Any scalloped fingerboard players here?

[DustyCat]

How are the slides?

I would say my LP is my blues/rock guitar (for tone) but the frets are so low (and wimpy) and can be hard to bend.

So I got a scalloped neck (so comfortable) but I haven't matched it up to a body yet, and now I am wondering if sliding on a scalloped fingerboard is not going to be as greasy/smooth (I don't see BB King or Slash or Warren Haynes for that matter playing scalloped fingerboards  :dontknow:

Thanks in advance.
-DC

 

[line6man]

I don't see BB King or Slash or Warren Haynes for that matter playing scalloped fingerboards  :dontknow:

How many people do you see playing scalloped boards? They are not very common.

 

[Updown]

How many people do you see playing scalloped boards? They are not very common.

:icon_scratch: I think Ritchie Blackmore used a scalloped fingerboard, at some stage.

Only person I can think of.

 

[line6man]

How many people do you see playing scalloped boards? They are not very common.

:icon_scratch: I think Ritchie Blackmore used a scalloped fingerboard, at some stage.

Only person I can think of.

And Yngwie.

Steve Vai and Billy Sheehan, as well.

 

[swarfrat]

John McLaughlin.

I really want to try it. Even though I can't say even one of its poster children appeals to me. You'd think it would be a bigger deal to the Robert Cray/SRV/JLV crowd than the Yngvie crowd (are there even enough Yngvie fans to call it a crowd)

I called every store in a 60 mile radius trying to find any guitar with a scalloped fingerboard. Usually I had to explain what it meant. Often they tried to argue with me when I explained what it meant.  I called GC in one of the biggest towns in the state (not expecting to find a fount of knowledge, but they do have a huge inventory and I figured they'd have some of the signature models.)

At GC I asked someone, "Do you have any Ritchie Blackmore or Yngvie Malmsteen Strats." The reply I got was "Uh what kind of products are those?" I just said "I don't think you're going to be able to help me", and hung up.

In the end, Warmoth doesn't offer it on 24.75 scale guitars and I decided that was a critical defining feature of this guitar. But I was also reluctant to spend $300 without ever touching one. Even if it was available,  it would make my neck that much more difficult to sell should I decide I didn't like it.

 

[stubhead]

I have one and love it. It's on what I consider my #1 guitar, in that no matter which one I start playing or writing on, by the end of the day I am playing it. The slides are just the same, you simply have to spend the time on it to get used to it. Put it this way - the reason you see so few people playing one is because so few people ever put in the effort to tame one. What you never, ever see is someone who's played on a scalloped board for a few years go backwards*, to an unscalloped one.

My next neck is going to be a 24-fret 24.75" Warhead, and I'll have to scallop it myself. It's a pity that Warmoth is so parsimonious about which necks they'll do. There are a few tricky points - you absolutely have to pay close attention to the state of the fret ends, or they'll eat you; and it takes a while to find the exact string gauges and brands it prefers, even moreso that ordinary guitars. Which is how I see it - there are ordinary guitars, the brand doesn't matter if it's competantly-matched and assembled- and there are scalloped-neck ones.

*(Except John McLaughlin, but his best playing has been on the scalloped neck, IMO. The 1999-2000 Remember Shakti band was a force unto itself.)

http://tela.sugarmegs.org/_asxtela/JohnMcLaughlinAndRememberShakti2000-11-10ChicagoTheatreIL.asx

 

[swarfrat]

The reason for the limited availability is that its a manual jig. I actually started writing a parametric routine to do any scale length, any range of frets up to 24, out of the goodness of my heart (because I want one!!!) But had way too many knowns about their machine capabilities.

Hint, if you use a lookup table for the 2^(n/12) spacing you can use arc interpolation for much of the rest. With an 8mm ballnose or round insert on a slitting saw you can get between the 23rd and 24th fret on a 24.75" scale neck with 1mm either side for the fret slot.

 

[stubhead]

I have a fat round file and a skinny round file and piles of sandpaper, and I'll probably have the neck for several months before I can get the body due to my fricking tooth & the necessary expense, dealt with in other writings somewhere. And Warmoth, and pretty much all of the external scallopers advertizing on the web, sure do take out a lot of wood, way more that is necessary for your finger to float. You don't need to SQUEEZE the damn thing, you just need to lose the wood and float entirely on frets. My Warmoth ebony board (quartersawn maple boatneck +6100s) looks to be a 1/8" scallop all the way across, and you really don't need but half that, and you really don't need hardly any on the bass side, I'm not aware of anybody who plays .008s - .038s and squeezes them so hard the bass strings touch - though surely there must be some Angus Young disciples who have got all the leaping and grimacing down, but one can surmise that the scallops would result is some terrible discordancies in that context anyway.

I will say, I can definitely get strings that are too light*, and every time I changed gauges or brands I have to get re-accustomed to playing in tune. I've never been a big squeezer though, there are people (yes, bassists are people too(!)) who can ruin their (nickel) frets with a single set of Rotosound rounds, and others who can play the same frets for 10 or 15 years.

*(though showoff asshats like J. McLaughlin and R. Blackmore and Y. Malmsteen go out of their WAY to play perfectly in tune, all up and down and all across the neck, scalloped, with 8 - 38s.  :icon_scratch: Jerks.)

 

[DustyCat]

Thanks everyone for the helpful advice.

@Stubhead, "Parsimonious!" Ha! Ha! What are we in 4th grade vocabulary class? J/k lol  :laughing7:
Mr. Scott Tarulli, a guitar teacher of mine used to always mention that certain players, Keith Jarrett, Herbie Hancock, Jimmy Herring never repeat themselves, meaning they have covered so much ground musically that they are able to create endlessly, and your mind will lapse before you hear a similar phrase or lick.

I am small potatoes  :guitaristgif: and currently sitting on my duff on these message boards. But one thing that has kept me playing over the last 16 years is having a set of guitars that are each unique in function, with few overlaps. Just think what sets the boundaries between each type of guitar, Strat vs. LP vs. Thinline vs. 12-String Acoustic vs. Classical without considering all the different pickup upgrades, Floyd Rose trem vs. Stop Tailpiece etc. Much the same as a luthier's set of tools I would imagine. I would reccomend this idea  :sign13: to anyone btw.

Combine that with an "animal/creature/airplane" theme and now I have some ideas about finding a match for my new scalloped baby (a first that I am really excited about). Your answer pretty much reinforced the hunch I had about sliding and thus put my mind at ease on this leap of faith I took last year. "No player who plays scalloped goes back to unscalloped. "That's game Hendrix!" :icon_thumright:

I was more of a Rhoads/Wylde  arty07:disciple than Angus when I was younger, (althout I do like his beefy  :laughing7: *tone* and phrasing) and am still paying for bad technique. My guitar teacher at the time was more Grateful Dead. The "Squeeze of Death" may work for those first few sets of 16note triplets at the end of the solo "No More Tears", but not when they accelerate and launch into 32nd notes, and by then you will probably be out of gas for the take off bend at the end and in rehab. :icon_tongue:

That's why I can't wait to put her together!  :headbang:
Except I don't think Warmoth offers what I have in mind if they are going to be so "parsimonious" about scalloping. Pity...cause they do such amazing work too... :icon_thumright:
                                                                                           

                                                  :sad:

 

[erogenousjones17]

Squeeze of death? Right here. Can't play fast worth a tinker's damn because of it. So no scallops for me (unless, of course, they're wrapped in bacon and lightly sauted), though I've often been curious to try. And none of the poster children appeal to me either. 

Seriously, anyone got any tips on loosening the old death grip? Sorry in advance for the potential hijack.  :evil4:

 

[stubhead]

There's a pretty good exercise in just fingering a note with your index finger and just start lifting it off till it stops sounding. Just a dull thud against your fingertip... then add the pressure back on, just until it sounds clean ONLY. The the middle finger - etc. -  then the ring, then play a few licks where you're "thudding" more than sounding, and keep AT IT every day at least a few minutes into practice. Just adding barely enough pressure to fret the note... I don't usually advocate exercises that sound like crap, but this is one.

That's actually eventually supposed to lead into a technique of left-hand-only muting.  A lot of the old fat-body jazz guitarists* can do it, and mandolinists too - they wouldn't know a "rock 'n' roll" right hand palm mute from nowhere, they can change the volume and tone of individual notes within a chord with left-hand adjustments. And the right hand floats entirely, anchored only by the forearm on the lower bout. In my observation (and personal experience) that technique usually comes about in an "Ah-Hah!" moment after several years of real practice instead. BUT- that's still a perfect exercise to loosen up, it will make everything else a lot easier soon enough. You're probably picking really hard with a medium pick too, right? Get a heavy pick, and try the same thing, go from soft to hard to soft again.

*(them and their guitars, yup.)

 

[swarfrat]

Losening the death grip was one of the things I hoped to accomplish by going scalloped. Granted you still need to learn to do that, so nothings stopping me from learning it now.

The other thing is lowering the action. I tend to play heavy (or 'regular') gauge strings with higher than average action. Partly because I like the sound & feel of heavier strings and partly because the action needs to be high enough to get under to bend. Scalloping takes care of the latter, so I theorize you can still play heavier strings with lower action and a lighter touch (and also less intonation changes in the first few frets.)

But I also have ambitions learn P4 tuning, and switch over 100% dedicated to it. But I seem to lack the dedication and my love of open position ringing chords through cranked amps lures me back. So scalloping could wind up being an expensive experiment. I have doubts even that trying it in the store is a fair shake.

 

[erogenousjones17]

Hard picking, yes. But thick picks (the black 1mm Dunlop's are my pick of choice).

Compounding the problem, I suspect, is the fact that I actually prefer smaller frets (which are more forgiving if you squeeze the life out of a chord) and higher action (for bending, as mentioned above, and for the sound). Combine that with higher gauge strings (damned if they don't just sound better), and my guitars tend to be a little hard to play, as any of my guitar-playing friends will tell you.

I have, however, been making a conscious effort to loosen up in general, so we'll see if it'll carry over to the guitar.  :laughing7:

 

[DustyCat]

Personally, I would reccomend a metronome and slower tempos (bpm) to aim for "frictionless" fluidity of motion. But then again, this is contrary to Mr. Shawn Lane's advice of"just go for it" and I also prefer Dunlop Tortex Red.

And look how I ended up!  :glasses9:

http://m.youtube.com/index?desktop_uri=%2F&gl=US#/watch?v=_-l2QBbJ3E8

 

[TonyFlyingSquirrel]

When I was using a scalloped fingerboard, I had a nicer Squier Strat neck that I did it to. 
It does require a lighter touch.  Fortunately for me, at the same time I had started using Frank Gambale's Video "Speed Picking" which helped me to re-learn my entire technique.  Eventually, I can get along fine with a fingerboard that has larger frets.  6100's are still my favorite, preferably in S.S.  As long as my fingers don't touch the surface of the fingerboard, I'm fine, and I play with .10's. 

A good setup, with low action is also very helpful.  This will minimize the need for more effort to push down on the string to fret it, and as far as bending is concerned, you've got plenty of space to get underneath & beside the string to push it sideways.

I think if I were to go for a scalloped fingerboard nowadays though, I'd likely only do the 21st through the 24th frets on a SS6100 equipped neck, just my own personal preference.

 

[DustyCat]

I think if I were to go for a scalloped fingerboard nowadays though, I'd likely only do the 21st through the 24th frets on a SS6100 equipped neck, just my own personal preference.

Im curious. Why would you only scallop a neck from the 21st through the 24th frets?

 

[swarfrat]

Fear of commitment?

 

[stubhead]

Why would you only scallop a neck from the 21st through the 24th frets?

Because Herman LI does it, and anything Herman does is, like beyond tubular, dude - it's spherical... who wouldn't want to sound like this?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ywxm6zLEjFY&ob=av2e

 

[DustyCat]

@Stubhead
I'll take "Guitar Players I don't not want to sound like" for $100 please.

 

[Cagey]

Is it just me, or does that whole thing sound unnaturally sped up? You can easily compress or expand digital audio files temporally without affecting their frequency, and I suspect that's been done with that piece. There are even some visual cues, where the movement seems to defy human ability. Notably, the guitar at :56 and 1:10, and probably more further in but I can't stand to watch the whole thing. Very brief shots, so you gotta watch close or you'll miss it. In fact, throughout most of the video, there are very few shots of anybody playing that last more than a couple hundred milliseconds because I think it would be way too obvious what's going on. The whole thing seems like a test clip you'd use to provoke somebody suspected of epilepsy into having a seizure.