wizard neck relief

[fdesalvo]

Just trying to wrap my mind around it.  As a guy who loved physics in school, it's quite interesting.  If there is no fretboard left beneath the strings, how can we presume the radius is continuing to flatten as it reaches a termination point with X radius?  You are basically off of the "cone", right?  Shouldn't the radius be calculated  by taking the difference in radius between the last fret and the saddles into account?  Now, call me crazy; this may be the 100mg of dipehydramine I'm currently on.  :icon_biggrin:

LMAO re the "corner" comment! If the tuning is done on open strings, then the only two radii in contention would be that of the nut and bridge!

If the last fret is 16" and the saddle radius is set to 16", then I would imagine you have a 16" straight radius from that last fret to the bridge, correct?

This would mean that the strings changed radius steadily until the 22nd fret, and then somehow stayed at the same radius until the bridge. That would mean that when you tuned up your guitar, the strings would have a corner in them above the 22nd fret!

 

[Patrick from Davis]

Just trying to wrap my mind around it.  As a guy who loved physics in school, it's quite interesting.  If there is no fretboard left beneath the strings, how can we presume the radius is continuing to flatten as it reaches a termination point with X radius?  You are basically off of the "cone", right?  Shouldn't the radius be calculated  by taking the difference in radius between the last fret and the saddles into account?  Now, call me crazy; this may be the 100mg of dipehydramine I'm currently on.  :icon_biggrin:

LMAO re the "corner" comment! If the tuning is done on open strings, then the only two radii in contention would be that of the nut and bridge!

If the last fret is 16" and the saddle radius is set to 16", then I would imagine you have a 16" straight radius from that last fret to the bridge, correct?

This would mean that the strings changed radius steadily until the 22nd fret, and then somehow stayed at the same radius until the bridge. That would mean that when you tuned up your guitar, the strings would have a corner in them above the 22nd fret!

You are almost there.  The fret board is part of the the surface of one cone.  The strings represent part of a surface of another one, but longer.  So the radius at the last fret is not the flattest section of the strings cone. That would be the bridge, where the bottom of the strings cone would extend to.  The sections of the cones that the strings and fret board both occupy, one on top of another, should be identical just shifted in one direction for string height.  In both cases the cones tip would have been cut off at the nut or the 10 or 12 inch radius.  I can't remember off hand what it is.
Patrick

 

[SustainerPlayer]

A little read about it here:

http://www.stewmac.com/freeinfo/Neck_relief,_building_and_repair/a-compoundradius.html

 

[Cagey]

You need to think of it as a long, narrow cone that runs from a point to a 37" diameter base. At a point down from the top of the cone where the diameter is 20", if you took out a strip 1 3/4" wide that ran from there to the base, you'd have a strip that has a 10" radius at one end and a 18.5" radius at the other. Now, don't think of that as the fretboard, think of it as the string path. The fretboard only runs for part of that length - roughly 19" for a 25.5" scale length starting from the 10" radius end.

Edit: the StewMac explanation is much clearer than mine.

 

[ezas]

Any particular reason you went with 20" radius? You don't say but I'm assuming its a Warmoth 10"-16".

two reasons:

1.  i have a set of stew-mac gauges, and only 16 or 20 to help with a 10-16 compound neck. i've tried 16 & 20 and 20 suits me a bit better - currently. 

2. as patrick mentioned, that conical shape grows a bit from the 22nd fret to the bridge. i think, but don't quote me, actual math might bring it closer to ~18.5 close to the bridge on my strat but i don't have a 18 gauge.

i use the 16 or 20 as  a starting point and once in awhile make mini-tweaks. its more for how the pick feels in my hand when strumming but the gauges help in a general way after i get the lo-E & hi-E set to a height i feel ok with.

well, that is my uneducated reason for doing it. for me its still a "feel" thing after using the gauge.  but my nerves are weird anyways in what they perceive from hitting or stroking the strings.

Sounds about right, I was just  curious since I knew from reading here the continuation of the 'cone' was ~18.5" at the bridge.

I went ahead and made my own 18" gauge (over the string) and used that to set my initial radius. But over time I found I like my two E/e's a little lower but I leave the middle 4 strings at the radius I got with the gauge I made and that feels about right to me.

 

[ocguy106]

Just trying to wrap my mind around it.  As a guy who loved physics in school, it's quite interesting.  If there is no fretboard left beneath the strings, how can we presume the radius is continuing to flatten as it reaches a termination point with X radius?  You are basically off of the "cone", right?  Shouldn't the radius be calculated  by taking the difference in radius between the last fret and the saddles into account?  Now, call me crazy; this may be the 100mg of dipehydramine I'm currently on.  :icon_biggrin:

LMAO re the "corner" comment! If the tuning is done on open strings, then the only two radii in contention would be that of the nut and bridge!

If the last fret is 16" and the saddle radius is set to 16", then I would imagine you have a 16" straight radius from that last fret to the bridge, correct?

This would mean that the strings changed radius steadily until the 22nd fret, and then somehow stayed at the same radius until the bridge. That would mean that when you tuned up your guitar, the strings would have a corner in them above the 22nd fret!

you can alter the "cone" created by the strings with the bridge you are completely correct. But in what you really want is for the "cone of the strings to match the "cone" of the fret board. It doesn't matter that the fret board ends you could continue the radius of the cone it creates out to infinity.

 

[Smpl9]

obviously not, a bit embarrassed to admit.  ok, so i found the instructions and wrench. didn't dawn on me since other strat necks didn't have this but this being me first 'wizard type' neck...

well, guess i owe an apology to those who answered.  sorry bout that!

You do realize that wizard is the profile of the neck and has nothing to do with the side adjustment. The side adjusment is avalible on all of thier neck profiles. The side adjustment is a function of the Warmoth Pro necks

Ken

i realize its the profile of the neck, sure. didn't realize they offer it on all their necks, no.

 

[Smpl9]

Any particular reason you went with 20" radius? You don't say but I'm assuming its a Warmoth 10"-16".

two reasons:

1.  i have a set of stew-mac gauges, and only 16 or 20 to help with a 10-16 compound neck. i've tried 16 & 20 and 20 suits me a bit better - currently. 

2. as patrick mentioned, that conical shape grows a bit from the 22nd fret to the bridge. i think, but don't quote me, actual math might bring it closer to ~18.5 close to the bridge on my strat but i don't have a 18 gauge.

i use the 16 or 20 as  a starting point and once in awhile make mini-tweaks. its more for how the pick feels in my hand when strumming but the gauges help in a general way after i get the lo-E & hi-E set to a height i feel ok with.

well, that is my uneducated reason for doing it. for me its still a "feel" thing after using the gauge.  but my nerves are weird anyways in what they perceive from hitting or stroking the strings.

Sounds about right, I was just  curious since I knew from reading here the continuation of the 'cone' was ~18.5" at the bridge.

I went ahead and made my own 18" gauge (over the string) and used that to set my initial radius. But over time I found I like my two E/e's a little lower but I leave the middle 4 strings at the radius I got with the gauge I made and that feels about right to me.

same way of setting it myself.  so far, works well for me.