go, the easier it is to either prevent or reset tear-outs so they don't show up. Of course, time is money, so...

Thanks, Cagey. I trust the guy doing the initial fret job - he does good work. Plus, he'll be the one doing any future refrets - so he knows he will have to live with the results of his own work. Added incentive.

Just got his feedback and his thoughts are much the same - choose whatever wood I want. Not a huge difference either way.