top vs core?

[Tofu]

Alright, so, just to throw a bit of background your way: I am pretty new to the scene and I'm working on learning bass.  I want to build a bass and i have been trying to find all the information i can, but i cant seem to grasp the basics, eceryone here seems to be on a different level...(im just a drummer lol)..
ive been looking through the bass builder and other bass builds, but still i have some questions:

i understand that wood is a huge part of every bit of what makes a guitar's sound, but how does the top affect the sound of guitar? is it at all as important as the core wood?

same with a neck, what does having a solid wood neck do for the sound when compared to a neck that has a seperate fingerboard? does the wood react differently if its a different kind?

my main concern is that i want a really nice sounding bass but i also want it to look a certain way, but i dont want to sacrifice beauty if i dont have to, i love the look of some wood...but...some the wood that sounds great doesnt look quite as nice all the time.... :help:

 

[Kaoskadosk]

As far as I've come to understand, virtually everything on your guitar/bass will change your tone in some manor. I haven't really had time to experiment and can't say for sure how much, but I like to take things with a grain of salt. When things like pickups, amplifiers, effects and all that come into play I can't testify for sure how much the characteristics of the wood actually come into play. Some people say they can't notice a difference, some say it's like night and day.

So, to answer your questions;
No, the top is not nearly as important as the body wood. It does affect the tone, but it's more of a hint of a change than something outright different.

As far as I know, a solid wood neck won't give you anything special apart from having the whole neck in the same wood giving the same type of tone. What most people do when buying a neck they might want a warm neck, but not too warm. Like a Mahogany neck with an Ebony fretboard. The Mahogany gives a warm tone and the Ebony adds some treble to that to even out the sound.

I'd say don't bother absolutely too much about woods and all that, most of it can be fixed afterwards with EQ's and amps and you'll most likely not hear any major difference when playing in a band, especially live.

 

[kboman]

The general wisdom on this board, based on the experience of many members, is that the piece of wood which makes the greatest difference is the neck. Things like bridge type and materials, neck scale length, hollow/chambered/solid body construction and above all the pickups will have greater impact. This is not to say that body wood doesn't matter, only that other things matter more.

I'm sure that other builders with more extensive experience than me will fill in with whatever I may have missed/misunderstood

 

[baskruit]

From my (limited) experience, wood does matter but don't skimp on the electronics because that will make or break the end result.

 

[Kaoskadosk]

From my (limited) experience, wood does matter but don't skimp on the electronics because that will make or break the end result.

The chain is only as strong as it's weakest link.

 

[Death by Uberschall]

From my (limited) experience, wood does matter but don't skimp on the electronics because that will make or break the end result.

The chain is only as strong as it's weakest link.

This ^^^

 

[Tofu]

well i havent quite gotten as far as to even electonics, but what exactly makes good electronics?

i would assume that the most important part is the actual... well grounded electronic parts  :laughing11: but is there any rule of thumb about the wire gague? Which brands should i look into for electronics and which brands should i steer clear of?

 

[Patrick]

well i havent quite gotten as far as to even electonics, but what exactly makes good electronics?

i would assume that the most important part is the actual... well grounded electronic parts  :laughing11: but is there any rule of thumb about the wire gague? Which brands should i look into for electronics and which brands should i steer clear of?

it depends on your budget. some people may suggest some great boutique pickups that go for $200+ or others may suggest some great pickups that go for $120

 

[baskruit]

From my (limited) experience, wood does matter but don't skimp on the electronics because that will make or break the end result.

The chain is only as strong as it's weakest link.

That's quite a cliche. True, but still...

 

[line6man]

well i havent quite gotten as far as to even electonics, but what exactly makes good electronics?

i would assume that the most important part is the actual... well grounded electronic parts  :laughing11: but is there any rule of thumb about the wire gague? Which brands should i look into for electronics and which brands should i steer clear of?

Wire gauge really doesn't matter. 22 gauge stranded copper wire is standard for guitar applications.

Different gauges will have slightly different parasitic inductances, but it's very slight and shouldn't have any effect on anything.
Also, shielded wire will have a much greater parasitic capacitance than single leads, which for all practical purposes could be said to have no capacitance, as the amount of space between conductors is great.

 

[Dan025]

well i havent quite gotten as far as to even electonics, but what exactly makes good electronics?

i would assume that the most important part is the actual... well grounded electronic parts  :laughing11: but is there any rule of thumb about the wire gague? Which brands should i look into for electronics and which brands should i steer clear of?

i wouldnt pay for the boutique stuff for pickups just get some seymour duncans and call it good.

cts is like the standard for pots, there are better out there but i wouldnt go any cheaper. i have used expensive pots from bourns with conductive plastic film as the resistor but i may have over heated them as one is scratchy when you turn it, they have plastic housings so they dont disipate the heat very fast. there are also clarostat which also use the high quality conductive plastic but are all stainless steel military spec pots, hard to find you need to get them from a company that reproduces soldano amps. you cant solder to these housings either and the bourns feel smoother as they use brass shafts and bushings not stainless steel. but all that high quality is not needed i like pots from presision they are sealed constructed similar to clarostat buy with brass bushings and im guessing tin housings so they can be soldered to, the resistive material is carbon. i get them through digi-key and they can be bought in +/- 10% tolerence which is better than cts with +/-20%. 

for caps don't use electrolytic or ceramic. metalized film or teflon are great from a number of electronic suppliers, even radio shack. the boutique stuff is sometimes very nice maybe better but i would stay away from the old oil in paper caps and if you want to pay extra for something good id get the orange drops, not that i think you'll hear the difference from a cap at radio shack

wires are almost irrelevant. you can get sheilded cable or wire it like a fender guitar with stranded single conductors, for as short as the wires will be it wont matter. some people use the twisted pair concept used in cat 5 cable and it works well for noise rejection and i find easier to work with two separate conductors than shielded cable

according to bill lawrence the best shielding material is aluminum, i just use aluminum tape that comes on a roll but aluminum foil from the kitchen and spray adhesive works good too. this may be why fender uses aluminum under the pick guard. i tend not to question the genius of bill lawrence.

on a google search for pots i found this http://www.potentiometers.com/?gclid=CIP53YCB4qICFcl25Qod7TEJxw

they have pots similar to everything that i described but no brand names.

 

[Tofu]

:headbang:

thank you dan. That was a mindblowing educational experience.  i wasnt aware that so many options were out there...thank you for that! i'm not quite sure what most of that stuff means...(=/-10, etc...) BUT! I will check all this out, you've set me on the right track, i hope  :hello2:

 

[line6man]

for caps don't use electrolytic or ceramic.

Electrolytic caps can't be used for a low pass filter application, but there is nothing wrong with ceramics.

Ceramic capacitors are notorious for their poor tolerances, so the difference some people claim to hear is due to drastic variations in the actual capacitance, which can stray heavily from the rated capacitance.

At this voltage and current, I'm not concerned with leakage, ESR, ESL, etc.
It's too insignificant to make any difference.

 

[Dan025]

:headbang:

thank you dan. That was a mindblowing educational experience. i wasnt aware that so many options were out there...thank you for that! i'm not quite sure what most of that stuff means...(=/-10, etc...) BUT! I will check all this out, you've set me on the right track, i hope :hello2:

that's just the tolerance, a 250k at +/-20% can be 200k-300k (20% being 50k and it can go in either direction)so depending on how you look at the numbers it is a 50% or 33% overall range and that's quite a bit. +/-10% is 225-275k so that's either 22% or 18% depending on how you look at it. much better. there is a company but i cant remember the link that sells cts pots that are measured and guaranteed to be +/-7% but i still think precision makes a better pot.

but the truth behind all of this is that the vast majority of the pots are actually much closer than the tolerance suggests but they wont be rejected at qc unless they fall outside the specified range, they might not do a 100% check do to mass numbers and the range may be setup loose so that there is a reasonably high chance of them all falling with in it. all the pots that i have measured were within 5-10%

 

[Tofu]

Good to know..it makes a lot more sense reading this that reading offf the internet....thanks!

 

[jay4321]

I'm going to suggest that maybe your first foray into this not be a Warmoth build. These are more for folks who know what they want already after trying a bunch of stock models. You could try 30 basses out in stores, find one that works for you, and after it settles on you a bit you'll definitely get a handle on what your likes/dislikes are. More than that you'll get a feel for different woods and other things, we can describe them all day but that's not worth a whole lot to you compared to hearing them.

 

[jackthehack]

It would help if you could describe what kind of a bass sound(s) you want to get?

The wood used for a laminate top on a bass or guitar makes no consequential difference to the tone whatsoever. I've only built a few basses, but near as I can tell by ear the body wood used doesn't make a hell of a lot of difference, other than using a relatively light body, i.e., less dense wood of whatever species tends to make for more resonance/boom which may or may not be what you're looking for.

Pickups/electronics DO make a lot of difference as to tone.

Give us some data as to what kind of sound you'd like to try to get and we can be more helpful/suggestive as how to get there.