Carved Top Options ?

[stratamania]

I'm just curious what folks opinions are on carved tops, solid versus double laminates.

What do y'all think ?

 

[bagman67]

Well, they used to be there - but I think material costs/lumber scarcity have pushed Warmoth to double-lam only.  My carved top Tele, Quty Pie, was a unique choice full-thickness top, but somewhere in the last couple years they withdrew that option.  I don't see a substantial likelihood of Warmoth reversing that decision.  I understand the reasons for it, and moroever, I don't happen to thing there's a real difference in tone that's likely to accrue if you go full-thickness vs. double-laminate.


My opinion, and worth what you paid for it.

 

[stratamania]

@Bagman67, thanks for your input and value often exceeds the cost

I doubt there's much difference in tone either way, just more from a choice / cost perspective. 

In terms of scarcity I can understand that with Koa, for example and black ebony. But maple isn't that scarce or is it ?

Of course curly maple or quilted can't be grown on demand so using the figured stuff in thinner sizes for tops will of course make it go further.

In terms of the double lams, it would be interesting to know more about the construction technique. I'm supposing the base laminate to be thicker and shaped and then the figured laminate to be probably vacuum pressed to it.

 

[TBurst Std]

My VIP is a carved top. That allowed them to do the neat recessed controls. I need to get that guitar finished.

 

[aarontunes]

The decision was made to move all carved tops to DL tops for a couple of reasons. First, premium and exotic woods in the thicknesses required to do traditional carved tops are become scarce. Yes, even maple. Second, DL Tops allow us to continue offering carved top bodies at a price people will pay.

There is no difference in tone from full carved tops to DL tops, and they do have one advantage: the bookmatching is almost always more symmetrical.

 

[Surf n Music n Ski n Bike]

The only reason I voted for having the option at a price is because I have always liked having the natural or vintage tint accent stripe. It is the only drawback I see to the double lame. Something about seeing that nautral flame poking through on a beautiful top does it for me.

 

[aarontunes]

The only reason I voted for having the option at a price is because I have always liked having the natural or vintage tint accent stripe. It is the only drawback I see to the double lame. Something about seeing that nautral flame poking through on a beautiful top does it for me.

Now be honest...did you do that on purpose?  :glasses9:

 

[stratamania]

@ double A, thanks for the information. It makes sense if the economics and supply and demand don't make it viable.

@Tburst Std, the VIP is partly what set me thinking about this. Recessed controls, is this possible with a double lam top ?

@Surf n Music,  that could be a new band or something.
Double Lame Flame.  :icon_jokercolor:

 

[Surf n Music n Ski n Bike]

The only reason I voted for having the option at a price is because I have always liked having the natural or vintage tint accent stripe. It is the only drawback I see to the double lame. Something about seeing that nautral flame poking through on a beautiful top does it for me.

Now be honest...did you do that on purpose?  :glasses9:

Hahah gotta admit it looks great. Although I found a beautiful black korina with with a black accent line that was so amazing I bout it. It can look great either way. You are right on the book matching it makes it look perfect at times  :icon_biggrin:

 

[Surf n Music n Ski n Bike]

Oh hahah sorry double lame. Didn't even cath it with it in bold. Swear it was a typo and not a dig. I was trying to shorten the word. I guess just lam will do and there is no e there anyway.  :doh:

 

[Surf n Music n Ski n Bike]

@Surf n Music,  that could be a new band or something.
Double Lame Flame.  :icon_jokercolor:

Got everyone's attention with that one. Could be on to something here  :toothy11:

 

[aarontunes]

@ double A, thanks for the information. It makes sense if the economics and supply and demand don't make it viable.

@Tburst Std, the VIP is partly what set me thinking about this. Recessed controls, is this possible with a double lam top ?

@Surf n Music,  that could be a new band or something.
Double Lame Flame.  :icon_jokercolor:

Nope. We have removed all the pictures on the website with the recessed controls.

 

[Cagey]

The only reason I can see for solid figured tops is the recessed controls, so without those I'm good with the double lams.

I do like the appearance of recessed controls, though. It would be nice to have the option. But, I suspect for what it would cost it wouldn't sell.

 

[Gemcutter]

I like the solid tops because that allows the option for a carved top with no binding, or to go with a PRS style masked binding. The double lam requires binding in all cases. IMO, for my taste, binding is just not right for models like the VIP. I was once considering a carved top Tele, but again, the binding is required and I simply didn't want the binding so I passed on it. My vote was to pay extra for the solid top.

 

[stratamania]

@doubleA, thanks I thought I could no longer find a recessed control option.

@Cagey, it's the recessed controls that got me thinking about this. For the rest it would not be a problem I think. Unless as gemcutter points out that he prefers natural masked binding.

@Gemcutter, Yes I suppose even if folks are willing to pay extra for something, if the cost of those types of raw materials is getting scarcer and more expensive what would that cost be and how much would it add seems to be the determining factor.

 

[Fat Pete]

Always worth keeping an eye on the showcase where these rules don't always apply.

Quite a few at the moment with 'full thickness' tops, like this crazy Mooncaster:



There are a few Royales (without cheese), VIPs and a Regal with maple tops and masked binding.

 

[aarontunes]

@doubleA, thanks I thought I could no longer find a recessed control option.

@Cagey, it's the recessed controls that got me thinking about this. For the rest it would not be a problem I think. Unless as gemcutter points out that he prefers natural masked binding.

@Gemcutter, Yes I suppose even if folks are willing to pay extra for something, if the cost of those types of raw materials is getting scarcer and more expensive what would that cost be and how much would it add seems to be the determining factor.

You also have to think about the market Warmoth is trying to serve. A legacy company that builds complete set-neck, carved-top guitars may be able to add 20% to the price of their instruments, and still attract buyers. The price people are willing to pay for a carved-top body that is equal in quality - but a bolt-on replacement part - is lower.

 

[aarontunes]

Always worth keeping an eye on the showcase where these rules don't always apply.

Quite a few at the moment with 'full thickness' tops, like this crazy Mooncaster:



There are a few Royales (without cheese), VIPs and a Regal with maple tops and masked binding.

The Showcase is the Wild Wild West. Y'all never know what yer gonna find in them parts.

 

[Gemcutter]

True enough, a quick look at the showcase finds several carved tops (some with beautiful figured woods) with no binding. HOWEVER - there are NO unfinished carved tops with figured woods that are sans binding. I'm just guessing, but I suspect that the available finished bodies without binding (solid rather than double lam) have been around a while and are not indicative of the unfinished bodies that can be purchased today (double lam only). As the Custom Builder states - "Binding is required on Double Lam Tops to cover the seams."

I feel a little like I'm griping, but that's not it. Warmoth will determine whether it makes business sense for them to offer the product. I'd prefer the solid top so that I'm not required to have the binding. Sure, there are a few finished products that still exist, but my desire is to finish them myself. The double lam really limits the choices for the do-it-ourselfers. For me, I simply can't consider building something like a figured VIP with a binding. It's like wearing sneakers with a suit - they're each okay, but not meant to go together.

Speaking for myself, I'm comfortable with the concept of paying an up-charge as long as it's within reason (which, of course, is highly subjective.)  Warmoth will ultimately decide if it's worth it to pursue.