Suggestion for next build

[Stew]

Hi all,

I've decided to wait on building a Les Paul as I'm not sure whether to go with the 59 roundback (which I love on my strat) or to go fatback.

To help make a decision I decided I build a tele and try a fatback on that. I've played teles with baseball bat necks before and for some reason it just feels right on a tele.

I'm going to go with a showcase swamp ash body and was looking to get people's thoughts on neck woods. I like the idea of getting something that is tonally similar to rosewood on maple. It'll be 25.5 scale length, 1-11/16 width and probably 6115 stainless frets. Most likely Bill Lawrence pickups again (I hear the tele ones are plenty bright).

I'm confident I'd be happy with Rosewood or Canary on Canary but I like the idea of each Warmoth I build being unique so would like to do something different to Canary this time. What do you folks think about a Wenge fretboard on either a Bloodwood or Padouk back? I think either of those combos would look pretty cool on a black/red/yellow body.

Interested in people experience with Bloodwood and Padouk necks ... what they feel like and how they sound. I've read the Warmoth summary but would like real-world user experiences.

Do you think Bloodwood or Padouk would be too heavy in fatback contour for a 4lb body? Don't want no divin' neck!

Appreciate all thoughts or any other suggestions. 
:rock-on:

 

[tfarny]

You are going to build a custom tele just to try out the fatback and pick a neck contour for a future build? Doctor, I think we've got a severe case over here...

 

[Stew]

You are going to build a custom tele just to try out the fatback and pick a neck contour for a future build? Doctor, I think we've got a severe case over here...

:icon_biggrin:

I know ... sounds mad. But by the time I'd ordered my first Warmoth I'd already decided that if it was as good as I expected it to be then there would be three other builds I'd want to do—Les Paul, Tele and Short Scale Bass. I just thought I'd be building the LP first.

As it turns out I thought it would be a good way to try out the fatback to see how it would suit the LP. So there is some method to my madness.  :laughing7:

 

[Stew]

OK, in an attempt to open this up to some more opinions, allow me to pose the following questions:

1. How does wood density relate to weight? I've been reading that padouk is in the same ballpark as hard maple density wise, whereas bloodwood is way higher ... in the same league as ebony! I realise that weight varies with each piece of wood but am wondering if padouk is similar in weight to maple?

2. What is Warmoth's satin nitro finish like? I played an American Standard Strat recently that had a very matt finish on it's maple neck ... almost like no finish. Is Warmoth's satin nitro similar?

3. Depending on the answer to Q2, should I just get a maple fatback from the showcase and get it finished in satin nitro instead of getting an exotic that potentially makes the guitar neck heavy? Of course I can get maple in vintage standard too which I imagine would be lighter than the pro?

Bottom line is I wanna try a fatback, I very much like my raw canary strat neck (my only Warmoth so far) and I don't wanna end up with a neck heavy guitar.

OK, go at it ...

 

[crash]

I can only reply to your 1st question.  Padauk is heavy!  I have a Padauk tele that weighs 7 pounds.  That is the body alone, no hardware or electronics, no neck.  I don't know exactly what an all maple tele would weigh, but I would guess in the same ballpark as mine.

 

[AutoBat]

2. It's so unnoticable Warmoth puts a red dot on the heel because they get so many calls from people thinking that there isn't any finish on it.

 

[Stew]

2. It's so unnoticable Warmoth puts a red dot on the heel because they get so many calls from people thinking that there isn't any finish on it.

Hmmm ... maybe I should just go the easy option then? Maple neck on a swamp ash tele is obviously a pretty good combo ... there's enough of them around :icon_biggrin:

Almost a shame to do it though if I can get something exotic for the same money ... so confused  :icon_scratch:

Any other thoughts ... anyone ... ?

 

[Cagey]

There are some charts you can review to find out different things about the characteristics of wood. For instance, this one will tell you relative hardness. This chart lists out densities. As you can see by the last chart, density certainly affects weight, so that answers that question. Other charts exist to show compression strength, bending strength, elasticity, and so on. Google is your friend if those things concern you.

I'm sure those are either mean or average values, because wood does vary. Even from the same tree, you can get wildly different results. Swamp ash is a good example. The wood you get from the bottom 8' or so of the tree is very light, while the rest of the tree is relatively heavy. A short trip through Warmoth's body showcase will make that obvious. Two identical bodies made out of the same wood will have as much as a pound and half of difference between them, and they may have come from the same tree. So, saying you have a swamp ash body doesn't mean much. It may be a light resonant piece, or a heavy dead piece, acoustically speaking.

Neck woods don't usually vary as much, but the same reality exists: No two necks are the same, no matter how hard you try. So, even though they're of the same species wood, there's a difference, and then there may be minuscule differences in fret slot tension that makes the thing want to bend or not at assembly that are compensated for with the truss rod, so the thing's looser or tighter than it's littermates. Then there's grain orientation. None of these things are really quantifiable, so...

Long story short, most of these things really only matter to acoustic guitar makers, since those guitars rely almost entirely on body vibrations to make their sound. Electric guitars rely mainly on the pickups. Not that the wood is irrelevant because it will affect how the strings vibrate, but it doesn't have as nearly as much influence as the fanatics would have you believe. The nice thing about exotic woods is... they're exotic woods. They look and feel nicer in most cases than the common woods the major manufacturers use. They're also more expensive, so you don't see them very often. So, if you want an instrument that's also a functional piece of art and feels like a million bucks and you don't want to see somebody wearing the same guitar you are, then Warmoth is your huckleberry. If you want radically different tonal response, then talk to Seymour Duncan, Dimarzio, Bill Lawrence, Lindy Fralin, Lollar, et al.

 

[Stew]

The nice thing about exotic woods is... they're exotic woods. They look and feel nicer in most cases than the common woods the major manufacturers use. They're also more expensive, so you don't see them very often. So, if you want an instrument that's also a functional piece of art and feels like a million bucks and you don't want to see somebody wearing the same guitar you are, then Warmoth is your huckleberry. If you want radically different tonal response, then talk to Seymour Duncan, Dimarzio, Bill Lawrence, Lindy Fralin, Lollar, et al.

... and that's the thing Cagey ... I like the exotic woods, I like the idea of having a guitar that's unique (well maybe not around these parts but unique in the wider world), I like the idea of a neck that feels really great to play. I'm just worried that going with the fatback option with an exotic is going to be too heavy (particularly with Pro construction) and therefore compromise the playability, which at then end of the day is a huge consideration.

There must be others out there with exotic fatbacks ... ARE they too heavy or am I just worrying about nothing?

 

[Cagey]

This is a Tele-style guitar we're talking about, right? Have you ever heard of a neck-heavy Tele? I haven't. Same with Strats. The way they're designed, you could put a solid ebony neck on them and not suffer neck dive. Gibson is the one who sacrifices practicality for design aesthetics. Mr. Fender, on the other hand, was nothing if not practical. If we were talking about shoes, Gibson makes high heels and Fender makes oxfords. One looks good but makes you suffer for it, the other just the opposite.

 

[Stew]

This is a Tele-style guitar we're talking about, right? Have you ever heard of a neck-heavy Tele? I haven't. Same with Strats. The way they're designed, you could put a solid ebony neck on them and not suffer neck dive. Gibson is the one who sacrifices practicality for design aesthetics. Mr. Fender, on the other hand, was nothing if not practical. If we were talking about shoes, Gibson makes high heels and Fender makes oxfords. One looks good but makes you suffer for it, the other just the opposite.

Wow, all these years I've been wearing high heels  :icon_biggrin:
Time to get me another pair o' them exotic loafers  ... Thanks for talkin' me down Cagey :icon_thumright:

 

[tfarny]

Teles can be slightly neck heavy, they are certainly not as balanced as a strat. It's all about the strap button. I had to change the tuners on one of my teles because it was in fact slightly neck heavy - it had a pro construction '59 rosewood / ebony neck on an extra light (under 4 lb) body. It wasn't terrible but definitely bugged me. Shaving a few ounces of weight by replacing the tuners fixed the issue. I also briefly had a baritone tele that was neck heavy. My bari strat is well balanced in contrast.

 

[B3Guy]

May I just throw this out there like the shameless lover of Pau I am? Pau-Ferro????

 

[Cagey]

I'm with you. All necks should be pau ferro. With ebony 'boards. And stainless frets. The world would be a much better place.

 

[Alfang]

We get lots of these type of threads, people asking for suggestions for " the next build" My reply will continue to be, keep building more and more till YOU find what you like.

I still say you could buy the cheapest plain white body that W sells, put the cheapest W neck on it, put some good pups and little better than average hardware on it, and you could end up with the best guitar in the world.
I don't think many here would disagree with that. Oh and a good setup of course.

 

[Cagey]

Crocker: Just build it out of standard stuff. Nobody'll notice.
Tubbs: You got that shit right, man, that's the clean trute!​

Y'know, my current favorite guitar is exactly what you describe. "Screamin' Deal" special alpine white Strat off Warmoth's showcase, and Gordon Food Service pickups. The neck is off-book - ebony over pau ferro with SS frets, but it wasn't terribly expensive. All in all, a damn nice guitar that sounds and plays great.

 

[B3Guy]

what??!! ebony on Pau?! Heresy! Sacreligion!  :icon_jokercolor:

Pau-ferro necks only deserve one fretboard wood . . . Pau ferro.

 

[Cagey]

what??!! ebony on Pau?! Heresy! Sacreligion!  :icon_jokercolor:

You spelled "sex" wrong. You got the "S" right, but lost it after that and just started guessing <grin>

 

[Stew]

Mmmm ... Pau's an option ... It's bright right? Would put me in the region of maple? What fretboard?

I can dig it Alfang. That's what I was thinkin with trying good ol' rosewood on maple ... It's a Warmoth ... With a good setup it's gonna sound great. But I think I'll still go raw exotic  :icon_thumright:

Currently leaning toward wenge on padouk with a sunburst body ... Although pau on pau with Lake Placid Blue would be pretty nice too ... Ahhh decision ...  :icon_scratch:    :icon_biggrin:

 

[B3Guy]

pau is nothing like my abs . . . that is to say, it's rock hard, and smooooooth.