Wilkinson tremolo set up

[mullyman]

Ok, my first build, more than a year ago, has a Wilkinson tremolo on it. Since the day I got it I can not keep it in tune when I use the bar. On my guitar I got the Wilkinson trem, carbon nut, and schaller locking tuners as suggested by Warmoth's page. They said that you can't go out of tune with it like that. Well, guess what, I haven't been able to get it to stay in tune. I even went so far as to have the nut changed to bone this past week. I'm still getting the same problem. Now, with that said, I never did set the intonation on the individual strings. I'm not currently in a band so doing that has never been a priority to this point. Could this be why the thing won't stay in tune when I use the bar? What's happening is my 3rd and 6th strings go sharp. If I do a little bending they go back into place. I was thinking that they were getting caught in the nut somehow so I had my guy work on my carbon nut. He filed out the slots and put oil in there but it didn't change a thing. I went like that for this past year and then last week I decided to just change the entire nut. Got it back last night, same problem.

One other thing, I have mine sitting flat on the guitar body. I've seen photos of people's trems where they had the front of the trem raised a little and angled slightly backwards.

Any information you guys could give me would be greatly appreciated. I'm not really looking forward to messing with setting the intonation. What a tedious pain in the backside time that will be. Mainly because I don't have the workspace here other than the kitchen table. hehe!!
MULLY

 

[tfarny]

Send a good close up pick of your nut. If only two strings are going out and not the rest, 99% its the nut and your guy isn't filing the slots out enough. You are dive bombing and the strings are getting stuck when returining to tune, and bending is pulling the strings back through those tight little slots and back into tune. I'll bet if you pull up hard on your trem, or give a big old bend, the strings go flat, and pushing down behind the nut solves that problem. Try it - am I right? Only possibility then is your guy doesn't know how to cut a nut. Also - you sent in your guitar for a new nut, and your guy didn't even set your intonation for you? Not cool.

I went through all of this with my second warmoth, took it to two different shops. They took my money but didn't even really try and get my guitar right. Eventually I bought the Erlewine book, some files and bone blanks and started doing it myself - now my guitars all stay in tune just great.

The strings should almost just be resting on the top, less than 1/2 of the string diameter should be in the nut, and the slots should be noticabley wider than the strings.

 

[mullyman]

Well, the thing you describe is exactly what I've been thinking for a year now, that the string is getting pinched in the nut. I don't know about you, but I don't like getting pinched in the nuts. But that's a different subject all together. hehe!!

Yeah, it was like that with my first nut, I had it filed out and oiled, didn't fix it. Took it to another shop and had it looked it, the guy said if he filed any more I'd get that sitar buzz out of it so he didn't want to file anymore out of it. I finally just gave up and went with a new nut. Still getting the same exact problem with the new nut.

I just took a look at this new nut. The strings are more than halfway in. They don't look too tight for the strings though. I could be wrong. Since the nut is new, just picked it up last night, I should give it a few weeks to get worn in.

The reason I usually go to this guy is because he's one of the few, no, he's the only, person around here that is actually certified to work on guitars. He is certified by ESP. I've seen a lot of his work and have always been impressed with it. 

I know nothing about nut work though so his work on nuts could suck.
MULLY

 

[back2thefutre]

I wasn't staying in tune until I found out that with locking tuners you have to tune down to pitch, not up like on regular tuners.  Also with any tremolo, after you whammy you have to give the bar a shimmy for it to go back in tune. Hope that helps

 

[NLD09]

the strings seem pretty deep in the slot to me, but somebody else could probably tell you more than me. Are there string trees?

 

[mullyman]

the strings seem pretty deep in the slot to me, but somebody else could probably tell you more than me. Are there string trees?

Yeah, I have one on the1st and 2nd strings.
MULLY

 

[mullyman]

I wasn't staying in tune until I found out that with locking tuners you have to tune down to pitch, not up like on regular tuners.  Also with any tremolo, after you whammy you have to give the bar a shimmy for it to go back in tune. Hope that helps

Didn't know about the tuning down to pitch. Will definitely give that one a shot.
MULLY

 

[zogoibi]

Your nut slots should be no deeper than 1/2 the strings diameter;  from Erlewine's excellent book.  All your strings are buried entirely in their slots. 

 

[mullyman]

Your nut slots should be no deeper than 1/2 the strings diameter;  from Erlewine's excellent book.  All your strings are buried entirely in their slots. 

Nice one. I have that book on order from Amazon. Should be here within the next millennium or so. If I go for another nut I'll definitely keep this one in mind.
MULLY

 

[TBurst Std]

Your nut slots should be no deeper than 1/2 the strings diameter;  from Erlewine's excellent book.  All your strings are buried entirely in their slots. 

Thats what I am thinking

 

[Knarz]

My Strat has a Gotoh Wilkison VS100 with Planet Waves tuners/graphtech nut and I was amazed at not only how well intonated ( didn't have to adjust it) and in-pitch it was the day I installed it, but how well it stays in tune.  As a bluesy player I don't abuse the bar much like I did back in the 80's and 90's but last night I was in a great mood and dive bombed the piss out of it. Still in tune.

For what it's worth may I suggest you check your tuners by loosening the nuts/screws and then re-align and tightening them back up; restring your axe, etc.  You could also move the tuners to another position to see if the problem follows the tuner.

Peace :headbang: