Set up preferences question

[KaiserSoze]

So I'm not a total noob and have been setting up my own instruments for years, but am by no means a pro.  I tend to like low action and wind up doing adjustments frequently to keep fret buzz away.

I've been having a difficult time with my most recent neck moving from one day to the next and have been needing to do adjustments each time I pick it up.  One day, plays fine, next day, buzzy all over.

Short story, took it to a local old guy and when I picked it up, the action was rather high and I noticed the bone nut he replaced mine with was higher as well.  I looked at it and went "wait..."

BUT..  he measured everything out carefully and the action at the 12th is at or near 1mm for each string.  I use 11s and its a gibson-scale neck, just fyi.  Short story is that after playing for an hour to get used to the higher action, I was struck by how much better the guitar sounds, like very noticeably.

So after chasing low action for all these years, was I wrong?  Is there really that much difference?  What do you all think?

 

[erogenousjones17]

I personally like higher action, but only since having a similar epiphany about a year ago. :icon_biggrin:

I also don't mind a bit of fret buzz: given that I tend to wail on my guitars, a little buzz is inevitable. Incidentally, go listen to Thrice's "In Exile" and tell me the tiny bit of buzz that you can hear doesn't sound gorgeous. 

 

[Cagey]

So after chasing low action for all these years, was I wrong?  Is there really that much difference?  What do you all think?

"Wrong" might be too strong a word, but it's true: you want some room for the string to vibrate, or it'll sound a bit dead even if it doesn't buzz.

 

[KaiserSoze]

Thanks for the replies.  and btw, the Roadhouse humbucker I put in the neck not too long ago continues to impress me.  Its hugely versatile and has a really wide variety of tones between the tone and volume controls.  I actually use them a lot now.  Wanted to give Ken props so just sayin'  :icon_thumright:

 

[drewfx]

I think there's a lot of mythology out there that you need certain things like super low action and skinny little necks to play fast. But once you've fretted a note, I don't think a tiny difference in action when playing the next note 2 frets higher is worth sweating too much over. But I'm not a shredder or anything, so YMMV.

 

[Strat Avenger]

I like my "action" no less than 1/16", and no more than 5/64" @ the 12th fret, with minimal neck relief.

 

[swarfrat]

I've played pretty high action for years. Lately ive been dropping the action but with much heavier strings. Ive been shocked at how easy 12's or 13's are to play when the action is set low.  Truss rod is important anyway, but crtitically so when you start trying to get guy wires with a low action setup.

 

[Cagey]

12s or 13s are easier to play when the action is lower, but stretching them is still a bitch. It's like fighting with a cheese cutter.

 

[bagman67]

12s or 13s are easier to play when the action is lower, but stretching them is still a bitch. It's like fighting with a cheese cutter.

<beavis>


heheheheh he said,  "cheese cutter"


</beavis>

We now return you to our regularly scheduled classy programming.

 

[swarfrat]

Actually the 13's was an experiment in trying to get more stability in awkward fingerings, so yeah, flipside of 'harder to bend'. I've found that they're not that difficult to actually move across the fingerboard, it's just that you have to bend them so far that the next three strings over gang up on you. It's a reason why I'm pondering 11-56 w3 for 'normal' playing. But I don't really find it's a liability so much as a modifier. I play differently, and that was kinda the point. I find I'm a lot less likely to fallback on <insert favorite pentatonic cliche>

 

[Cagey]

You can get used to anything - it's a matter of time in grade. Years ago, I played 11s and had no trouble with them. Today? They'd kill me.

 

[swarfrat]

I suppose. I'm just saying it wasn't nearly as big of a deal as I thought it would be. Of course years ago, I dropped my 11's for 10's because I wasn't playing regularly, but i still had really high action and was trying to be Jeff Beck "play no note at the fretted pitch" on a hard tail.

And if you're playing high action because you play with a heavy hand, you might find heavier strings EASIER to play if it allows you to lower the action a bit. I think the biggest mistake most people make when experimenting with string gauges is not paying enough attention to setup. Its not just a matter of reintonate and go. Truss rod, height, then set your intonation once youre happy with the other two. All of which is made needlessly iterative by the preponderance of floating tremolos.

 

[SalsaNChips]

one of the few things I have learned over the years is a lower action is not always better. For example, too low and I can't do double stop bends because I can't get my finger under the string above the one I'm bending because it is so low. And setting my strings so they are all the same height above the frets would never work, the heavier strings always need to be higher, IMO. They need more room to vibrate, lower frequency and all that. I just set the bridge height about where I need it and fiddle with the individual string saddle heights until I hit the right combination of height and playability, AKA, "feel". Then set the 12th fret intonation with an accurate tuner.  Some fret buzz is acceptable to me but not much.

 

[swarfrat]

unless you're tuning down, heavier strings will not be at a lower pitch. The pitch will be the same, the tension higher, and excursion is a combination of picking intensity and tension - more tension = less excursion all else equal.

 

[KaiserSoze]

I like my "action" no less than 1/16", and no more than 5/64" @ the 12th fret, with minimal neck relief.

1/16" is about 1.5mm right?  So I guess my 1mm action at the 12th is not considered high.  Anyway, I do find using the shorter scale neck makes a big difference when using 11s, and since I'm a ham-handed player and finesse-challeged, the heavier strings work for me.

 

[AutoBat]

I like relatively low action but nothing crazy. As long as all the notes can freely ring it's good enough for me.  I play 9-42s on my Eb Strat and 9-46 on my Floyd VIP.