Seymour Duncan Zephyr Pickups

[Doughboy]

Yes....got to be careful!  I think I started with a humbucker set, then single coils (both for strats), and then afterwards bought my last set for the tele.  If you are familiar with the SD 69's and SSL-1's......you may agree that the SSL-1's are more "clear"....noticeably clear.  This is not for everyone.  The Zeph single coils are maybe another full step up in that direction.

While on the topic, if Zephs are not part of the list, in your experience what would be the most clear/HD......somewhat vintage sounding single coils made?  Thanks!

I've found that pickups sound different in each guitar. Something that's clear in one may not sound as clear in another. The best vintage sounding single coils I've ever tried were in a 2014 model 1954 strat reissue. There were 3 of these at the store. 2 were just okay. The 3rd sounded amazing. All were made from the same materials with the same hardware.

For noiseless single coils that still sound vintagey, I love the Dimarzio Area 57.

For actual single coils with the nasty 60 cycle hum, I really like the Fender Texas special or the Time Machine 60s.

The Shur ML pickup is pretty great as well, as are the Raw Vintage pickups by Xotic. I happened on these 2 when I bought a Suhr & an Xotic guitar that came equipped with them. The Xotics REALLY sound vintagey, clear & chimmy.

 

[bagman67]

While on the topic, if Zephs are not part of the list, in your experience what would be the most clear/HD......somewhat vintage sounding single coils made?  Thanks!

I've really liked the Eric Johnson set in his signature Strat - but you can't get them direct from Fender or its distributors.  You have to go to one of the online cannibalizers.  I bought a loaded EJ pick guard from the Sratosphere that I'm installing in a body I've had sitting around waiting for me to make time to finish it.  Looking forward to finally having a conventional Strat in the arsenal again (albeit a far cry from the vintage-modified EJ model).

 

[sixstringsamurai]

Once again... IMO,

 

[stratamania]

I can understand that some may think a more expensive part is not for them or doesn't live up to the hype. But what I can't understand is the need to keep making the same point with pictures.

 

[ScottOlson]

I certainly wouldn't blame anyone for taking a look at the price of the Zephyr pickups and going "What the...." This is one instance where a pickup was created based on a challenge issued to our VP of Engineering to not respect the usual consideration of price. Usually, that's a pretty major consideration with materials because the majority of musicians have very finite budgets for gear so you want to don't tend to go out of your way to find the absolute most expensive but highest fidelity materials. It wasn't really thought out as marketing to people with a whole bunch of money, rather just a way to make something different with silver that has a lower DC resistance than copper - resulting in tons of detail and powerful harmonics, especially in that upper/midrange + treble frequencies. If it was thought through the lens of marketing, it's likely we'd have said it would be too much work for such a tiny market but the challenge was there and engineers/new products folks love something that excites them personally.

It's certainly not snake oil, it's very love them or don't. I know people who absolutely swear by them and won't get anything else - and others who find them too snappy and bright.

 

[Cagey]

Welcome to the board, Scott! I'm sure I speak for everyone when I say we'd value your input as a spokesman for a manufacturer many of us support.

As for the Zephyrs, I suspect you'd sell a helluva lot more of the things if they were priced differently. If the tonal characteristics of the things are that great, why not try to attract some business? I mean, Lollar, Kinman, Bareknuckle, et al have managed to pull in a percentage even at their price points. I'd think you guys could stomp them with little trouble, given your marketing machine.

But, where those things are, you've limited yourself to the stratosphere. They cost more than many guitars. Even in the DIY market, where many are willing to go the extra yardage to get exactly what they want you're going to have trouble justifying the things.

 

[stratamania]

Hi Scott,  welcome to the forum. One thing with the Zephyrs I was wondering about is does it make a difference on how they are wired in terms of to the pots and output jack or does copper suffice ?

Cagey, has a point if there was a price point where if sufficient units sold could bring the price in an easier range more of us might take a look.

I really like the Noiseless Tele vintage stacks I put in a tele build recently.

 

[ScottOlson]

Welcome to the board, Scott! I'm sure I speak for everyone when I say we'd value your input as a spokesman for a manufacturer many of us support.

As for the Zephyrs, I suspect you'd sell a helluva lot more of the things if they were priced differently. If the tonal characteristics of the things are that great, why not try to attract some business? I mean, Lollar, Kinman, Bareknuckle, et al have managed to pull in a percentage even at their price points. I'd think you guys could stomp them with little trouble, given your marketing machine.

But, where those things are, you've limited yourself to the stratosphere. They cost more than many guitars. Even in the DIY market, where many are willing to go the extra yardage to get exactly what they want you're going to have trouble justifying the things.

Hey buddy, thanks for the warm welcome! I totally agree that a lower price would be way more competitive. Unfortunately the silver is really that expensive. We got close to getting a lower price for Zephyr, did a full review of all the costs and manufacturing and then figured out it was impossible without using less Silver wire. The problem came down to scrap - which is that when we calculated the amount of silver that is lost outside of just that used on the pickup, it became impossible to lower the cost.

There are other possibilities though, we've been really surprised with silver/copper hybrid - it sounds great and keeping one coil copper lowers the cost enough to make it viable for more people.

 

[ScottOlson]

Hi Scott,  welcome to the forum. One thing with the Zephyrs I was wondering about is does it make a difference on how they are wired in terms of to the pots and output jack or does copper suffice ?

Cagey, has a point if there was a price point where if sufficient units sold could bring the price in an easier range more of us might take a look.

I really like the Noiseless Tele vintage stacks I put in a tele build recently.

Hey there stratamania, it shouldn't make a difference as far as I'm aware of from just that short amount of wire. Glad to meet another Tele player - I recently have been trying out the Quarter Pound pickups in a Tele. I was never really a huge fan of higher-output Tele pickups but Rodney Gene changed my mind on them.

 

[bagman67]

Hey there stratamania, it shouldn't make a difference as far as I'm aware of from just that short amount of wire. Glad to meet another Tele player - I recently have been trying out the Quarter Pound pickups in a Tele. I was never really a huge fan of higher-output Tele pickups but Rodney Gene changed my mind on them.

Hi, Scott, and welcome.


I took a flyer on the tapped Quarter Pound Tele Bridge pup and couldn't be happier, and I recommend it to anyone who wants a high-output single coil bridge pup for a Telecaster type guitar.  I find its tapped configuration useful, in that it is a solid-performing conventional pickup when tapped, and then throwing the switch gives you a nice boost - sort of a solo-switch.  I have it installed in my Guitar of the Year winner, seen here in detail. 


http://unofficialwarmoth.com/index.php?topic=18899.0

 

[stratamania]

Thanks Scott, for your reply.

I think you might end up getting a few pickup questions from us going forward.

 

[TonyFlyingSquirrel]

To me, these types of debates all come down to the blindfold test. 
I make the same arguement when it comes to amp modeling, sample playback vs. analogue synthesis, etc...

If we did a blindfold shootout between a GFS AlnicoII, with other pickups ranging all the way up to the Zephyr's, results are going to vary.  At least these results would be void of the pre-assigned prejudice about them, and it would be completely based upon what one heard.

Having said that, if a cork-sniffery attribute of a product psychologically seems to make you play better, then go for it.

My dad was honestly convinced that placing the rattle of a rattlesnake in the sound chamber of an acoustic guitar made it sound loads better.  My response to him was that he got the snake oil without the snake, but oh well, it seemed to give him the inspiration and confidence to play.

 

[Cagey]

If we did a blindfold shootout between a GFS AlnicoII, with other pickups ranging all the way up to the Zephyr's, results are going to vary.  At least these results would be void of the pre-assigned prejudice about them, and it would be completely based upon what one heard.

Right. Even two guitars that are for all intents and purposes identical will sound at least slightly different from each other, sometimes dramatically so. Many players can tell of "the one that got away" that doesn't sound like anything too dramatic by description, but in practice was somehow just "magical". I had a Strat back in the '90s like that. Just a regular ol' Strat with an Alder body, Maple neck w/ Rosewood 'board, stock pups - I wish I still had that thing. It was glorious.

Thing is, we rarely get objective tests of components. Guys will put a set of pickups in one guitar, then another set of pickups in another guitar, and try to compare them. Waste of time. Means nothing. To have any value, you'd have to use a single guitar and replace the pickups as many times as necessary to show the differences. That's a lotta work and a lotta wasted strings.

You'd think that somebody like Guitar Player magazine or Premier Guitar magazine or somebody with a couple shekels to rub together would sponsor that sort of research, kinda like the computer magazines do with processors, operating systems, sounds cards, video cards, etc. Something objective that actually had some probative value to it. But, no. If they test anything at all, they install something and comment on it in isolation, so there's little to learn other than perhaps it's an "Editor's pick".

 

[TonyFlyingSquirrel]

Someone at the Seventstring forum did a shootout where he yanked & packed different pickups in the same guitar, & posted clips of each one, and even then, only the drastically different pickups in output really stood out, some of them you could not tell a difference.

 

[Cagey]

Perhaps that's why it's not done as often as it should be. There are 87 bazillion sources of pickups out there. If it became known that most of them are more the same than they are different, it would piss some people (read: advertisers) off.

 

[TonyFlyingSquirrel]

Perhaps that's why it's not done as often as it should be. There are 87 bazillion sources of pickups out there. If it became known that most of them are more the same than they are different, it would piss some people (read: advertisers) off.

Exactly, which brings us back to Cork Sniffery, aka, bragging rights by name dropping via brand centric prejudice. :glasses9:

 

[drewfx]

Unfortunately when doing objective testing it must to be done double blind and carefully controlled so that the only change is what's being tested.

It's very difficult to do objective testing when you want someone to actually play an instrument. The performances will always be different and even things like a tiny change in volume level destroys the objectivity. And in that case you might as well not bother because then you're just pretending to be objective anyway.

 

[Cagey]

Right. I'm just surprised that the supposed "authorities" on the subject never do it. They let the marketing weenies tell us what's good. Not that I don't appreciate their opinions, but that's all they are and they're often heavily biased. You have to buy it to try it, at which point it becomes "used" and your chances of moving it if it doesn't satisfy aren't good.

 

[Jet-Jaguar]

It's very difficult to do objective testing when you want someone to actually play an instrument. The performances will always be different and even things like a tiny change in volume level destroys the objectivity. And in that case you might as well not bother because then you're just pretending to be objective anyway.

A few years back I was reading about some small-time pickup maker who had actually built a machine to pick strings on a guitar to get the exact same performance over and over. I don't know how well it actually worked, but I could see the reasoning behind the idea.

 

[TonyFlyingSquirrel]

It's very difficult to do objective testing when you want someone to actually play an instrument. The performances will always be different and even things like a tiny change in volume level destroys the objectivity. And in that case you might as well not bother because then you're just pretending to be objective anyway.

A few years back I was reading about some small-time pickup maker who had actually built a machine to pick strings on a guitar to get the exact same performance over and over. I don't know how well it actually worked, but I could see the reasoning behind the idea.

Dimarzio has a similar contraption, but its primary purpose is confirm output in milivolts.