True Bypass

[dmraco]

Anyone ever modded a pedal to be true bypass?  I am looking to pick up a Jerry Cantrell Wah.  The only issue it is not a true bypass switch.  It has a hardwire bypass but keeps the board in the loop the entire time.....

Thanks

 

[bagman67]

I have not done this, but something to consider when you insist on "true bypass" is that your cable runs could effectively become much longer when your pedal  is bypassed, thus affecting your tone considerably (which may be good, or may be bad, depending on your desired result). 

Consider:  suppose you run a 15 foot guitar cord to pedal  to another 15 foot guitar cable, for example.  A buffered pedal will maintain signal strength going into the second cable thus overcoming the doubled cable length's increased resistance, while simultaneously (possibly) coloring your signal in ways you find undesirable.  A "true bypass" pedal allows an un-colored signal to hit your amp, but through the effectively doubled cable load. 

I know there are technical defects in my description here, but I would suggest that "true bypass" is perhaps not the panacea it's made out to be, at least for live application where pronounced changes in signal strength could really screw with your sound guy's attempts to maintain a good house mix, and could also screw with your desire to hear yourself on stage.

Anyway, I know I answered a question you didn't ask, but that's because I'm a nerdy know-it-all who only really knows enough to make himself dangerous.  I know I can count on the electrical engineers to straighten out my garbled discussion of what's happening here.  Cagey?  Anyone?  Bueller?

Peace -

Bagman

 

[dmraco]

I think you are correct...the issue is what colors your tone more...the cable or the circut board.

 

[Velcro]

I reccommend a ratio of 3:1 true bypass:buffer

 

[Volitions Advocate]

I modded my Classic Crybaby Wah.

I put in the true bypass switch and got rid of the buffer section as well.

Thread here: http://www.unofficialwarmoth.com/index.php?topic=5559.0

 

[dmraco]

Thanks.  I may contact you for help.  I need to crack the back of this puppy 1st.

 

[dNA]

Bagman's right on a point that a lot of people don't look into. There's a logical reason not all pedals are built with true-bypass in them. It's usually a simple enough mod to do with most pedals. But like he said, you're losing that buffered connection. It wouldn't be a good idea to have a bunch of pedals all in sequence with true bypass in em.

To avoid making a modification to your pedal that you're unsure about, it's extremely easy to build a basic true-bypass loop switch. It's basically like having an effects loop in your chain. This way you can see how having true-bypass on this one (or any one) pedal will affect your sound before you go ahead and irreversibly reduce the pedal's resale value. Then if you really want to, you can install the true bypass mod internally and use your loop for another pedal. This'll especially be useful if you have a pedal who's housing is too small to make the mod internal.

 

[Patrick from Davis]

True bypass is not such a problem until you reach 50 or so feet of cord.  FET Flip flop (what most pedals have) is not that big of a deal until you run 4 or so in a row.  As noted above, the true bypass is a cord length issue and over 50 feet is where the issue shows its coloring problems.  The FET Flip flop switch has your signal run through at least two transistors at all times, so after four pedals your signal has been through 8 transistors (at least 8, and they are cheapo's as well) which color your sound as well.  Damned if you do, damned if you don't.  Personally, I do not have very long cords, so I lean towards true bypass.  Then again, I use maybe one pedal most of the times.  The curse of buying a good amp.

On a side note, wah pedals traditionally have been pedals of much head scratching.  The true bypass kits for crybaby's have a very good rep because they cure some of the odd things those pedal do to your signal path, on or off.
Patrick

 

[dmraco]

True bypass is not such a problem until you reach 50 or so feet of cord.  FET Flip flop (what most pedals have) is not that big of a deal until you run 4 or so in a row.  As noted above, the true bypass is a cord length issue and over 50 feet is where the issue shows its coloring problems.  The FET Flip flop switch has your signal run through at least two transistors at all times, so after four pedals your signal has been through 8 transistors (at least 8, and they are cheapo's as well) which color your sound as well.  Damned if you do, damned if you don't.  Personally, I do not have very long cords, so I lean towards true bypass.  Then again, I use maybe one pedal most of the times.  The curse of buying a good amp.

On a side note, wah pedals traditionally have been pedals of much head scratching.  The true bypass kits for crybaby's have a very good rep because they cure some of the odd things those pedal do to your signal path, on or off.
Patrick

I am interested in making this bypass switch...just to see if I even need to make the mod like you say.  I am looking at only a Wah, OD, and possibly a delay in the run.  That's it.

Thesis really a hot topic.  The web is full of opinions on moding wah pedals. Not so much an issue with other types.

 

[yyz2112]

A hardwire bypass is another word for true bypass, just a matter of where the bypass physically sits in the pedal. It can't be hardwire bypass and still have the board in circuit constantly, kind of an oxymoron.

 

[swarfrat]

http://geofex.com/article_folders/millenium/millen.htm

 

[Super Turbo Deluxe Custom]

For the reasons listed, aren't most effects loops buffered?  If so, any signal drop by adding a true bypass should be covered by the effects loop buffer, correct? If using an effects loop and an effect with no true bypass, is it double buffered?

 

[Alfang]

Yeh I was gonna say, a hardwire bypass is a bypass, how can they call it hardwired, if it is not?

 

[Super Turbo Deluxe Custom]

One could always plug directly into an A/B switch placing a Y connector at the amp.  Hitting the A/B switch would true bypass any or all effects depending where it was in the chain

 

[dNA]

One could always plug directly into an A/B switch placing a Y connector at the amp.  Hitting the A/B switch would true bypass any or all effects depending where it was in the chain

that'd essentially be the same thing as what I said using a slightly different layout

 

[dmraco]

A hardwire bypass is another word for true bypass, just a matter of where the bypass physically sits in the pedal. It can't be hardwire bypass and still have the board in circuit constantly, kind of an oxymoron.

Dunlop seems to differentiate the two.  They have a true bypass that actually switches the input and output, and the hardwire which only switches the output. The spend a lot of detail discussing this on their blog.

 

[dmraco]

check these guys out...they make some cool stuff.  you also have the option to save $50-60 bucks and build it yourself...Thats A LOT of soddering!

http://www.roadrageprogear.com/compact_true_bypass.html

 

[Super Turbo Deluxe Custom]

Those kick butt.

 

[yyz2112]

A hardwire bypass is another word for true bypass, just a matter of where the bypass physically sits in the pedal. It can't be hardwire bypass and still have the board in circuit constantly, kind of an oxymoron.

Dunlop seems to differentiate the two.  They have a true bypass that actually switches the input and output, and the hardwire which only switches the output. The spend a lot of detail discussing this on their blog.

I think it's a bit of salesmanship razzle-dazzle...bypass is either true bypass or buffered.

 

[dmraco]

Those kick butt.

are you speaking from experience?